Air Canada Accident in YHZ

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pelmet
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by pelmet »

Old fella wrote:Perhaps it could be that Air Canada has issues/concerns with "Findings for Cause and Contributing Factors" as determined by TSB and both parties want to iron out any differences before public release. I do believe a draft report is sent to the responsible carrier for their review and commentary before going public. Just my thoughts.
I believe that your thoughts are correct Old Fella. But as you can see in the US Asiana case, the NTSB went public with the facts well before any differences between parties were ironed out. A totally different approach than what appears to be the secrecy of what happens in Canada. So it is a mystery what happened in Halifax, even from just a straight publishing of significant FDR data without opinion. In the Asiana case, some 777 pilots were discovering some additional information about their autothrottle system within a few days of the accident and so-called autothrottle "traps' while in the Halifax situation virtually nothing is known.

Without using the exact accident in YHZ as an example as there may not be any critical information....what if an almost exact situation to an accident is repeated and it had already happened a couple of years earlier somewhere else. But the investigating authority was sitting on critical information waiting for back and forth(with appropriate holidays and weekends off) between it and the airline(or other parties) on some particular part of the report as well as a translation a translation. Would the investigating authority be partly responsible?

Accidents don't wait for holidays and weekends to pass by.
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Old fella
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by Old fella »

For sure, Pelmet. The NTSB are more forthcoming in regards to public release in a timely manner, no doubt about that. Even in the major investigations, they release a full transcript of CVR and by reading some of those, it would be unpleasant to actually listen to them in my view. I always wondered what the purpose of that is in a public forum and I am of the opinion our TSB has it right in not doing so. This is just one area but yes I am also sure TSB could streamline their public docket process in other areas as you pointed out. Having said that I find in reading the TSB final reports on major accidents with loss of life, their investigation is quite thorough.
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pelmet
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

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Old fella wrote:For sure, Pelmet. The NTSB are more forthcoming in regards to public release in a timely manner, no doubt about that. Even in the major investigations, they release a full transcript of CVR and by reading some of those, it would be unpleasant to actually listen to them in my view. I always wondered what the purpose of that is in a public forum and I am of the opinion our TSB has it right in not doing so. This is just one area but yes I am also sure TSB could streamline their public docket process in other areas as you pointed out. Having said that I find in reading the TSB final reports on major accidents with loss of life, their investigation is quite thorough.
Unfortunately, I can't go into detail, but I used to be of the same opinion of the last line until an accident happened where I had some significant inside info. Nothing safety wise though, but....someday.
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JL
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by JL »

Opportunity to fix all that is wrong at the TSB; the competition for new Board members closes on the 17th. Get your application in!
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brooks
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by brooks »

Tick tock :rolleyes:

Thank god nobody is shooting the Localizer 05 into YHZ. Better yet give it enough time and nobody will remember Air Canada crashing an Airbus 320 over a year ago.
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flyer 1492
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by flyer 1492 »

Unless you were onboard the 320. :wink:
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altiplano
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by altiplano »

Don't worry brooks...

Give it enough time and you won't remember the chewed food, snotty tissues, and everything else that stuck to you cleaning the seat back.
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by Rookie50 »

I do find it interesting with all the details, how much the Asiana accident was castigated here while this one was called a "hard landing".

Funny how that works. Some are more equal than others, comrade.
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pdw
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by pdw »

The difference is that these volks were near the centre of a normal late-winter storm system around midnight, while the other occurred in morning CAVOK. That said, I'd found the study of their respective weather details informative (suffice to say that looks can be deceiving).
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

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pdw wrote:The difference is that these volks were near the centre of a normal late-winter storm system around midnight, while the other occurred in morning CAVOK. That said, I'd found the study of their respective weather details informative (suffice to say that looks can be deceiving).

So it's all good because of the weather / runway & (crappy) approach choice available? No critique allowed? What's the difference from a BushLeague air crashing in crap weather trying to approach to Lake Whatever? Not like this was unknown for YHZ.It snows there.

I just didn't like the Spin that it seems fine for the AC PR team to put out.
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by Old fella »

brooks wrote:Tick tock :rolleyes:

Thank god nobody is shooting the Localizer 05 into YHZ. Better yet give it enough time and nobody will remember Air Canada crashing an Airbus 320 over a year ago.
Enough time has gone by indeed but ole YHZ.............


http://www.tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-repor ... 5a0161.pdf
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BTD
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by BTD »

Rookie50 wrote:
pdw wrote:The difference is that these volks were near the centre of a normal late-winter storm system around midnight, while the other occurred in morning CAVOK. That said, I'd found the study of their respective weather details informative (suffice to say that looks can be deceiving).

So it's all good because of the weather / runway & (crappy) approach choice available? No critique allowed? What's the difference from a BushLeague air crashing in crap weather trying to approach to Lake Whatever? Not like this was unknown for YHZ.It snows there.

I just didn't like the Spin that it seems fine for the AC PR team to put out.
The difference is that the NTSB releases information as it is verified and within a week or so we knew the jist of what had happened with Asiana.

The tsb is more closed lipped and we don't know much about this occurence, and we won't until the report comes out.
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by Rookie50 »

BTD wrote:
Rookie50 wrote:
pdw wrote:The difference is that these volks were near the centre of a normal late-winter storm system around midnight, while the other occurred in morning CAVOK. That said, I'd found the study of their respective weather details informative (suffice to say that looks can be deceiving).

So it's all good because of the weather / runway & (crappy) approach choice available? No critique allowed? What's the difference from a BushLeague air crashing in crap weather trying to approach to Lake Whatever? Not like this was unknown for YHZ.It snows there.

I just didn't like the Spin that it seems fine for the AC PR team to put out.
The difference is that the NTSB releases information as it is verified and within a week or so we knew the jist of what had happened with Asiana.

The tsb is more closed lipped and we don't know much about this occurence, and we won't until the report comes out.
Ok ---
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tailgunner
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by tailgunner »

BTD is correct. Differing procedures in Canada and the US.
The report will be released when if is released. If there was an imminent threat within Canada discovered during the investigation, it would have been published immediately.
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Sulako
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Re: Air Canada Accident in YHZ

Post by Sulako »

Thread drift cleaned. Let's keep on topic, mmmmkay?
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