Thunder Airlines

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FL007
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Thunder Airlines

#1 Post by FL007 » Thu May 17, 2018 11:00 am

That posting for MU-2 FO/Captains is actually one of the best ads i've seen for employment, in terms of transparency. Back when I was doing the road trip years ago for my first job nobody even had the decency to contact me back, other than the CP of Thunder, although it was to tell me I needed more experience before I was acceptable, I really appreciated the response.

Literally so impressed at how everything is laid out. I'm not interested in it personally but this is more the type of job postings we need on this site. Work conditions, the straight up salary matrix with no hidden shit, etc.

I've never had the pleasure to work at Thunder Airlines and I probably never will, but I will always respect them as a company for doing stuff like this.
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Roadrunnersmother
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#2 Post by Roadrunnersmother » Fri May 18, 2018 3:52 pm

I agree. The CP must have put it together. The HR woman doesn't know a planes rudder from it's elevator. That company must miss out on some great applicants if they stopped the hiring process due to their HR department.
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Xonga013
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#3 Post by Xonga013 » Fri May 18, 2018 8:08 pm

Roadrunnersmother wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 3:52 pm
I agree. The CP must have put it together. The HR woman doesn't know a planes rudder from it's elevator. That company must miss out on some great applicants if they stopped the hiring process due to their HR department.
Unfortunately, this is the case at many companies. Don’t get me started on HR...
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Flapsdownletsgo
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#4 Post by Flapsdownletsgo » Sat May 19, 2018 8:00 am

Roadrunnersmother wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 3:52 pm
I agree. The CP must have put it together. The HR woman doesn't know a planes rudder from it's elevator. That company must miss out on some great applicants if they stopped the hiring process due to their HR department.
She is well aware of what the requirements are and I assure you the appropriate resumes end up on the appropriate desks.
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ThunderCP
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#5 Post by ThunderCP » Sat May 19, 2018 8:25 am

Roadrunnersmother wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 3:52 pm
The HR woman doesn't know a planes rudder from it's elevator.
That’s both rude and irrelevant. Our HR department is probably better now than it’s ever been and that’s because we have an experienced Human Resources professional running it and not some random pilot. It’s important to have the right people to fill a given position and it really doesn’t matter what technical details they know about other jobs in the company if it has no bearing on their own work.
Flapsdownletsgo wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 8:00 am
She is well aware of what the requirements are and I assure you the appropriate resumes end up on the appropriate desks.
Can confirm. My plate is pretty full these days so HR is helping with filtering, but the relevant ones do end up on my desk. I wish I still had the time to personally respond to each and every application like I used to, but unfortunately I just dont’t. Right now HR has a flight experience threshold that they’re drawing the line at which is driven by the immovable requirements of a couple major contracts we hold.
FL007 wrote:
Thu May 17, 2018 11:00 am
That posting for MU-2 FO/Captains is actually one of the best ads i've seen for employment, in terms of transparency.
Thank you, I worked hard on it to try and give the most accurate representation of the job that I could. If I expect an applicant’s resume to be thorough I think I owe the same to all potential candidates.
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Illya Kuryakin
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#6 Post by Illya Kuryakin » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:31 pm

Thunder CP
Class act. Say Hi to Kaj
Illya
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TheRealMcCoy
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#7 Post by TheRealMcCoy » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:02 pm

Xonga013 wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 8:08 pm
Unfortunately, this is the case at many companies. Don’t get me started on HR...
I can deal with HR. But the safety department...
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ThunderCP
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#8 Post by ThunderCP » Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:22 pm

TheRealMcCoy wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:02 pm
I can deal with HR. But the safety department...
I'm sorry you feel that way, I'd like to think our safety department is made up of all our employees. If you currently work for Thunder I encourage you to take your concerns to your department manager, or if you feel they're the problem take it a spot higher on the Org Chart. If you're not presently working here that's possibly more startling that we appear that way from the outside, contact me directly and I'll look into it.
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ThunderCP
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#9 Post by ThunderCP » Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:22 pm

Illya Kuryakin wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:31 pm
Say Hi to Kaj
Can do!
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Xonga013
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#10 Post by Xonga013 » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:45 pm

It’s nice to see the CP of a company come out here and try to straighten things out. We need more people like that in Canadian aviation. Well done!
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TheRealMcCoy
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#11 Post by TheRealMcCoy » Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:28 pm

ThunderCP wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:22 pm
I'm sorry you feel that way, I'd like to think our safety department is made up of all our employees. If you currently work for Thunder I encourage you to take your concerns to your department manager, or if you feel they're the problem take it a spot higher on the Org Chart. If you're not presently working here that's possibly more startling that we appear that way from the outside, contact me directly and I'll look into it.
My statement was more just a blanket comment for everywhere.. Definitely was not making reference to Thunder specifically.
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C.W.E.
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#12 Post by C.W.E. » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:43 pm

It’s nice to see the CP of a company come out here and try to straighten things out. We need more people like that in Canadian aviation. Well done!
Excellent, the industry needs more of these people who actually understand the importance of the job and actually do it in a professional manner.
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LegoMan
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#13 Post by LegoMan » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:44 am

With the 7 on, 7 off any chance to commute? I'm in Stoney Creek and wife doesn't want to move up north but Thunder looks like a pretty good place to build time for a while.
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ThunderCP
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#14 Post by ThunderCP » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:09 am

LegoMan wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:44 am
With the 7 on, 7 off any chance to commute? I'm in Stoney Creek and wife doesn't want to move up north but Thunder looks like a pretty good place to build time for a while.
It's possible and many of our pilots do head out of town on their days off, but of course the expectation is that you're available and properly rested for your days on.
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leftoftrack
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#15 Post by leftoftrack » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:47 am

bonuses have changed, but thats the same pay scale they had 15 years ago. 15 years ago they lead the way with pay, today they're very much falling behind
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ThunderCP
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#16 Post by ThunderCP » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:14 pm

leftoftrack wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:47 am
thats the same pay scale they had 15 years ago.
Do you have any proof to substantiate that? If not, posts like these are why so many job ads have next to zero information in them.
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DanWEC
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#17 Post by DanWEC » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:45 pm

leftoftrack wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:47 am
bonuses have changed, but thats the same pay scale they had 15 years ago. 15 years ago they lead the way with pay, today they're very much falling behind

Completely inaccurate.

On the commuting topic-
Many commute with Thunder. They have passes with the AC family, and Porter. I'd recommend calling them up and asking the CP some questions, it'll get him away from having his head stuck in his Model T.
You'd have a very easy time commuting to YYZ or YTZ if you are able to get the YTS base. Loads are lighter than in YQT. Sometimes you could even drive if necessary.

Best 703 out there.
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leftoftrack
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#18 Post by leftoftrack » Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:54 am

10 years ago I was offered a job under the same base plus milage, Avcanada doesn't keep a history of job postings that far back. the bonuses have changed but the rest is the same (they've ditched the bond apparently) the second the ability to find pilots comes esier the bonuses get cut out and bam their labor cost are the same they were 15 years ago.

but the CP comes on here regularly, ask him/her
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govida
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#19 Post by govida » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:39 pm

leftoftrack,

You're absolutely right. It surprises me how pilot are just gobbling up these bonuses like it's a game changer. The salaries are what needs to go up. Pilot should call up their bank and ask if they can put bonuses as part of the income when applying for a mortgage, their answer may surprise them. Bank know that these glorious bonuses can be pulled at any time.

Similar to pilots that take the low paying regional jobs just because there is plenty of opportunity for OT. There is going to be a time when there isn't going to be any OT available, and you will go back to your monthly credit. This is why good credit and hourly pay are important, we're simply in a honeymoon period right now.

My employer just implemented a bonus structure to try and stem bleeding, with the idea that it will become part of the salary during the next CBA. But they have 2 years for the economy to tank and be able to just yank those bonuses under the excuse of "different employment market".
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NotDirty!
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#20 Post by NotDirty! » Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:04 pm

leftoftrack wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:54 am
10 years ago I was offered a job under the same base plus milage, Avcanada doesn't keep a history of job postings that far back. the bonuses have changed but the rest is the same (they've ditched the bond apparently) the second the ability to find pilots comes esier the bonuses get cut out and bam their labor cost are the same they were 15 years ago.

but the CP comes on here regularly, ask him/her
Perhaps over a decade you have forgotten the exact details. I did work for Thunder 10 years ago, and those were not the rates they were offering!

Since you mentioned 15 years ago, that matches the earliest pay scale I can recall. At that time the base pay was $24,000 for everyone (FOs and Capts), and mileage ranged between $0.02 for a junior FO up to $0.24 for a somewhat senior captain.

By 2008, the FO pay still started at $24k + $0.02/mile, but the base went to $32k if you had >1500TT and >500MPIC. Captain pay was $36k + $0.10/mile for the first year, $42k + $0.12/mile second year, and $48k + $0.14/mile third year. You also got a $5000 bonus after two years as captain, and $5000 again each year on the anniversary of your upgrade.

The pay now starts at $35k + $0.02/mile for an FO, and $55k + $0.10/mile for a Captain. Plus they pay a premium on top of your base salary if you are an air ambulance pilot, and/or an Ontario Government approves captain. So your base salary can easily be $10k more, if you have the time requirements.

Thunder has paid out retention bonuses every year for more than 10 years; at one point they advertised it as part of the salary, but the numbers posted today do not include this bonus. It is just that; a bonus. A thank you for year(s) of hard work and dedication, and for staying with the company. You can’t get a mortgage based on it, so don’t take it to the bank.... take it to the toy store!

I no longer work for Thunder, but I met a lot of great people there, and cannot think of a better company to work for in the 703/704 world. And if you want to make it a career company, that is very doable. Or put in some time, get some great experience, and move on... you’ll see many ex-Thunder pilots at every major airline in Canada, and a few others around the world.
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Ozinater
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#21 Post by Ozinater » Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:07 pm

Question for ThunderCP,

I remember seeing somewhere that there is a one year training agreement for new Thunder FOs (I believe that is promissory note and not a bond). Presumably there is something similar for upgrading or switching aircraft types? For example, if a new hire starts as a King Air FO and their progression is as follows;
BE10 FO -> BE10 Captain -> MU2 Captain
Would that be (theoretically) three 1-year training agreements? Assuming that new BE10 and MU2 captains both have 12 month agreements. Not sure how many people actually go that route but figured it was worth asking! Cheers.
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leftoftrack
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Re: Thunder Airlines

#22 Post by leftoftrack » Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:03 pm

I was offered direct entry captain at year 3 rates, they were the same.
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