Asia getting desperate!

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loopa
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Asia getting desperate!

Post by loopa »

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopi ... 7&t=103746

Things sure seem to start looking desperate over there in Asia. I wonder if the day will come where all this hype about jet time gets dropped too? How many of you would jump on the opportunity to go and work for an outfit like Korean Airlines if you could live in YVR/YYZ on a commutable contract and didn't need to have previous jet type ratings? I think the pool of experienced Canadian pilot's who apply would seriously blow up. Just my 2 cents!

I wonder if they would consider 737 classic type ratings too? Because the 5 year contract lines up nicely with some of the LOA periods presently offered to some very qualified 737 drivers in the country. Would be timely if you could get considered for such contracts.

An NG rating shouldn't be that much more valuable than a type rating on a 300/400 series right? Say you were going to a 777, the transition to get used to an EICAS for example would be the same for an NG guy as the 300/400 rated guy. ALT is ALT on both the NG and 300/400, VNAV PATH is VNAV PATH. FMS' are pretty close. Bummer, your CLB/CRZ/DES pages are confabulated into a VNAV button on the 777 FMC. Can't be a weight requirement to prefer NG. ECL and EFB's... can't see the NG having an advantage there either? I don't know, just doesn't seem to make that much sense to just restrict it to NG rated pilot's only. Is there something I'm not considering in my opinion here? 5 screens versus 4 EFIS' and glass engine gauges? :lol:

Best of luck to anyone looking for work and able to consider such contracts. 8)
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AirMail
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by AirMail »

I'm sure they'll count experience on type with a simple paid for PPC :roll:
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FOD_Vacuum
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by FOD_Vacuum »

If there is a commutable contract to work for Korean Air living in Canada, Jazz, AC and Encore will start to cry because Asian work terms and conditions are light years ahead of the new disgraceful contracts you get these days at most Canadian carriers. You cant beat 6+ weeks vacation a year, and starting salaries for DEC that pay the same in a month as a new turboprop FO, annually!
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FL7377
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by FL7377 »

"Asia getting desperate" - Yeah right!

Once they start taking 1500 hrs and an ATPL with NO type rating, then we know they're desperate.

I havn't seen any job overseas from IASCO Global that doesn't require time on type, a type rating or time on a heavy jet.

Yet i've seen AC, WJ and Sunwing take 703 captains into the right seat of big jets.
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altiplano
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by altiplano »

There may be some good things about the contract but it's not the pay.

About 100K/YR for a 777 FO. Didn't look into captain pay, I hope that's at least respectable.

Only guys I suppose they are going to get are self financed, low experience and looking for a real job - or desperate for some other reason.
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loopa
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by loopa »

What I find interesting is how it doesn't specify time on type requirements. So if you have an 737ng tr that's enough ? Sure seems desperate to me. Only a matter of time before turboprop pilots will be considered for such contract's.

Other news I've heard from credible sources is Qatar is going to be offering a commuting contract as well due to lack of applicants and a mass exodus of people every month.

Also sounds like the ME is going to need 20k pilots by 2025. At the rate people are leaving vs aircrafts on order between EK/EY/QR/FZ they are going to have to consider other than jet exp. Can anyone shine some more info on this? Complex?
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ahramin
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by ahramin »

altiplano wrote:There may be some good things about the contract but it's not the pay.

About 100K/YR for a 777 FO. Didn't look into captain pay, I hope that's at least respectable.

Only guys I suppose they are going to get are self financed, low experience and looking for a real job - or desperate for some other reason.
Actually the pay seems quite reasonable for a commuting contract. Sure a 777 FO can make $150K+ a year in Beijing or Islamabad, but you have to live there. Considering they guarantee 1 day off a month at home less that Westjet, I could easily see a year 2 or 3 FO there stuck commuting to Calgary or Toronto making the jump. Big pay raise, possibly more time off at home, better equipment, much better upgrade opportunity.

The big worry is ... how long before they change the contract on you and suddenly your 14 days off at home turn into 14 days off anywhere?
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TopperHarley
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by TopperHarley »

This nothing new. Korean has been offering this for a while methinks. One of my buddies applied (time on 330), but Korean contacted him and told him they wanted a University degree. This was 3 years ago or so, so Im not sure if that "requirement" is still in place.
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Joe Blow Schmo
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by Joe Blow Schmo »

The Korean contract has always been good for commuters but the pay has never been great. Years ago it was great for Canadians as the tax treaty between the 2 countries said that only Korean tax needed to be paid even if you were living in Canada. That has changed though.

Most of the Chinese domestic A320 carriers are now offering 4 week on/4 week off schedule options paying in the USD160-180k range for captains. Or you can make USD250-300k for the same job with the full-time, live in China, with 6 weeks leave a year option. They also have 6/2 and 6/3 options as well.

There is clearly demand in China. The pay has risen significantly in the last few years as have the variety of scheduling options available. KAL has not kept up.

IMHO you will likely never see them drop the requirement for jet time. Generally that is a government requirement, not an airline one. The CAAC will not issue you with a license unless you meet their requirements. It would take a bureaucratic miracle to get that changed.

I wouldn't recommend going to any of these jobs as an FO though. They won't upgrade you. If you want to go somewhere as an FO, try Air Japan. They do upgrade and also have a very good commuting schedule. Still need the jet time though.
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Eric Janson
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by Eric Janson »

loopa wrote:What I find interesting is how it doesn't specify time on type requirements. So if you have an 737ng tr that's enough ? Sure seems desperate to me. Only a matter of time before turboprop pilots will be considered for such contract's.
On the IASCO website the requirements clearly state 500 hours on Type.
Other news I've heard from credible sources is Qatar is going to be offering a commuting contract as well due to lack of applicants and a mass exodus of people every month.
I've been hearing these stories for years about all the Airlines in the ME. Never seems to happen for some reason....

What you need to understand is that in the ME it is all about control - you have no rights as an Expat. If they offer basings they lose control. They don't want you living in a country where you have rights and can sue them.
Also sounds like the ME is going to need 20k pilots by 2025. At the rate people are leaving vs aircrafts on order between EK/EY/QR/FZ they are going to have to consider other than jet exp. Can anyone shine some more info on this? Complex?
Sounds unlikely - this is basically a doubling in size in 10 years. From a logistical point of view there won't be enough parking space available at the Airports.

The political situation in the region is going from bad to worse - that will have an effect on the Airlines.

These jobs are for experienced Type rated people - these companies hire their own nationals as cadets. Don't see this changing.

I travel to Dubai regularly as I start and end my roster there. On Monday the low was 34C. Ramadan has just started as well. I was glad to leave.
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loopa
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Re: Asia getting desperate!

Post by loopa »

Thanks for chiming in Eric 8)
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