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The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:56 am
by rigpiggy
A pilot that leaves to jazz in a year. Seriously a corporate gig looking for an experienced guy for 60k, only if it's a retired ac guy with a backup pension, oh wait there flying beings for 350k in china. I'm getting 90k for <200 hrs/yr. pony up guys

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 12:36 pm
by flyinhigh
What? I've read this a few times and it still does not make sense.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 12:43 pm
by Jean-Pierre
He say you must pay corporate pilot 90k not 60k or they will go to Jazz for 40k.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 1:41 pm
by MrAviator19
rigpiggy wrote:A pilot that leaves to jazz in a year. Seriously a corporate gig looking for an experienced guy for 60k, only if it's a retired ac guy with a backup pension, oh wait there flying beings for 350k in china. I'm getting 90k for <200 hrs/yr. pony up guys
Image

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 3:59 pm
by Alcoholism
Even I don't understand

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 4:52 pm
by Rupert_Pupkin
my guess at decoding this is :
The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you?


It gets you a pilot that leaves to jazz in a year. Seriously? A corporate gig looking for an experienced guy for 60k? Only if it's a retired ac guy with a backup pension! Oh wait there flying boeings for 350k in China. I'm getting 90k for <200 hrs/yr. pony up corporate operators.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 5:54 pm
by Conquest Driver
This is like reading bad COBOL
Guess I dated myself with that comment.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:44 pm
by Cat Driver
It is pilot talk, only understood by pilots. :smt040

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:32 pm
by AuxBatOn
Cat Driver wrote:It is pilot talk, only understood by pilots. :smt040
Conquest Driver wrote:This is like reading bad COBOL
Guess I dated myself with that comment.
You realize COBOL is a programming language Cat?

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:56 pm
by JBI
Elsewhere on this site, there is a job ad for a corporate piston twin position for $50-$60k. A pilot that possessed the experience that is being sought in the job ad would make them an ideal candidate for Jazz/Encore/Porter/Georgian. I believe the OP is suggesting that the working conditions (which in this particular ad only includes 8 Guaranteed Days off per month) makes the job not overly desirable for a pilot to remain working there for more than a year before they left for a regional.

So while the sentence structure of the original post may be lacking, it makes a very good point. As pilots we have a good bargaining position at the moment. Looking at things rationally, what makes more sense if you have 1500 hours - joining a regional making 40k a year (with the pros and cons that come with regional flying) or making 50-60k a year flying a piston twin. I'd argue that for most candidates, going the regional route makes more sense (i.e. better schedule, quick-ish upgrades at the moment, flight benefits and then options for the majors). While there are always pilots who are not interested in going to the regional or major airlines, there still are many options out there that would arguably pay more than what is being offered.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:00 pm
by Black_Tusk
And just to throw it out there, you'll likely push 50k in your first year at a place like Jazz with 12k ish of tax free per diems on top of that.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:14 pm
by oldncold
What does 55-60 k get you
I'will bite, should be what it don't get ya. But I digress lol

1) revolving door of exp capt leaving
2) stressed worn out. Cp 's spending way more time training line indoc ing and admin. = lost Rev hurts bottom line.
3) softer issues lower morale lack of continuity.
4) parked aircraft. No crew
5) maxed out remaining crews which if goes on for extended period of time. Causes. Those to reevaluate. Their. Life style / compensation. Equation

In short it (55k-60)don't get a lot. These days. It seems to be a stopgap. Keep the cash flowing pay the bills. Not a longterm career option.
Yet that is what mgt needs stability. They need to ask. This? is better to have. Your company a destination of choice regardless of tier with happy highly paid group of crew vs a piecemeal. Crews That won't stay because of pay. They both affect the bottom line of the company but the hidden costs in turnover cleint relations. Plus training are staggering those are but a few item on the topand bottom line
The best run companies regardless of field. Get this.
85k + is the new 50k of15- 20 years ago

I'm reminded of why one works Career Money. Buys lifestyle. The rest is negotiable. Fly safe

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:10 am
by FOD_Vacuum
oldncold wrote:What does 55-60 k get you
I'will bite, should be what it don't get ya. But I digress lol

1) revolving door of exp capt leaving
2) stressed worn out. Cp 's spending way more time training line indoc ing and admin. = lost Rev hurts bottom line.
3) softer issues lower morale lack of continuity.
4) parked aircraft. No crew
5) maxed out remaining crews which if goes on for extended period of time. Causes. Those to reevaluate. Their. Life style / compensation. Equation

In short it (55k-60)don't get a lot. These days. It seems to be a stopgap. Keep the cash flowing pay the bills. Not a longterm career option.
Yet that is what mgt needs stability. They need to ask. This? is better to have. Your company a destination of choice regardless of tier with happy highly paid group of crew vs a piecemeal. Crews That won't stay because of pay. They both affect the bottom line of the company but the hidden costs in turnover cleint relations. Plus training are staggering those are but a few item on the topand bottom line
The best run companies regardless of field. Get this.
85k + is the new 50k of15- 20 years ago

I'm reminded of why one works Career Money. Buys lifestyle. The rest is negotiable. Fly safe
How drunk were you when you wrote this? haha

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:55 am
by rigpiggy
I will admit my sentence structure can be a bit cryptic, oldncold and JBI got the gist. I fly several kingairs, turboprops, and medium pistons. I charge 400-500 day depending on type, plus my 75K main job. Why anybody would work for 55k, unless they are living in their parents basement is beyond me

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:44 pm
by Alcoholism
rigpiggy wrote: Why anybody would work for 55k, unless they are living in their parents basement is beyond me
My lifestyle has led me to some wrong life choices ok.. :cry:

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:52 pm
by johngalt
Regionals are amazing! Who doesn't want get out of their mom's basement into a Radisson or Holiday in to stream Netflix every night.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:12 am
by JBI
johngalt wrote:Regionals are amazing! Who doesn't want get out of their mom's basement into a Radisson or Holiday in to stream Netflix every night.
Certainly a better use of one's time than trolling a month old thread on a message board...

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:25 am
by Black_Tusk
JBI wrote:
johngalt wrote:Regionals are amazing! Who doesn't want get out of their mom's basement into a Radisson or Holiday in to stream Netflix every night.
Certainly a better use of one's time than trolling a month old thread on a message board...
Trolling is right. Because the hotels we stay in are actually really nice.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:21 am
by leftoftrack
I wish I had a biscuit I could give you

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:01 pm
by BE20 Driver
oldncold wrote:85k + is the new 50k of15- 20 years ago
Pretty close. Adjusting for inflation, a $60,000 salary works out to $86,000 today.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:47 am
by letmedrive
Black_Tusk wrote:
JBI wrote:
johngalt wrote:Regionals are amazing! Who doesn't want get out of their mom's basement into a Radisson or Holiday in to stream Netflix every night.
Certainly a better use of one's time than trolling a month old thread on a message board...
Trolling is right. Because the hotels we stay in are actually really nice.
We get it, you work for Jazz.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:00 pm
by atphat
rigpiggy wrote:I will admit my sentence structure can be a bit cryptic, oldncold and JBI got the gist. I fly several kingairs, turboprops, and medium pistons. I charge 400-500 day depending on type, plus my 75K main job. Why anybody would work for 55k, unless they are living in their parents basement is beyond me
I assure you they could care less if you get it or not. Either the juice is worth the squeeze for someone or it’s not. If a king air driver is able to handle the pay cut to ensure larger future earnings, good on them. If not. Oh well, enjoy your king air and the earning ceiling it brings. A pilot going to jazz and eventually AC through the PML today can realistically look at earning 150+ a year within 4 or 5 years. Nevermind the higher earnings once you graduate off narrowbody in time. If that’s what one chooses to do.

Doesn’t work for you? Fair enough. Works for someone else? Even better.

Re: The pilot shortage, or what does 55-60k a year get you

Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:29 pm
by JBI
atphat wrote:
rigpiggy wrote:I will admit my sentence structure can be a bit cryptic, oldncold and JBI got the gist. I fly several kingairs, turboprops, and medium pistons. I charge 400-500 day depending on type, plus my 75K main job. Why anybody would work for 55k, unless they are living in their parents basement is beyond me
I assure you they could care less if you get it or not. Either the juice is worth the squeeze for someone or it’s not. If a king air driver is able to handle the pay cut to ensure larger future earnings, good on them. If not. Oh well, enjoy your king air and the earning ceiling it brings. A pilot going to jazz and eventually AC through the PML today can realistically look at earning 150+ a year within 4 or 5 years. Nevermind the higher earnings once you graduate off narrowbody in time. If that’s what one chooses to do.

Doesn’t work for you? Fair enough. Works for someone else? Even better.
I think the OP is agreeing with you. He's suggesting that posting a job ad for a light twin for 50k and higher experience levels is not a job that they'll get a lot of applicants and/or pilots that they'll keep. Pilots who have the time that they are (were?) looking for would be better off pursuing Jazz or similar as you outline above.