Man hit in head by helicopter blade Saskatchewan

[Woxof38]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatche ... ident.html

[CID]

I have seen so many people who think they are too cool to duck while exiting or entering a helicopter. I don't think the operators do enough to caution people of this hazard. Then of course there's the tail rotor. There's usually no recovery from that.

[sky's the limit]

I have seen so many people who think they are too cool to duck while exiting or entering a helicopter. I don't think the operators do enough to caution people of this hazard. Then of course there's the tail rotor. There's usually no recovery from that.

CID,

Quit talking out of your ass... EVERY safety briefing covers this as pretty much the main topic. Especially on jobs such as this. Save your opinions for things you know about - this obviously not being one of them

Please troll elsewhere.

[CID]

...

[sky's the limit]

Yes, you are talking out of your ass.

Let's see, what do you know about this incident? Nothing. The article contains no hard information, and certainly none about the circumstances. The machine could have shifted as he was going under the blades, the guy could have tripped (happens ALL the time), the pilot could have smacked the cyclic... the list goes on and you know none of it. To assert "the Operators don't do enough" is complete garbage and you know it. Ie, a troll.

FYI - You do not have to "duck" when leaving a helicopter... in fact I rarely duck as when I'm leaving my machine it's usually on the hard, meaning I have clearance and just need to be aware of where they are. Are you telling me I don't "do enough?" You obviously see and do not understand, so please, reserve your commentary for subjects you have a clue about. God I love this site...

I hope the guy recovers, I know two people who have survived these things and it's not pretty.

stl

[Beefitarian]

I'll admit I don't know much here, but if you're not naturally concerned about the main rotor while you are near a running helicopter. What could the crew say that would change your mind?

The article mentions the skid being on soft ground, possibly causing the rotor to be low.

[sky's the limit]

CID,

Stand by whatever you like, you have no idea of what you speak about. The only issue I have is with trolls who start casting blame around on a very tragic incident for all involved. Edit what you want, doesn't change the fact you have no idea what happened, and started spouting off about it.

Beef,

You'd be blown away at how silly people can be. Customers are always doing things that boggle the mind, and every helicopter pilot spends his/her day watching out for these things. And briefing on them, daily if not more. Helicopters are extremely unforgiving when people make errors, customers, pilots, spectators, whoever.

stl

[oldncold]

GO STL - as the son of a retired fling wing engineer with 48 yrs exp .. even as a little 4yrs old taking my first ride with wilf pinner in the kemano days it was hammered into me > keep your head down and look directly at the pilot . or you wont get to go flying again.. then my first turbine ride in cf-cqb bell 206 with al eustis . same drill . that was over 40yrs ago so stl i do know and lets educate the masses eh

[white_knuckle_flyer]

...even as a little 4yrs old taking my first ride with wilf pinner in the kemano days it was hammered into me > keep your head down and look directly at the pilot .

What is the significance of looking directly at the pilot ? To ensure he/she sees you ? To monitor his/her hand movements ?

[GyvAir]

I think oldncold is referring to communications when he says look directly at the pilot. Make eye contact so that you know each other's intentions. If you don't make eye contact with the pilot, you don't know for sure that he knows you intend to approach the aircraft. Also, if you can't see the pilot, he likely can't see you, i.e. approaching an aircraft from outside the pilot's range of view. Thinking there is nobody near the aircraft, the pilot may decided to reposition it, putting you at risk. Same goes for entering and exiting or working around a fixed wing aircraft when it's running or someone is in the cockpit with or without intention to start up. Level of diligence required varies with situation, of course.

As far as keeping your head down, Beef is right - and CID as well on the too cool to duck comment - some people seem to have a bravado complex or are just plain ignorant when it comes to the few inches of space that's usually between their scalp and the main rotor.

[Schooner69A]

Those espousing safety around rotary wing aircraft are correct. Prior to being transported in a helicopter, it is important that all passengers are briefed to make eye contact with the pilot whether emplaning or deplaning and to bend over when entering or departing the rotor disc area. Not all craft are fitted with droop stops and not all pilots can be relied upon to NOT bump the cyclic at an inopportune time. If passengers get into the habit of getting a "Thumbs up" from the driver before ingress or egress and bend over when under the "air conditioner"*, it greatly reduces the possibility of having to fill out a bunch of paper work.

*...because, you know; when it quits, the pilot starts to sweat...



John

[sky's the limit]

GO STL - as the son of a retired fling wing engineer with 48 yrs exp .. even as a little 4yrs old taking my first ride with wilf pinner in the kemano days it was hammered into me > keep your head down and look directly at the pilot . or you wont get to go flying again.. then my first turbine ride in cf-cqb bell 206 with al eustis . same drill . that was over 40yrs ago so stl i do know and lets educate the masses eh

You are correct oldncold,

If there is one thing that is beaten into customers it is making eye contact, and being aware of the blade tip path at ALL times. Also, briefing pax on the fact that helicopters can, and do move even when sitting on the ground, is essential. If you are engaged in hover exit operations, or "toe-ins" like in geology or logging applications, then that briefing going to an entirely different level again.

I'm not sure of the "too cool" comments made here... in my experience it's not a matter of trying to be the cool guy, it's more people get distracted by their own work, or more commonly, they are exhausted by their work and simply forget. There are very few people who don't take it seriously out in the bush, and if there is one they generally don't last very long on the job.

It can happen to anyone, and for inexplicable reasons. Case in point:

In Yukon quite a number of years ago, a Gov't Geo with almost 20yrs experience around helicopters in some of the toughest terrain Canada has to offer, lost his head, literally. A 500 was toed into a very steep slope with blades ver close to the rocks, and the Geo dropped his rock hammer which proceeded to fall down the slope - inexplicably he stood up and put his head in the blades which resulted in decapitation, and a severely damaged 500 that had to be flown down to the valley bottom by an extremely distressed pilot. This fellow had a tonne of experience in these ops, why did he do that? People get tired, people make mistakes.

This is one of the most serious things around a helicopter, and for someone to suggest that operators take it lightly is just asinine. If a pilot doesn't take it seriously, he or she will not last very long - the operator will make sure of that.

Eye contact is critical, in all circumstances where pax are entering or exiting a helicopter that is running or in flight (toed-in).

The minute you let your guard down, somebody will do something to give you a heart attack... Who knows what happened in this situation, but I feel for both the passenger and the pilot...

Schooner, droop stops are only for when blades are slowing to a stop, they do not limit the blades at full RRPM. That is on the 206, on the Mediums our blades come extremely low when turning. Not as big an issue with multi-bladed systems like the Astar, 500, or 407, however those types are often used in very steep terrain where the ground can be inches from the tip path. Although we do a lot of toe-in work in the Mediums on fires in Ontario for example, and of projects like the one I am on right now, at nearly 50ft in diameter it doesn't take much to get them close to the ground!

stl

Couple of examples in the mountains:

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[The Mole]

Your in way more danger disconnecting a GPU or removing wheel chalks from a plane, putting yourself within inchs or a prop, or having to walk between spinning props 'dc3', than you are walking under the turning blades of a helicopters. If the blades came as low to the ground as people on here 'fixed wing pilots' suggest, there would be way more main rotor strikes.

[Schooner69A]

Mole: there is not doubt that there is danger accompanying many aspects of aviation, fixed wing and rotary wing; both on the ground and in the air. However, like many here who are dual qualified, I am not blowing smoke out my tail pipe: I qualified on helicopters in 1973. It is true that many helicopters today do not present the same scalping tendencies of their predecessors; however, by insisting that your passengers acquire eye contact with the pilot and duck/bend over as they emplane/deplane, you are training them for every machine on which they may ride. I still do it and I know the characteristics of most helos in the inventory today. Unlike the days of the French Revolution, you take off one head today and nobody will shout "Vive!" (;>0)

John

[boeingboy]

If the blades came as low to the ground as people on here 'fixed wing pilots' suggest, there would be way more main rotor strikes.

I'm sorry - but that is the most asinine, ignorant comment I've ever heard.

[PilotDAR]

having to walk between spinning props 'dc3', than you are walking under the turning blades of a helicopters.

I see it differently....

Propeller disks are dangerous, but they stay in one place (unless the plane is moving). Rotor blades, by their very nature, will move up and down in the rotating disk, let alone the affects of the wind. It is also very unlikely that you have the airplane toed in on a 35 degree slope, with the disks unusually close to the ground.

Perhaps the posters here who have actually flown toe ins, and done hover exits have more knowledge.

[The Mole]

Ive done enough hover exits, off level landings, logging pads To know ,just making eye contact with the pilot and ducking will not keep you safe. You brief the passengers for the terrain. In this case, why where passengers being unloaded from both sides. What side was ski basket on? or two baskets? did the passenger just get out the pilots door for unexplained reasons. Where they using a different aircraft before this and not familiar with an Astar.. Was it off level terrain along with muskeg? did a log break? Just ducking may not be enough, ive sunk an aircraft half way up the doors in snow and to the belly in muskeg. just simply saying make eye contact and duck is asinine. Soap boxing simple solution is dangerous.

[xsbank]

STL, your photos are fantastic, I wish I had had digital during the fun parts of my career!

Apart from the effects to the victim, the poor pilot must be a mess as I'll bet he has just experienced his worst nightmare.

Please be careful out there. Your duty is to the passenger first, then yourself (and by extension, the aircraft!) so stay with it. There's a lot of debating about "professionalism" on some other threads and whether or not you think we are professionals or not, but the moment somebody puts themselves in your care, you must provide all the professionalism you can muster to keep them safe until they track outbound past the airport fence (or equivalent).

[Schooner69A]

Mole messaged: "...I've done enough hover exits, off level landings, logging pads To know ,just making eye contact with the pilot and ducking will not keep you safe. You brief the passengers for the terrain. In this case, why where passengers being unloaded from both sides... etc"

Mole: What you say is not incorrect, and I salute your experience. Mine pales in comparison. (Mostly VIP transport) However, do I correctly infer that you let your passengers wander to and from your running helicopter with no supervision - visual or otherwise? You don't brief them to get your attention and receive approval to move with a nod or a "thumbs up"?

John

[sky's the limit]

The internet being what the internet is, I see we're all arguing but essentially saying the same thing. The facts are, one can get hurt around a helicopter in many, many ways.

Mole, sorry, I have to disagree that unplugging GPU's and walking around FW a/c is as dangerous as RW a/c. I have been around both extensively in my career and there are far more variables when it comes to helicopters and the environment they are operated in. Yes, accidents do happen around airplanes too, but I think it's a stretch to say they are as risky.

I'm not sure what you meant by the blades do not come down as far as people think? On a paved ramp perhaps an Astar or 500 provides plenty of clearance, but any of the Mediums or a LongRanger/JetRanger have significantly lower blade heights. But that is not the point. The point is, it takes VERY little up-sloping ground to bring pax in very close proximity to blades when out in the field. It doesn't have to be extreme toe-ins as I have posted, in many cases a gentle slope presents more danger as people are apt to get complacent.

The entire discussion surrounds the idea of briefing correctly before jobs start, during the course of the job, and even de-briefing after the job. It is incumbent on the pilot to make sure the pax have a complete understanding of what will happen and why.

Schooner, we often have pax milling around the machine unseen to us, the pilots. In applications such as Heli-skiing, or mining, fire fighting, or logging to name a few, it's simply an unavoidable circumstance given the design of most machines. Again, we rely on excellent briefings to make sure things go smoothly. When more risk is involved as in hover-exit/toe-in Ops, or slinging, then the briefings are ramped up to include actual "training" of the people entering, exiting, and working around the machine. It's the law, and each person must be signed off as "Trained" to conduct those ops. It is very much in the Company's and the pilot's best interest to do that well and above all in this day and age, document it.

Here is an example from last month where a typical landing spot can present a VERY serious hazard to pax walking around the machine, as you can see, I'm actually above it taking this pic:

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Now, speaking of having blades over your head....

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XsBank, I too don't have photos of some of the more fun bits of my career, mainly the off-strip FW stuff - no digital back then and working alone 99% of the time made sure I have only a couple old slides. In this day and age it's actually become a problem with almost all pax having GoPro's and Iphone's now... Heli-skiing a couple years ago I looked over my shoulder to see 10 GoPro's filming! Only the two Guides were without...