Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

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Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Troubleshot »

crazy video that caught the "roll out" too.

http://www.airlive.net/breaking-trigana ... pua-video/
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by FL410 »

Wonder what was going on with the 732 in the video. Looked like it was just sitting there with nose gear in the grass close to the runway.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

Looks close enough to super typhoon Meranti.

Edit:
There's a report out from a year earlier Aug 28 / 2015 of similar left side gear collapse on a 737 blamed on winds .. same airport / direction. Says there pilots aim to be down early ... only about a mile
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Last edited by pdw on Wed Sep 14, 2016 3:46 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by cdnpilot77 »

pdw wrote:Looks close enough to super typhoon Meranti.
Variable tailwinds caused the gear to collapse?
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Inverted2 »

From another forum they are saying there are no instrument approaches into that airport and the ceiling at the time was below 200'.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Gannet167 »

There's an RNAV 15, CAT A and B only, with minimums 1033' AGL.....
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

Aiming to pound down early on the shorter runway often (previous accident report) there is metal fatigue to consider, seeing it's the second occurrance like that in one year.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

FL410 wrote:Wonder what was going on with the 732 in the video. Looked like it was just sitting there with nose gear in the grass close to the runway.
Looks like he was on a taxiway waiting to backtrack and line up - very fortunate they were going straight!

@PDW

Super Typhoon Meranti is at least 1500nm away from this airport (just using difference in latitude x 60).

Metal fatigue?

or

-The usual Indonesian unstabilised approach (Go -around is a loss of face in this culture).
-High Speed
-High rate of descent
-Hard landing (the photos on Avherald appear to show that).
-Gear collapse

Which do you think is more likely?
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by vrefplus5 »

Gannet167, is there a link to the RNAV 15? I'd like to have a look even though I'm sure the 733 is a Cat C. Thank you.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Gannet167 »

This is the only one I can find. 5988' X 98' runway.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

Gannet167 wrote:There's an RNAV 15, CAT A and B only, with minimums 1033' AGL.....
737-300 isn't certified for RNAV (GNSS) approaches.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Donald »

Eric Janson wrote:737-300 isn't certified for RNAV (GNSS) approaches.
You must mean this operator isn't certified for RNAV approaches.

Because both the Classics and Jurassics can be certified for RNAV approaches, at least in Canada.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

Eric Janson wrote:-High Speed
-High rate of descent
-Hard landing (the photos on Avherald appear to show that).
-Gear collapse

Which do you think is more likely?
Ok so .. witness says: slight turn to line up, then some pitch down short final (av herald source); before/at touchdown was seen very nose high. Seems to be a slow airspeed touchdown? Negligeable winds / wx hist Wamena .. although favours reciprocal around 5kts ( GS at beginning of long slideout is touchdown-AS plus 5).

High rate of decent induced only the last 200ft or so (if witness account is accurate)

Extreme nose high during the hard landing .. so that stance tilts longer gearlegs a bit forward (not a straight down force on them then) so they break easier ? NoseWheel touches down after main impact (a light touchdown) so nosegear ok and could be used as steering straight ahead.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

pdw wrote:Seems to be a slow airspeed touchdown?
Have a good look at the video in full screen at high resolution - specifically between 5 and 8 seconds.

Nothing low speed about that or the subsequent slide along the runway!
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

Donald wrote:
Eric Janson wrote:737-300 isn't certified for RNAV (GNSS) approaches.
You must mean this operator isn't certified for RNAV approaches.

Because both the Classics and Jurassics can be certified for RNAV approaches, at least in Canada.
I did some checking and I see you are correct - the 737-300 can be upgraded with GPS receivers and an updated FMC which will give RNAV(GNSS) capability.

The 737-300's that I flew did not have this capability. I don't remember ever flying an overlay type approach - all strictly raw data.

Given the cost of retro-fitting vs. the residual value of the airframe I doubt Trigana Air did any modifications.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

Eric Janson wrote:Nothing low speed about that
No, except does it look a bit faster there than it's really going ? Maybe a bit of an illusion too ...so close to the camera.

Once the eye faces west (at the 5 second mark there on the video) the plane is already sliding for 8 seconds / already down for a few sec before it comes into view behind the other AC .. maybe 2-3 sec before start of the vid.

Say IAS is 62-64m/sec (125kts) the second it's witnessed nosehigh/hard on the threshold (basically stallspeed no ? ); have to add 5 knots there (2-3m/sec) for groundspeed / wx hist Wamena Airport Sept 13/2016 7:30am / rwy 15

Can't see it being more than 50 meters per second there (100kts) once abeam at the 5 second mark. By the 6sec mark: 47m/s, 7sec: 45 m/s, 8sec: 42m/s (80kts) or something close; hope to see a report with some details.

Never seen a slider quite like that ... and where having the moist pavement is such a lucky thing.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

@pdw

Look at the video again. Just above the 737-200 waiting to backtrack.

At 5 seconds you can see the Trigana 737 emerging from the (low) cloud. After that you can see them make a course correction followed by a dive for the runway.
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

When I click on the Video it's not airborne ... just shows sliding
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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by Eric Janson »

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Re: Trigana Air Boeing 737-300F skidded off the runway at Wamena, Papua (video)

Post by pdw »

There it shows the turn with rapid descent initiation from level at MDA (see chart).

At 14 sec there's sudden movement inside cockpit of the crossways plane (shocked pilots) and below workers break into a run to see, which is a reaction to the accident point.

The rapid descent onset is obvious as it comes into view in this video, just like the accident pilots see the rwy come into view out of their windscreen. Arresting an increased descent rate in the nose high flair raises stallspeed. Any onlookers, including the video camera, see only the visual speed not the invisible airspeed which here is less than GS (initial wx-hist check). What would the IAS be ... if descent not arrested at nose-high ?

For GS, the first ~ 8 seconds of slide-out is a total distance of ~ 640 meters, the distance from the threshold to the ramp on which the crossways AC is parked (videos). Figuring out precise airspeed at point-of-accident (on first contact with threshold pavement) is the more difficult calculation ... more info needed.
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