CYNJ CADORS

[7ECA]

If you want a pretty glaring example of the sheer quantity of CADORS Langley is able to produce, take a look at the Pacific Region daily report for today (February 23, 2021). Of the thirteen (13) reports, twelve (12) are about CYNJ - that's 92%. Not bad for a wee little airport in the Lower Mainland...

[Canoehead]

It appears there are lots of pilots who don't know the rules? Almost all seem like valid write-ups to me.

It's not hard.

[AirFrame]

It appears there are lots of pilots who don't know the rules? Almost all seem like valid write-ups to me.

So what's more likely? That Langley has a massively above-average fleet of idiots and somehow every other airport in the lower mainland has managed to avoid them? Or that there's something else going on?

Keep in mind that most of the reports are about school aircraft. Why are students at Langley that much worse than everywhere else? Or maybe the other airports turn a blind eye to infractions this inconsequential?

[lhalliday]

Most activity at Langley is flying school aircraft, which is why schools show up so frequently. But Boundary Bay and Pitt Meadows are also training-heavy and I've seen some crazy stuff at both airports. Just no CADORS. Let's not talk about Chilliwack, OK?

Langley can be tricky, but, still, this is nuts. I know Langley well: I learned to fly there and kept my own plane there until I moved to Kamloops.

...laura

[Canoehead]

It appears there are lots of pilots who don't know the rules? Almost all seem like valid write-ups to me.

So what's more likely? That Langley has a massively above-average fleet of idiots and somehow every other airport in the lower mainland has managed to avoid them? Or that there's something else going on?

Keep in mind that most of the reports are about school aircraft. Why are students at Langley that much worse than everywhere else? Or maybe the other airports turn a blind eye to infractions this inconsequential?

Well I'm unfamiliar with any of those airports- only YYJ and YVR in that area. It's certainly possible that it happens more often elsewhere but doesn't get logged, whereas Langley is more "committed" to reporting. Let's take the two most common occurrences on the date you mentioned: taxiing without a clearance and not going where they were instructed to go in the air. Those are pretty black and white. Do they need to be written up every time? Probably not. However if there is a systemic problem in that flights are constantly taxiing without a clearance or not following instructions, then it needs to be documented. If there's one operator in particular that is prone to these errors, then I'm sure that the local Tower Supervisor would have had a courtesy call with the CFI/CP to discuss. If things don't improve, then start writing CADORS, and draw the attention of TC.

The reality is that taxiing as instructed, joining the circuit as instructed or flying the departure route as instructed is not hard (especially at a small airport like Langley). A couple or 3 events per day? Yeah likely that's normal. But there seems to be errors happening a lot there.

I'm actually curious as to why these events are happening so often? Is language a contributing factor?

[AirFrame]

I'm actually curious as to why these events are happening so often? Is language a contributing factor?

Your post is right on all counts... And everyone is wondering why CYNJ is singled out. It's extremely odd, because one would think that many of these aircraft visit other airports in the lower mainland once in a while, especially when it comes to the students. When I was learning (at ZBB) we regularly flew to YPK, YNJ, and YXX for touch-and-goes.

Language is a barrier at many of the schools in the lower mainland, not just CYNJ, so I don't see that being the driving factor either.

It's been postulated that the reports are being kept high so the necessity of keeping a tower there is ensured. Unfortunately, a side effect is that it's making the airport look like the most dangerous one in the lower mainland... And if the NIMBY's get hold of that info, they would surely clamor for it to be shut down.

[godsrcrazy]

I would still like to know if all controllers rewriting reports. Our just one controller. I believe if you look into it the majority are done by one individual.

[AirFrame]

I would still like to know if all controllers rewriting reports. Our just one controller. I believe if you look into it the majority are done by one individual.

The wording is all similar in the ones i've read, but that could be TC moderating them before they get posted to CADORs. There's no way to tell from the CADORs database which controller submitted the report, even in an anonymized fashion.

[patter]

Sorry to keep coming back to this. And good morning.
Live ATC now has now been established at Langley. Ground and Tower.
And that’s a good thing.

It doesn’t appear to be working...at least not for me as yet. There was an archive item I was asked to review.

It’s my understanding that when Transport asks for a recording of a tape all they get is a transcript. Which allows for Nav Canada to in effect edit the tape. There can be radio transmissions relevant to the Transcript that have been omitted in that Transcript. With Live ATC and the archive one can listen to all of the tape not just the segment where there error occurs. And this can be relevant to your CaDOR. If it’s your radio call/actions that you are reviewing you will be able to relive the moment, and what you were thinking and self evaluate the quality of your radio effectiveness.

Airport diagrams on Foreflight which reference CFS and CAP and something else show taxiway C in 3 different places. “Unfamiliar” and “Progressive taxi” should be a part of a pilots vocabulary at this airport.

[AirFrame]

Which allows for Nav Canada to in effect edit the tape. There can be radio transmissions relevant to the Transcript that have been omitted in that Transcript. With Live ATC and the archive one can listen to all of the tape not just the segment where there error occurs.

Unless the segment on LiveATC has been edited as well. They do remove segments on request of certain organizations.

[7ECA]

Another bumper crop of CADORS for Langley today. Check the Pacific Region, Regional Report (07/04/2021). Of twenty four reports, thirteen are for Langley.

[lhalliday]

The Langley CADORs are starting to sound like Russian dashcam videos.

I learned to fly there and kept my own plane there for several years. It had its issues but was never the zoo it appears to have become.

...laura