Westwind

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FlyGy
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Re: Westwind

Post by FlyGy »

Makes perfect business sense. Pat sells TWA for a nice price to WEW, WEW goes broke, Pat buys back his airline and WEW assets for pennies on the dollar and resumes serving the North with no competition in sight.
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leftoftrack
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Re: Westwind

Post by leftoftrack »

He didn't buy it. They hired him for a new position. He was already employed by them as the accountable executive at TWA after he sold to WW
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FlyGy
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Re: Westwind

Post by FlyGy »

I know he didn't buy it......yet. I was just looking into my crystal ball.
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madjones
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Re: Westwind

Post by madjones »

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leftoftrack
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Re: Westwind

Post by leftoftrack »

That use to be called Jewish lightning, not sure what the non offensive term is for it these days
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7ECA
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Re: Westwind

Post by 7ECA »

leftoftrack wrote: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:47 pm That use to be called Jewish lightning, not sure what the non offensive term is for it these days
Interchangeable with "financial combustion". If done well, there shouldn't be a thing left for investigators to investigate - just a dustpan full of ash.
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FlyGy
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Re: Westwind

Post by FlyGy »

I hope this guy wasn't in the hangar, it seems like such a "happy" little plane.
5983902 Photo 718179.jpg
5983902 Photo 718179.jpg (110.42 KiB) Viewed 4893 times
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North Shore
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Re: Westwind

Post by North Shore »

leftoftrack wrote: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:47 pm That use to be called Jewish lightning, not sure what the non offensive term is for it these days
Pretty sure that the correct term - all along - has been 'arson'... :roll:
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schnitzel2k3
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Re: Westwind

Post by schnitzel2k3 »

North Shore wrote: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:09 pm
leftoftrack wrote: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:47 pm That use to be called Jewish lightning, not sure what the non offensive term is for it these days
Pretty sure that the correct term - all along - has been 'arson'... :roll:
Lol.
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bobcaygeon
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Re: Westwind

Post by bobcaygeon »

FlyGy wrote: Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:20 pm I hope this guy wasn't in the hangar, it seems like such a "happy" little plane.
5983902 Photo 718179.jpg
I hope it was. It was a tired bird 23 years ago when I flew it.

I believe a Saab, Twin Otter, King Air, and a couple of helicopters were in the hangar.
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FlyGy
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Re: Westwind

Post by FlyGy »

bobcaygeon wrote: Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:35 am
FlyGy wrote: Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:20 pm I hope this guy wasn't in the hangar, it seems like such a "happy" little plane.
5983902 Photo 718179.jpg
I hope it was. It was a tired bird 23 years ago when I flew it.

I believe a Saab, Twin Otter, King Air, and a couple of helicopters were in the hangar.
Ouch...a SAAB too? Ahh well, Once the insurance pays out I know where there are some ATR-42s that will probably be available at bargain basement prices soon.
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JL
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Re: Westwind

Post by JL »

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schnitzel2k3
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Re: Westwind

Post by schnitzel2k3 »

Somehow I don't think a spray bottle, a 30' ladder and a warming pad are going to entice any flight crew to de-ice and should never have counted as 704 / 705 de-icing equipment.

S
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7ECA
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Re: Westwind

Post by 7ECA »

schnitzel2k3 wrote: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:32 am Somehow I don't think a spray bottle, a 30' ladder and a warming pad are going to entice any flight crew to de-ice and should never have counted as 704 / 705 de-icing equipment.

S
Looks like they've got (at best) a 12' fibreglass and a 6' fibreglass ladder.
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Zaibatsu
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Re: Westwind

Post by Zaibatsu »

It was after one particularly miserable time I spent on top of a cube van chipping ice off the tail in the middle of of nowhere that I added the airborne icing/freezing temperatures/deice equipment into my decision making. I’ve even flown around under the overcast at freezing for a few minutes to let the ice sublimate off before landing.

How can a company like Westwind not have the resources or the knowhow to stay out those situations? How could the crew have decided it was better to depart and risk everything than to find a solution to deice the plane and hold up until the problem was solved?
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schnitzel2k3
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Re: Westwind

Post by schnitzel2k3 »

7ECA wrote: Mon Apr 23, 2018 12:17 pm
schnitzel2k3 wrote: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:32 am Somehow I don't think a spray bottle, a 30' ladder and a warming pad are going to entice any flight crew to de-ice and should never have counted as 704 / 705 de-icing equipment.

S
Looks like they've got (at best) a 12' fibreglass and a 6' fibreglass ladder.
Even worse, can't touch the tail had the pilots wanted to. I guess it wouldn't take much to assume this has been going on for years. Unfortunately the luck of the operation ran out.

Talk about the danger of norms.

Sorry to all the WWA pilots out there sitting on the sidelines. Good luck in the job search, fortunately no better time to be applying than now.

S.
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bobcaygeon
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Re: Westwind

Post by bobcaygeon »

Two words:

Company Culture.

Normalization of Deviation

TC in PNR knows this is how operators deice as it is common. Yet they failed to take action. They are part of the problem.

IMHO
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telex
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Re: Westwind

Post by telex »

Normalization of Deviance

Start here, four parts if you are interested in the rest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ljzj9Msli5o
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Re: Westwind

Post by AWOS »

schnitzel2k3 wrote: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:32 am Somehow I don't think a spray bottle, a 30' ladder and a warming pad are going to entice any flight crew to de-ice and should never have counted as 704 / 705 de-icing equipment.

S
That looks about adequate for a King Air or a Navajo. Not for an ATR.
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schnitzel2k3
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Re: Westwind

Post by schnitzel2k3 »

AWOS wrote: Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:51 am
schnitzel2k3 wrote: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:32 am Somehow I don't think a spray bottle, a 30' ladder and a warming pad are going to entice any flight crew to de-ice and should never have counted as 704 / 705 de-icing equipment.

S
That looks about adequate for a King Air or a Navajo. Not for an ATR.
Agreed.
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