I'm actively looking for my first job and I need to get my IR current again. After heavily investing in this career over a couple of years let's say I'm currently not doing great financially. The question is about paying myself for an IPC or waiting for a PPC. Needless to say, I understand the advantages of being current and proficient before being hired by an operator.
What I'm trying to figure out is for what type of positions, particulary when applying to be an F/O, I need my IPC done prior, and which ones would give me a PPC regardless. What type of machines/operators would give you a PPC vs a PCC(which does not count in case you need an IPC) ? Would you get a PPC on a PC12 for example?
It would make sense to do the IFR renewal as part of an initial PPC, but unfortunately all the operators I've worked for required a current IFR for new hires. you could roll the dice on this one, your call.
As long as you have previously held a multi-IFR, you could get away with only doing a single engine IFR renewal (which would save you some coin, especially if done in a Red Bird SIM) and when it comes time for your PPC...the ride will renew your IFR back to a Group 1IFR, providing it's done on a twin engine aircraft!
A company takes a risk on hiring someone without the right qualifications. If you don’t have a current IFR on your resume or can’t answer if you’re current in an interview, you immediately go below someone who is current even if they have fewer hours and experience.
Your first IFR job is going to be a learning experience, but you have to be demonstrably up to basic standards first.
Can't hurt to renew it... except in the bank account...
If you're applying for jobs that will need a PPC... that will renew your IR...
I remember I was out of work and broke and my IR had just expired, I just kept applying places with group 1 on my resume, I got a King Air job and mentioned that my IR had just expired in the interview and they didn't care... "the PPC ride will renew that"...
First job, low/no timer. Most companies won't mind training you on the airplane, however they won't want to re-teach you your ifr. I'd probably do the redbird renewal @6-700$, but you could probably just do a few sim hours handflying full approaches. I can probably tell in the first 1.5 in the airplane if you can pass the ride, at that time I have to look at whether it is worth further investment
Can you renew on a redbird sim? I recall there was some disussion that a person could not renew on them anymore because of an GPS approach issue or something..just curious.
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trey kule wrote: ↑Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:42 pm
Can you renew on a redbird sim? I recall there was some disussion that a person could not renew on them anymore because of an GPS approach issue or something..just curious.
Yes you can, provided the operator has upgraded to the appropriate software level, and gone through the re-certification process with Transport.
trey kule wrote: ↑Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:42 pm
Can you renew on a redbird sim? I recall there was some disussion that a person could not renew on them anymore because of an GPS approach issue or something..just curious.
Yes you can, provided the operator has upgraded to the appropriate software level, and gone through the re-certification process with Transport.
If you do an IPC on the Redbird, download the manuals and memorize them before you get into it. It has a weird quirky wing leveller/ auto pilot which is great but has some strange features, and the GNS 430ish takes a bit to get 100% proficient at. The manuals are all available on line for free.
skybluetrek wrote: ↑Fri Oct 26, 2018 5:53 am
Thanks for the replies guys. I should make an effort and get the IPC done.
If the job you are looking to get will only give you a PCC, you'll need the IPC. If it's a job where you'll get a PPC, no need to get the IPC as the ride will renew your IFR.
skybluetrek wrote: ↑Fri Oct 26, 2018 5:53 am
Thanks for the replies guys. I should make an effort and get the IPC done.
If the job you are looking to get will only give you a PCC, you'll need the IPC. If it's a job where you'll get a PPC, no need to get the IPC as the ride will renew your IFR.
Well, what if during your training on their aircraft and not on a simulator facility which some companies sent you off for your training, they start shooting at you all kinds of instrument questions and techniques and you are rusty then you'll look like you don't know. They'll be busy teaching training you on the airplane the last thing they want to do is re introduce you to an ILS approach on a king air!
I understand your point that the PPC will re vailidate the IPC but we might look like yahoos to them and might re consider hiring . Sure we can go to a school with a redbird and practice the hell out of it before your interview , we can do that.
skybluetrek wrote: ↑Fri Oct 26, 2018 5:53 am
Thanks for the replies guys. I should make an effort and get the IPC done.
If the job you are looking to get will only give you a PCC, you'll need the IPC. If it's a job where you'll get a PPC, no need to get the IPC as the ride will renew your IFR.
Well, what if during your training on their aircraft and not on a simulator facility which some companies sent you off for your training, they start shooting at you all kinds of instrument questions and techniques and you are rusty then you'll look like you don't know. They'll be busy teaching training you on the airplane the last thing they want to do is re introduce you to an ILS approach on a king air!
I understand your point that the PPC will re vailidate the IPC but we might look like yahoos to them and might re consider hiring . Sure we can go to a school with a redbird and practice the hell out of it before your interview , we can do that.
my two cents
If you're so rusty that you can't figure out how to fly an ILS, an IPC isn't going to help.
Doing an IPC in a redbird will validate your IFR, sure... but if you think it's anything close to resembling an actual approach flown in a King Air you have another thing coming. You'll be behind the airplane regardless, so IMO why waste money. If you got the job you got the job.
If the job you are looking to get will only give you a PCC, you'll need the IPC. If it's a job where you'll get a PPC, no need to get the IPC as the ride will renew your IFR.
Well, what if during your training on their aircraft and not on a simulator facility which some companies sent you off for your training, they start shooting at you all kinds of instrument questions and techniques and you are rusty then you'll look like you don't know. They'll be busy teaching training you on the airplane the last thing they want to do is re introduce you to an ILS approach on a king air!
I understand your point that the PPC will re vailidate the IPC but we might look like yahoos to them and might re consider hiring . Sure we can go to a school with a redbird and practice the hell out of it before your interview , we can do that.
my two cents
If you're so rusty that you can't figure out how to fly an ILS, an IPC isn't going to help.
Doing an IPC in a redbird will validate your IFR, sure... but if you think it's anything close to resembling an actual approach flown in a King Air you have another thing coming. You'll be behind the airplane regardless, so IMO why waste money. If you got the job you got the job.
I agree with this.
I guess my advice would be to apply and clearly state that your IFR has lapsed. If you get a job you better be familiar with how to fly IFR regardless, a red bird simulator won't teach you again. Training captains are NOT there to teach IFR, and if you fail your ride because of breaking hard limits or turning the wrong way in a hold that's on you.
You should at least know what everything on a plate is and what altitudes you're able to descend to if you're cleared for an approach etc.
