Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

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pelmet
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Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#1 Post by pelmet » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:10 pm

I have only seen it on a couple of LSA's as installed equipment but....

"C-GFFI, a privately operated Piper PA31, was conducting an IFR flight from Edmonton, AB (CYEG) to Tofino, BC (CYAZ) with 1 pilot and 4 passengers on board. While in cruise in IMC at FL180 the left engine (Avco Lycoming TIO-540-A2C) lost power. The pilot attempted to restore power but was unsuccessful. The aircraft was unable to maintain altitude on one engine and a controlled descent and turn back to CYEG was initiated by the pilot. The area minimum altitude (AMA) in the area of the descent was 13 900 feet. The pilot declared an emergency by relaying a message through another aircraft as radio contact was lost with ATC due to terrain and being below 14 000 feet. The pilot relied on a synthetic vision terrain depiction on a personal electronic device to ensure adequate separation from terrain. While descending through 10 000 feet the pilot was able to restart the engine and the flight continued uneventfully to CYEG. Maintenance did not find any issues with the engine and the aircraft was returned to service."
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MrTurbine
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#2 Post by MrTurbine » Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:36 pm

pelmet wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:10 pm
I have only seen it on a couple of LSA's as installed equipment but....

"C-GFFI, a privately operated Piper PA31, was conducting an IFR flight from Edmonton, AB (CYEG) to Tofino, BC (CYAZ) with 1 pilot and 4 passengers on board. While in cruise in IMC at FL180 the left engine (Avco Lycoming TIO-540-A2C) lost power. The pilot attempted to restore power but was unsuccessful. The aircraft was unable to maintain altitude on one engine and a controlled descent and turn back to CYEG was initiated by the pilot. The area minimum altitude (AMA) in the area of the descent was 13 900 feet. The pilot declared an emergency by relaying a message through another aircraft as radio contact was lost with ATC due to terrain and being below 14 000 feet. The pilot relied on a synthetic vision terrain depiction on a personal electronic device to ensure adequate separation from terrain. While descending through 10 000 feet the pilot was able to restart the engine and the flight continued uneventfully to CYEG. Maintenance did not find any issues with the engine and the aircraft was returned to service."
Synthetic vision from a personal electronic device? So the pro version of foreflight I’m guessing? Nice to have extra tools on board, but Sounds sketchy anyway.
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CpnCrunch
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#3 Post by CpnCrunch » Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:09 pm

Sketchy compared to...crashing into the side of a mountain?
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#4 Post by Tips Up » Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:16 pm

SV on foreflight is really quite impressive. with a fellow safety pilot, we flew a complete x country from lift off to near touchdown on the centre line. sure a nice extra tool. especially over the mountains
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MrTurbine
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#5 Post by MrTurbine » Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:07 pm

CpnCrunch wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:09 pm
Sketchy compared to...crashing into the side of a mountain?
Touché.
But Sketchy compared to not having to rely on something from a personal device and having better equipment on board for an ifr operation on a piston twin.
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AirFrame
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#6 Post by AirFrame » Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:29 am

MrTurbine wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:36 pm
Synthetic vision from a personal electronic device? So the pro version of foreflight I’m guessing? Nice to have extra tools on board, but Sounds sketchy anyway.
Or AirNavPro or a number of other apps that offer 3D synthetic vision. Or from a Garmin Aera series, which can all show 3D synthetic vision. Foreflight isn't the only app in town.
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#7 Post by MrTurbine » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:03 am

AirFrame wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:29 am
MrTurbine wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:36 pm
Synthetic vision from a personal electronic device? So the pro version of foreflight I’m guessing? Nice to have extra tools on board, but Sounds sketchy anyway.
Or AirNavPro or a number of other apps that offer 3D synthetic vision. Or from a Garmin Aera series, which can all show 3D synthetic vision. Foreflight isn't the only app in town.
Oh sweet! It’s hard to teach an old dog new tricks 😆
Also, which of those could be legit stc’d to an airplane? Or would it be a “situational awareness” only thing?
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#8 Post by bobcaygeon » Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:20 pm

MrTurbine wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:07 pm
CpnCrunch wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:09 pm
Sketchy compared to...crashing into the side of a mountain?
Touché.
But Sketchy compared to not having to rely on something from a personal device and having better equipment on board for an ifr operation on a piston twin.
You must have a different memory than most who have operated a piston twin in an IFR operation. Synthetic vision is a pretty big item on the "wish list".
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#9 Post by Zaibatsu » Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:08 pm

No synthetic vision system is certified for avoiding terrain below IFR altitudes, anyways. They are just to get you out of trouble. Mine which is a certified installation has the graphics of an 8 bit Nintendo. A Gamin 296 looks better. Plus, you’re only using it to avoid isolated peaks which are the only reason the AMA is so high.
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#10 Post by AirFrame » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:21 am

MrTurbine wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:03 am
Also, which of those could be legit stc’d to an airplane? Or would it be a “situational awareness” only thing?
So far everything mentioned is a portable device, although the Garmin Aera's have mounting options that would put them on your panel and hardwire into your electrical system... I don't know what's necessary in a certified aircraft to do that. If you want certified, I believe a few of the very $$$ glass panels are STC-able into certified aircraft... Dynon, Garmin, etc. all make them. Expect to be into $20K at least to get one installed though.
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#11 Post by MrTurbine » Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:37 am

AirFrame wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:21 am
MrTurbine wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:03 am
Also, which of those could be legit stc’d to an airplane? Or would it be a “situational awareness” only thing?
So far everything mentioned is a portable device, although the Garmin Aera's have mounting options that would put them on your panel and hardwire into your electrical system... I don't know what's necessary in a certified aircraft to do that. If you want certified, I believe a few of the very $$$ glass panels are STC-able into certified aircraft... Dynon, Garmin, etc. all make them. Expect to be into $20K at least to get one installed though.
Yeah the G1000 has decent synthetic vision that has helped me out a bunch in the past. It would be nice if one of those little things could be legit STCd for private airplanes.
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#12 Post by AirFrame » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:39 am

MrTurbine wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:37 am
Yeah the G1000 has decent synthetic vision that has helped me out a bunch in the past. It would be nice if one of those little things could be legit STCd for private airplanes.
I believe Dynon is pursuing (and may have already got it, I haven't been following it that closely) an STC for their 7" and 10" Skyview displays, which have the synthetic vision.

In the meantime, the Garmin Aera series has synthetic vision, and doesn't require an STC as the devices are portable.

Or, come to the dark side in the Amateur-Built world where no STC's are required... :)
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#13 Post by photofly » Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:01 pm

The Avidyne 540 and 550 GPS units have synthetic vision built in.
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#14 Post by Tips Up » Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:33 am

G500 TXi has SV option as well
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Re: Why you might REALLY like synthetic Vision

#15 Post by digits_ » Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:57 am

MrTurbine wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:37 am

Yeah the G1000 has decent synthetic vision that has helped me out a bunch in the past. It would be nice if one of those little things could be legit STCd for private airplanes.
Not to be an asshole, but in what situations? One could have the impression that if you've needed synthetic vision to help you out "a bunch", you might be doing something wrong :wink:
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