Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Topics related to accidents, incidents & over due aircraft should be placed in this forum.

Moderators: lilfssister, North Shore, ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako

FlyGy
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 549
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2011 3:00 pm

Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by FlyGy »

Plane clipped a tree with 3 on board then sank in the water.

https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/mobile/plan ... -1.4657007
---------- ADS -----------
 
digits_
Rank 10
Rank 10
Posts: 2985
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:26 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by digits_ »

Underwater recovery team. That does not sound good :|
---------- ADS -----------
 
As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by fish4life »

I hope everyone is alright, the water is down into the high 40’s low 50’s this time of year and it won’t take much for hypothermia to be an issue.
---------- ADS -----------
 
cncpc
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1435
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 10:17 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by cncpc »

CBC reports a witness saw a wing "...come off".
---------- ADS -----------
 
Good judgment comes from experience. Experience often comes from bad judgment.
J31
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1075
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 7:21 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by J31 »

fish4life wrote: Sat Oct 26, 2019 2:35 pm I hope everyone is alright, the water is down into the high 40’s low 50’s this time of year and it won’t take much for hypothermia to be an issue.
Not that warm. Lake temps are about 6 degrees celsius (43 fahrenheit) and those small lakes are cooling off fast with daily air temperatures around 0 celsius.

You are right that hypothermia will set in fast.
---------- ADS -----------
 
peterdillon
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 40
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2014 8:16 pm

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by peterdillon »

Was up there Friday and the small shallow lakes had ice on them.
---------- ADS -----------
 
fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by fish4life »

Any word on if it was a rescue or recovery?
---------- ADS -----------
 
User avatar
CLguy
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1598
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 12:54 pm
Location: Reality!

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by CLguy »

Unfortunately it’s a recovery
---------- ADS -----------
 
You Can Love An Airplane All You Want, But Remember, It Will Never Love You Back!
fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by fish4life »

That’s sad to hear
---------- ADS -----------
 
MudFarmer
Rank 0
Rank 0
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:52 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by MudFarmer »

Contrary to the news article no trees were hit on approach. It was a inflight breakup.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Mick G
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 203
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:21 pm

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Mick G »

MudFarmer wrote: Sun Oct 27, 2019 6:47 pm Contrary to the news article no trees were hit on approach. It was a inflight breakup.
The Otter has had issues in the past with wing separation and fatigue on structural areas. I'm sure the maintenance and inspection records will be the first area to look into.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Maynard
Rank 6
Rank 6
Posts: 440
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:33 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Maynard »

This is (unofficially) the 5th (on record)
2 in 1956. First suspected wake turbulence, the other inadvertent rapid full flap retraction
1 in the 70's, unknown cause
1 in 2013, black sheep, determined excessive over speed on high percentage of flights

While the tail has had its issues, it doesn't seem like in flight break ups are a known issue or weak spot with the Otter
---------- ADS -----------
 
I guess I should write something here.
User avatar
C-GGGQ
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1752
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 12:33 pm

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by C-GGGQ »

One recovered. Divers still looking for two. Confirmed by those on scene in flight breakup
---------- ADS -----------
 
iflyforpie
Top Poster
Top Poster
Posts: 8058
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:25 pm
Location: Winterfell...

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by iflyforpie »

Turbine Otters cruise at Vne. Can’t exactly be healthy for the airframe.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Geez did I say that....? Or just think it....?
Schooner69A
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 550
Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:17 pm
Location: The Okanagan

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Schooner69A »

"...cruise at Vne…"

We had a company Twotter years ago; I seem to remember we lumbered along about 140-150 knots.
---------- ADS -----------
 
ragbagflyer
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 715
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:45 pm
Location: Somewhere rocky or salty.

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by ragbagflyer »

iflyforpie wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:22 pm Turbine Otters cruise at Vne. Can’t exactly be healthy for the airframe.
The current Vne's are the former top of the green arc. Vne used to be 192 on wheels, 183 on floats.

You could also correctly say they cruise just a few mph above Va.
---------- ADS -----------
 
"I don't know which is worse, ...that everyone has his price, or that the price is always so low." - Calvin (of Calvin and Hobbes)
Antique Pilot
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 516
Joined: Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:52 pm

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Antique Pilot »

According to the CCAR they have 3 turbine and 2 piston Otters.

AP
---------- ADS -----------
 
Maynard
Rank 6
Rank 6
Posts: 440
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:33 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Maynard »

iflyforpie wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:22 pm Turbine Otters cruise at Vne. Can’t exactly be healthy for the airframe.
Not sure how many operators do that knowing it’s weaknesses. We run at 144/134mph for wheels and floats.
---------- ADS -----------
 
I guess I should write something here.
Mick G
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 203
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:21 pm

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by Mick G »

Maynard wrote: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:48 am This is (unofficially) the 5th (on record)
2 in 1956. First suspected wake turbulence, the other inadvertent rapid full flap retraction
1 in the 70's, unknown cause
1 in 2013, black sheep, determined excessive over speed on high percentage of flights

While the tail has had its issues, it doesn't seem like in flight break ups are a known issue or weak spot with the Otter
I beg to differ. With presumably 2 in a period of less than 10 years, it would be appear to be a cause for concern, especially considering the air-frames are continuing to age. I'd bet Viking is sweating blood at the moment.
---------- ADS -----------
 
goingnowherefast
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1847
Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:24 am

Re: Blue Water Aviation plane down North of Winnipeg

Post by goingnowherefast »

IIRC, the Garrett engine conversion doesn't move the airspeed redline in the same manner as the PT-6 conversions. It leads to some operators cruising around all day every day at 160mph, well into the yellow airspeed range.

The accountant is quite happy all summer long with getting extra trips done. The sheet metal guys are also quite happy when they take that extra profit repairing cracks and fatigue damage in the tail during the off-season.

Just because the tail hasn't fallen off, doesn't mean it's not a problem. There's a lot of structural work being done to some aircraft in the off-season, especially the ones with the bigger up-gross kits.

I'd also agree that 5 structural failures in a production run of less than 500 aircraft isn't a good sign. Look at it this way, more than 1% of the aircraft produced have fallen apart in flight. If it were the 172, we'd have 440 airplanes. If it were the 737, we'd have 106 airplanes.

I'd say it's time to get some serious attention on this. Either it's being operated incorrectly, there's a design weakness, or the airframe isn't ageing well with now 50-60 year old airplanes.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Post Reply

Return to “Accidents, Incidents & Overdue Aircraft”