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 Post subject: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:35 pm 
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FAA Confirms Cases Of EMAS Phobia

WASHINGTON—Pilots in some cases appear to be avoiding a special type of crushable concrete designed to gently stop an aircraft from overrunning the end of a runway—a finding that is puzzling to FAA officials.

“Of all the Engineered Material Arresting System (EMAS) saves, there’s a relatively small number where the aircraft curves off to the side,” said James Fee, the FAA’s manager for runway safety, at a recent safety conference sponsored by the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA). “It is somewhat perplexing.”

First installed in 1994, EMAS is now in place at 106 runway ends at 67 airports that do not have the standard 1,000-ft. runway safety area buffer. Seven more pads are slated to be installed at six additional airports. Although tailored for the traffic mix at each airport, the design standard calls for stopping an aircraft traveling 74 kt. when it first enters the pad, which is as wide as the runway and several hundred feet long.

Khalil Kodsi, the manager of the FAA’s airport-engineering division, said there have been 12 EMAS “saves” to date, the most recent being an arrest in Burbank, California, when a Cessna Citation business jet with two pilots on board overran a runway and stopped in the EMAS pad.

The highest profile “arrestment” of late however was in October 2016, when an Eastern Airlines Boeing 737-700 carrying then U.S. vice presidential candidate Mike Pence overran the end of Runway 22 at New York La Guardia Airport. The aircraft only partially clipped the EMAS as the captain—apparently unaware that there was an EMAS pad at the end of the runway—steered the aircraft to the right, ending up in the grass. The NTSB continues to investigate the incident.

In other cases, pilots appear to know about the EMAS—which is designed to prevent damage to an aircraft and injuries to passengers—but are hesitant to use it. In July, a HondaJet on landing veered off the left edge of Runway 31C at Chicago Midway, avoiding the EMAS that had been installed after a deadly Southwest Airlines overrun in 2005. “The HondaJet turned away from the EMAS,” Fee said. “We are seeing that observation.”

Greg Wooley, vice president of flight operations for ExpressJet Airlines, said in many cases, the reasons have to do with publicity. “Probably 50% of the folks that I talk to say that if it’s going to be a low-energy event where they’d be 30–40 kt. at the end of the runway, [they question whether] they should take the EMAS or take it into the dirt,” Wooley said at the ALPA safety forum. “We don’t want to make the news, and there are some folks that think if you take the EMAS you’re making the news for sure.”

Alternatively, pilots think if they “take the dirt,” they might get “tugged back up onto the asphalt” and not make the news, he said. “That’s something that we’ve got to address and emphasize more—doing the right thing should be applauded and not be shamed,” Wooley said. “People have that fear of having the spotlight on them because they’ve gotten themselves into that situation.”

Fee said the Pence overrun makes it clear that choosing the dirt is no guarantee of anonymity. “That’s probably the most significant (EMAS arrest) and the one that breaks the myth that if you go off into the grass you won’t be in the news,” he said.

Wooley said Expressjet provides pilots with training materials on EMAS in initial, recurring and transition training. However he noted from his visits with pilots that “there is a reluctance to use the [EMAS] and not as much familiarity with it as there needs to be.” He said more needs to be done to encourage pilots to include the existence of an EMAS in their departure and arrival briefings.

The FAA is preparing to test new EMAS markings as a tactical alert to pilots. The yellow markings on the runway—labeled “EMAS” with black chevrons pointing to the pad—will be located 500 ft. ahead of the EMAS. “We will test [the signage] and get feedback,” said Kodsi. “We think it will provide more situational awareness to pilots, but we can’t test how pilots will react during an actual runway incursion.”

http://aviationweek.com/commercial-avia ... becb5c6682



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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:55 pm 
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Location: location, location, is what matters
Let's see how much confidence you will have at 100KTS and a highway full of cars at the end.

But hey, maybe I'm just chicken................

Guess you ave proven your point.


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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:05 pm 
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confusedalot wrote:
Let's see how much confidence you will have at 100KTS and a highway full of cars at the end.

But hey, maybe I'm just chicken................

Guess you ave proven your point.


Sorry, now I am confusedalot.....with what logic your statement could possibly have.



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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:58 pm 
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Could always be worse.




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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:12 pm 
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Location: location, location, is what matters
pelmet wrote:
confusedalot wrote:
Let's see how much confidence you will have at 100KTS and a highway full of cars at the end.

But hey, maybe I'm just chicken................

Guess you ave proven your point.


Sorry, now I am confusedalot.....with what logic your statement could possibly have.


In a perfect world, with perfect humans, nothing would happen anyway. So, in an imperfect world, with imperfect humans, I could see how a human would make the split second unlogical (that's not really a word) decision to avoid a whole approach light array and take their chances in the grass. Approach light mountings are not frangible.

But what does it matter, you proved your point. Be steely eyed and trust everything, you won't hit the steel structures no matter what. :roll:


_________________
Attempting to understand the world. I have not succeeded.

veni, vidi,...... vici non fecit.

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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:10 pm 
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confusedalot wrote:
pelmet wrote:
confusedalot wrote:
Let's see how much confidence you will have at 100KTS and a highway full of cars at the end.

But hey, maybe I'm just chicken................

Guess you ave proven your point.


Sorry, now I am confusedalot.....with what logic your statement could possibly have.


In a perfect world, with perfect humans, nothing would happen anyway. So, in an imperfect world, with imperfect humans, I could see how a human would make the split second unlogical (that's not really a word) decision to avoid a whole approach light array and take their chances in the grass. Approach light mountings are not frangible.

But what does it matter, you proved your point. Be steely eyed and trust everything, you won't hit the steel structures no matter what. :roll:


You seem like a real weirdo and now I know why you have your namesake. I didn't have any point to prove, I simply posted an article that I found interesting for others to read without any addition opinion and you respond with your bizarre statements.

Go somewhere else please so serious professionals can discuss.



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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:35 am 
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The article didn't mention approach lighting which could be the reason pilots pick the grass and nothing to do with getting their name in the paper


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 Post subject: Re: EMAS phobia
PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:52 am 
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There are some interesting comments by pilots at the end of the article as to possible reasons why this might happen.


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