Hawker recurrent

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jason100
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Hawker recurrent

#1 Post by jason100 » Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:53 am

Hi All,

I currently fly a Hawker 800xp which is registered in one of the Caribbean Islands. I fly under FAA certs with a Validation from the Island of Aircraft Registration.

I've noticed that the charges for recurrent training are becoming high, so was wondering about the following.

1. If I obtained a Canadian licence via the bilateral route between the FAA and Transport Canada, my understanding is that my type ratings transfer across too ?

2. Having done the above, can someone explain your system for recurrent training in Canada, i.e. what kind of timeframe and cost would I be looking at for a PIC recurrent or your equivalent ? Also, please can you list any flight training organisations in Canada that offer Hawker recurrents.

I'm just wondering if it's worth doing the above and if it would end up costing the company less if I went the Canadian recurrent route.

Regards

Jason
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wallypilot
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#2 Post by wallypilot » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:18 am

I don't believe that such a strategy would save you any money as you would just have to go an American FTU for your recurrent anyways. I don't believe there any Canadian FTU's that have a hawker sim. I'm not sure what your frequency of recurrent training is on the FAA license, but I am guessing it would be the same on a canadian license, as the requirements are very similar.

We have run into escalating costs as well. My only advice is to shop around. Prices really do vary among FTU's.

Where do you currently train? FSI?
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#3 Post by xsbank » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:23 am

You could have your Hawker rating put on your Canadian license but your recurrent ride would have to be done by someone with TC quals. A 6158 (progressive) won't work for TC.

I doubt if there is anywhere in Canada to do a Hawker.

When you say cost increases, what are you saying? 5%? 20%? Any idea?
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#4 Post by jason100 » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:50 am

Thanks for the replies guys. Current costings for Fsi & Simuflite are very similar, well over $20,000.

It's surprising to me that there are no Hawker sims in Canada. Can you do a recurrent on the Aircraft instead in Canada ? If so, do you know of anywhere to facilitate this & rough idea of cost / timeframe. Also, what are the differences between a Canadian & FAA recurrent ?

Thanks for your help with this
Jason
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#5 Post by wallypilot » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:59 am

The only SIMS in Canada are related to Bombardier (Dash 8, CRJ, BD-700, Challenger Series, etc). I think there are some Embrear sims in Montreal. Other than that, just Turbo Prop sims around. Canada is really not a major player in the BizJet market on a global scale (other than the fact that we manufacture them) but it's a not a huge buyer of bizjets, hence the lack of sims.

I highly doubt you'd find anyone in canada to train you in their aircraft. Doing stall sequences, and single engine work? don't think so.
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#6 Post by xsbank » Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:04 am

The only differences in TC and FAA recurrents are minor - TC stalls are different, TC wants BC approaches (frequently) and TC tends to like more raw data approaches. Except for the stalls, this is inspector-specific to a large degree. Edited to add, an FAA 6158 can be a progressive recurrent, which means you are being checked as you train. This is for Part 91 ops. I don't believe there is a Canadian equivalent to the 6158.

There should be no surprises - a ride should closely follow the syllabus you trained for.
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#7 Post by nimbostratus » Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:48 am

xsbank wrote:The only differences in TC and FAA recurrents are minor - TC stalls are different, TC wants BC approaches (frequently) and TC tends to like more raw data approaches. Except for the stalls, this is inspector-specific to a large degree. Edited to add, an FAA 6158 can be a progressive recurrent, which means you are being checked as you train. This is for Part 91 ops. I don't believe there is a Canadian equivalent to the 6158.

There should be no surprises - a ride should closely follow the syllabus you trained for.
Actually, for corporate operaters in Canada, they tend to do a 6158 check in the simulator, this is then used to document your training requirements for a recurrent PPC usable for CAR 604 operations only.
If your company does any charter work under CAR 704 you will need a full TC approved checkride.
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Re: Hawker recurrent

#8 Post by xsbank » Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:09 am

6158 is FAA.

604 is TC.

If you are Caribbean registered your training will be attached to the license that your Caribbean license was originally attached to. My Bermuda license is attached to my FAA license so I do a 6158 to re-validate my FAA license which then automatically validates my Bermuda license.

I still do a TC ride for my TC ATPL. If the inspector is dual-approved he can do both TC and FAA at one session as long as I do all the maneuvers for both syllabi. ALL of this is done in a Level 4 simulator.

Sorry, even my eyes are starting to glaze over.

By the way, the FAA license is a credit card with Orville and Wilbur on it - Bermuda is a piece of paper like we used to have (sniff). Not like that giant POS that TC gives us. Why can't ICAO standardize a license format? Why do we have idiots running TC?
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