Our Tough...Or Not So Tough Aviation Industry: Trend

[Sky_Conqueror]

Greetings all. I hope all is well and you guys are having safe and awesome flights. Coming from a Business and Management background, I couldn't refrain myself to quickly analyze the situation we find ourselves right now. And I wanted to have some insights of what other fellow pilots think.

You have probably noticed that there has been quite some movement in these past few months. WJ and its regional company have been constantly expanding. Jazz now has officially dictated that they would hire til the forseeable future, having a couple of G/S a month up until the beginning of next year. The Government has finally acted on the Foreign Workers Affair so Sunwing / Air Transat now has to revert to hire locally (Good job!! Finally!). And I heard recently that (and please no bashers as this seems to be just a rumour so don't quote me on this) AC might be looking to hire in excess a couple of hundreds of pilots next year after ICAO has imposed and forced Canada to comply with its long range duty hour regulation. Add Air Georgian and SkyRegional in the equation and it seems to me that we have finally hit jackpot in regards to hiring. Now for the first time reader, the previous sentences may seem glorious and promise a bright future. But words on paper or on an online thread seem to differ greatly from reality.

My curiosity was aroused a few weeks ago and just now after reading in a previous thread of a fellow Airman holding 2800TT with turbine time, having to revert to that dreaded Road Trip. This is where I start worrying. Add Western Canada and its massive layoffs...and it seems that the bright and glorious future does not seem so bright nor glorious anymore. Analysts for Dummies: How accurate is the situation out there? With much companies opening the tap for hiring again; you would assume that this whole industry could finally balance. But yet you hear the Noir Stories about people with high time not getting calls.

It would be great to analyze this situation, as it could considerably help fellow pilots find a path for employment. Many of you, if not all who read these forums, are in direct contact with our industry. It would be great to have some feedback on what you heard (without giving any names) so we can map out and provide ourselves with a better picture.

[jpilot77]

I would hold off on using one guy's posting about having a hard time finding a job as a barometer of the Canadian pilot job market. Who knows why that guy can't find a job, too many variables.

[NickyNick]

But words on paper or on an online thread seem to differ greatly from reality.

.

You are 100% correct. You can't sit back and say there's a lot of hiring going on unless you are actually applying and getting multiple offers. Close to 4000 hrs with a lot of King Air 200 PIC time and no job offers yet have come my way. If all the above mentioned companies were actually hiring I would assume I would have many job offers to choose from, I am qualified to be trained and act as first officer on 705 aircraft.

[Confliction]

I would hold off on using one guy's posting about having a hard time finding a job as a barometer of the Canadian pilot job market. Who knows why that guy can't find a job, too many variables.

Exactly.

Not saying anything about the posters on this thread but generally attitude, hours, and who-you-know are a major part of landing employment as a pilot (luck being another).

[scopiton]

It's hiring, but for some the amount of experience is way over what you can expect for the pay offered. What about starting pay ?
The reduced first 4 years at AC
Encore's payscale starting around 36k
Same for jazz, 36.
Gnn, forget about it.
Entry level job being a seasonal job without benefit package of any sort and no hollydays and no guarantee of a permanent position ? Plan b : AT seasonal. When / where does it become permanent ?
Most employers don't pay for your grd-school, barely put you on per diem while at the hotel, some will argue that your base is away from home but that's your base so you get nada. All in all you can expect a first paycheck within a month. Tap into those hard earned savings again ?
Sky regional, where you should hit the 100hrs/mth mark to make a living ?
How can working more for as much or less money can be an improvment ? One list, pml ? May be.

Yes there's hiring, for those recently layed off it's a very good thing.
For those trying to evolve without loosing few years in wage and working conditions that's another gamble.
And during that time life changes, some have babies, buy a house, or are planning for different things.

Why should changing job delay your projects in life or put your prosperity on hold ?
I would say it's a young pilot's market where years and decades will erase those tough first few years at a new position because what's important is banging and driving fast. When you're past your 20's and early 30's you wanna hear a different tune.

[short bus]

Yes! Nickynick is back. This should be fun

[Justjohn]

Well, NickyNick has had a busy summer! A month or so ago he only had 2800TT, mostly on the BE20.

The troll has returned.

[sstaurus]

Indeed, it is a young pilots' market. As a mid level 704 captain into my 30s now, I'm trying my hardest to avoid erasing any gains in wealth I've made by moving to one of the regionals now. How long can I hold out? Maybe all the jobs will be filled by people willing to work for peanuts before I go anywhere...

[upintheair_]

Contrary to what I read on here, talking to many people in the industry (mainline types) as well as seeing other companies near mine in Ontario looking for qualified pilots... I think things are going pretty damn good. Some say, the best they've seen it for new blood in a long time.

With places like Encore, Jazz and AC ramping up hiring it's going to trickle down in the next year to all the smaller operators. I see ads for Wasaya almost weekly, I know Weagamao Air was looking for a PA31 pilot recently, Air Creebec needs a dash 8 FO, Skylink Express posting, Sky Regional ERJ posting last week, Orca expanding, Ornge, 100+ vacancies at Jazz and 200+ at AC.

If I was able to get a job right out of flight school this year with 220 hours (as well as a few friends I know), anyone with any substantial amount of time should be able to find a job right now and even possibly be a bit picky about it.

[upintheair_]

I would hold off on using one guy's posting about having a hard time finding a job as a barometer of the Canadian pilot job market. Who knows why that guy can't find a job, too many variables.

Exactly.

Not saying anything about the posters on this thread but generally attitude, hours, and who-you-know are a major part of landing employment as a pilot (luck being another).

I agree.. connections and attitude more than anything. I got the job I have now by hearing about it through a friend. Not really a connection, more like a "I heard so and so is hiring." No job posting. Called the CP said I'll be there tomorrow. Showed up in a shirt and tie, and the rest is history.

I think for low timers at least... showing up in person is paramount. I went into a road trip with the full intention of finding a flying job, and I was not going to go home. There were times after 6 weeks that I almost turned around but I stuck with it. I'm sure my next job will come due to connections, and I'm totally OK with that. You gotta do what you gotta do to get ahead in life.

[NickyNick]

Well, NickyNick has had a busy summer! A month or so ago he only had 2800TT, mostly on the BE20.

The troll has returned.

Not really, doing about 50 hours a month.

Can you provide link to a post a month or so ago where I said I have 2800TT ?

Only true thing in your post is "mostly on the BE20".

Looks like you're the troll, spewing out untrue things about members.

[upintheair_]

He probably just got confused. IIRC you said you had 3900 hours?

No new job yet? Surprising given the movement happening everywhere.

[North Shore]

Well, NickyNick has had a busy summer! A month or so ago he only had 2800TT, mostly on the BE20.

The troll has returned.

Roughly a month ago, NN posted this: "What's the hiring minimums now? The 1500 hrs Total Time on website should be updated, 3900 hrs Total Time with 2500 PIC BE20 doesn't get a call."

Seems to me s/he's being fairly consistent. Who's trolling who here?

[North Shore]

WRT 'the other guy' - doing the roadtrip with 'Van time and 2K+ hours. I got the sense, from looking at the thumbnail resume s/he'd posted, that s/he had started their career in the USA (had an FAA licence.) I can see Canadian employers being a little reticent to hire someone with largely foreign experience - no gravel strips, the mix of I/VFR that we use, lack of radar coverage, etc...

[DanWEC]

Well, NickyNick has had a busy summer! A month or so ago he only had 2800TT, mostly on the BE20.

The troll has returned.

Not really, doing about 50 hours a month.

Can you provide link to a post a month or so ago where I said I have 2800TT ?

Only true thing in your post is "mostly on the BE20".

Looks like you're the troll, spewing out untrue things about members.

Oh this guy... wait, Just under 4k hours, with just under 3k of BE20 Pic?? So you were magically a King Air capt at 1000 hrs? That's pretty impressive. Usually people like have made a good name for themselves and developed a reputation among peers.

[upintheair_]

Well if he works where I think he does, it's not unheard of. I know someone who had his left seat PPC done on the BE20 at under 1000 hours at what I believe is the same company if he really is in The Pas.

[Shibby]

I'm 100% sure of no BE20 Company operating out of the Pas with 1000 hr drivers. They are strictly Medevac now.

[upintheair_]

You're right, I mistook it for Flin Flon. Nevermind then.

[flyinhigh]

I do know that keewatin has slid folks to the left seat with 1100hrs.

[Kosiw]

After reading various posts on the different forums, seems some are only hiring low timers, would this be due to the very low starting wages?