Always wonder why companies like Thunder hire this way? Fill the left seat in the 'van, and hang out an FO position like it's some kind of reward? Treating the Caravan like a second class position? This will pretty much get you a second class Caravan driver......because he/she really wants to drive the Beech/Rice Rocket??
Why not (here's a novel idea) hire a guy who WANTS to drive a Caravan and live in YTS? Pay the guy 45-50K salary.....and that's the job. No Beech etc. in the future.....just a fair paying Caravan job?? You would get a guy who will stick around? Not a "type" chaser, looking for the brass ring......think of the trainning dollars you'd save....but, alas, companies just dont get it?
Thunder looking for Caravan capt/Be, MU2 FO's...
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore
Hey guys,
Well problem is, can you find a guy or a gal that wants to fly JUST the caravan, highly doubtful. We have one gentleman that has about 4500 hours all in the caravan and that is it.
The Fo position isn't just a carrot to get someone to come here, its to help out some individual get some multi time as well.
Personally I don't see anything wrong with this, I'm sure that if somebody wanted to fly just the caravan that they would apply as well.
Anyway guys happy flights
Well problem is, can you find a guy or a gal that wants to fly JUST the caravan, highly doubtful. We have one gentleman that has about 4500 hours all in the caravan and that is it.
The Fo position isn't just a carrot to get someone to come here, its to help out some individual get some multi time as well.
Personally I don't see anything wrong with this, I'm sure that if somebody wanted to fly just the caravan that they would apply as well.
Anyway guys happy flights
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Special K
- Rank 3
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- Location: cyhd/cyqt/cypl/cyrl/cyqk...etc....
I imagine it has to do with all there senior pilots leaving for greener pastures.
In there contract it's states that if you are signed up, you must take an upgrade if it's offered or face firing. So if you sign up as the new 'Van dude or dudette they will use you to fill the king air captains position after you get the required 500 multi.
It probably has to do with the fact that many people with 500 multi can and do find jobs at other companies.
CYA
K
In there contract it's states that if you are signed up, you must take an upgrade if it's offered or face firing. So if you sign up as the new 'Van dude or dudette they will use you to fill the king air captains position after you get the required 500 multi.
It probably has to do with the fact that many people with 500 multi can and do find jobs at other companies.
CYA
K
Special,
No, not all our flights are MOH. The MU-2's are about 99% MOH however.
depending on the base, the king airs are about half and half, yts king airs do medivacs on the weekends or whenever the mu2 is out. Dryden kingair is dedicated to medivacs, as well with the sudbury one(will do odd charter as well).
hope that helps
No, not all our flights are MOH. The MU-2's are about 99% MOH however.
depending on the base, the king airs are about half and half, yts king airs do medivacs on the weekends or whenever the mu2 is out. Dryden kingair is dedicated to medivacs, as well with the sudbury one(will do odd charter as well).
hope that helps
CAL wrote:Well said Doc.....
Furthermore.....the employment contract at Thunder is pretty harsh as it is let alone the crappy wages that these type of companies continue to pay. Its just not worth it.
Pilot Training Contracts
First Officers and Captains employed with Thunder Airlines are expected to enter into a Training Agreement with the Company.
• This agreement stipulates that, prior to the commencement of training, the employee will deposit with the company, a fixed specified amount of money to be applied toward the cost of training.
• Upon successful completion of the training and checkride, the company will pay the employee a non-taxable monthly “training allowance” equal to 1/24th of the original employee contribution plus interest at the prevailing bank rate.
• In the event that employment of the individual is terminated prior to the 24 month term for cause or by the resignation or other termination instigated by the employee, all training allowance payments shall cease and the employee shall have no right to any such money and all obligations of the company to provide training allowance payments shall be at an end.
• When a First Officer is to be upgraded to the position of Captain, the initial agreement will be refunded and the candidate will enter into a new agreement for the new position. By accepting employment, First Officer’s agree to accept upgrade to Captain when required by the company
Cessna C-208 (FlightSafety) $ 10,000.00
Cessna C-208 (PPC only) $ 3,000.00
King Air First Officer $ 4,000.00
King Air 100 Captain Upgrade $ 4,000.00
Mitsubishi Mu-2 (Simulator) $8,000.00
Mitsubishi Mu-2 (PPC only) $ 4,000.00
Last edited by IDFR on Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Its not just the bond and I dont blame Thunder because they are all doing it.....I am sure Thunder is a good company and they have a good boss...but come on...24-30k?....Its just getting pretty damn hard living a life of any standard on that these days....I mean they have been paying 24-30k for decades!!....inflation rises approx. 3% per annum....is no one getting it???
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Flying Low
- Rank 8
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- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:22 pm
- Location: Northern Ontario...why change now?
Not saying the money is great but please get your facts straight.
It use to be $24K base salary for Captains and F/O's. The first year F/O's made no mileage. Detention pay was $7/hr for F/O's and $15/hr for Captains. This is paid for every hour you sit on the ground away from base after the initial hour on the ground.
Recently, the Captains got $30K a year and F/O's started to make mileage in their first year. Detention pay remains the same. This works out to a $6K raise for Captains and based on 6000 miles a cheque $3K raise for the F/O's.
So...as for the pay scale not changing in decades...it actually changed a few months back.
Just to give you an idea.
As a first year Captain on the MU2 I am making around $50K. This includes my base ($30k), $.10 a mile (I average 7000 miles every 2 weeks) and $15/hr detention (I average around 10 hours every 2 weeks).
Base $30000
Mileage 7000 miles * 26 pay periods * $0.10 = $18200
Detention 10 hours * 26 pay periods * $15 = $3900
Total $52100
The guys on the King Airs usually do less mileage as they do more charter work and end up sitting around, and therefore get more detention time than I do.
It use to be $24K base salary for Captains and F/O's. The first year F/O's made no mileage. Detention pay was $7/hr for F/O's and $15/hr for Captains. This is paid for every hour you sit on the ground away from base after the initial hour on the ground.
Recently, the Captains got $30K a year and F/O's started to make mileage in their first year. Detention pay remains the same. This works out to a $6K raise for Captains and based on 6000 miles a cheque $3K raise for the F/O's.
So...as for the pay scale not changing in decades...it actually changed a few months back.
Just to give you an idea.
As a first year Captain on the MU2 I am making around $50K. This includes my base ($30k), $.10 a mile (I average 7000 miles every 2 weeks) and $15/hr detention (I average around 10 hours every 2 weeks).
Base $30000
Mileage 7000 miles * 26 pay periods * $0.10 = $18200
Detention 10 hours * 26 pay periods * $15 = $3900
Total $52100
The guys on the King Airs usually do less mileage as they do more charter work and end up sitting around, and therefore get more detention time than I do.
"The ability to ditch an airplane in the Hudson does not qualify a pilot for a pay raise. The ability to get the pilots, with this ability, to work for 30% or 40% pay cuts qualifies those in management for millions in bonuses."
As a captain it seems ok....based on your numbers but as an FO essentially wherever you go you have to be prepared to be poor for a while....it would be so much better to just be guaranteed 30k or 50k none of this mileage pay detention pay ....its like you have to take the risk taking a job along with the company if they dont fly...problem is the reward is crap verus the risk...
Again I am not ragging on Thunder ...its just in general it seems so hard to get by and doesnt seem to be getting much better....its starting to get frustrating...
Again I am not ragging on Thunder ...its just in general it seems so hard to get by and doesnt seem to be getting much better....its starting to get frustrating...
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Flying Low
- Rank 8
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- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:22 pm
- Location: Northern Ontario...why change now?
Agreed! It would be nice to have a guaranteed salary.
By my numbers above, the 1st year F/O is making $29460. I think Voyageur had a guaranteed salary in the mid 20's (not sure on the exact number). Not sure if there is any company doing the same type of work on twin turbines paying much better for F/O's. Would be nice to know...Anyone?
By my numbers above, the 1st year F/O is making $29460. I think Voyageur had a guaranteed salary in the mid 20's (not sure on the exact number). Not sure if there is any company doing the same type of work on twin turbines paying much better for F/O's. Would be nice to know...Anyone?
"The ability to ditch an airplane in the Hudson does not qualify a pilot for a pay raise. The ability to get the pilots, with this ability, to work for 30% or 40% pay cuts qualifies those in management for millions in bonuses."
Let me see if I have this straight? Thunder requires pilots to place rather large sums of money with them for trainning? This is cash up front? If true, my opinion of Thunder went down the toilet with last night's turds! Not to mention the fact that anybody signing up for this royall screwing must be at least slightly retarded?
Funny, how the same pilots who will dump all over their peers who go out and buy a PPC, will stand in line to pump money at operations who take money from you for trainning......Let's seen now, to go to Flight Safety and BUY a PPC, or go to Thunder and PAY them for it? What to do, what to do??
Funny, how the same pilots who will dump all over their peers who go out and buy a PPC, will stand in line to pump money at operations who take money from you for trainning......Let's seen now, to go to Flight Safety and BUY a PPC, or go to Thunder and PAY them for it? What to do, what to do??
Doc, how does the pilot lose money unless he isn't willing to stick around for two years. I have seen many pilots get ppc'ed then **ck off a few months later when something "better" comes up-how could companies continue at that rate. I can definitely see an employers point of view. I don't agree with having to buy a PPC but I cannot understand why companies are being dissed for getting employees to commit to them for a certain period of time (in which case the employee loses nothing). If the employee gets hired by AC or any other major airline then the payoff is greater then the monetary loss.
