Air Georgian

[RickPilot33]

Ok so you would prefer to do nothing for peanuts then work for it.

Yes I understand that you dont want to work for little but its too bad because you need to start somewhere...you start with low time and low salary...
dont need to tell me about supply and demand... You sit around and dont fly you wont be current and wont have a job and be a lazy SOB

I have always been a hard worker...maybe you're little blue book was handed to you on a silver platter and someone paid it for you...

As long as you are a pilot you need to fly and keep on top of it.

Anyways Guys...you can keep bashing me but I worked my ass off to be at the top and all I am saying is that's how everyone has done it before and will continue too...
This is the year 2014...You snooze you lose!!!

For the record you start at 32k and you move up...!!! You dont then you can maybe go work somewhere else...but there are less companies willing to take low time pilots...even those with lots of hours have a hard time to find any job...

Then you get jerks like some of you who would rather stay home then go work and earn the buck...


Good job being on EI... God knows I am not going to help you get rich that way

[Redneck_pilot86]

The point wasn't my decision to collect or not collect EI, the point was that EI pays better than this amazing flying job you are talking about.

If you want to have a dick measuring contest over wages lets do it via pm, I'd be willing to bet I make more in the 7-8 months I do work than you do in a full year, I'd be willing to bet the flying I do requires greater hands and feet skills than what you do, and I didn't have to live with my mommy to get where I'm at. I'll freely admit my skills diminish over the winter while I am not flying full time, but flying isn't magic, and a few circuits in the spring easily gets me back to where I need to be.

[Navaids]

Rickpilot33 I get it. You have been instructing for 5 plus years and know everything, You are gods gift to aviation. I seriously hope you make it to your chosen airline and have a good life! I want this for all pilots!! 32k is ok for a staring wage if you can manage to live on that, but Some of us can't. Will you be able to live off that wage forever? Maybe you are willing to pay for 500 hours of line training on a jet to get ahead.

[RickPilot33]

The point wasn't my decision to collect or not collect EI, the point was that EI pays better than this amazing flying job you are talking about.

If you want to have a dick measuring contest over wages lets do it via pm, I'd be willing to bet I make more in the 7-8 months I do work than you do in a full year, I'd be willing to bet the flying I do requires greater hands and feet skills than what you do, and I didn't have to live with my mommy to get where I'm at. I'll freely admit my skills diminish over the winter while I am not flying full time, but flying isn't magic, and a few circuits in the spring easily gets me back to where I need to be.

Redneck, I originally wrote this for you as a PM but I don't know why it isn't working...

Quite frankly this isn't between me and you...We don't know each other but if you misunderstood my point and thought it was directed at you than my apologies...
Yes your dick may be bigger, yes your job pays more and you also may have more experience...kudos to you...

The question is where does a pilot draw the line?

What do you consider too low a salary?

One who works a few years instructing that has 1000+ hrs pic in a 172 vs. a guy whom has 250hrs right out of flight school?
They wont get a job making 50K...

They're lucky if they get a job at all because most places want experience...even for an FO job on a Navajo...

My base line was 36K as FO on a BE10... I quickly moved up to PIC but my point is I had to start with the 36K job as FO working up north in Ontario before I could move out west into the left seat making 50K/yr...
I probably don't have your hands and feet skills but I can fly a plane and I have the experience to know what I am worth vs. what is available...


Quite frankly the fact that you are on EI due to seasonal work is fine...I was under impression you preferred to not be working then flying... but if a seasonal job works for you that's great...

I am unemployed and not by choice...Sometimes lay offs aren't easy ....and quite frankly I would prefer to have that 36K job again but I have avoided that and aiming at a baseline of 45K+...

I do agree that wages are low...but when it comes to working and flying but making less money vs. staying at home and not working then I prefer to take the lower paying job....ITs not just about the money man and that's what sickens me...

Lifestyle, city where you live and of course the pleasure of flying are all factors a pilot takes into account...
I would rather have a good job where I don't have to break my back loading bags... and I'd rather work with someone I can stand being with in a cockpit for hours at a time.

I take flying seriously, I know finding the best paying jobs isn't easy but we can't all not fly anymore just because the jobs don't pay that well...

I don't have beef with you so once again if I misunderstood your point, my apologies...

Cheers and safe flying...(hopefully winter finishes soon!

[Redneck_pilot86]

Rick,

I realize it isn't personal and never took it personally, although I do tend to get a little passionate about some debates.

A seasonal job works for me as lifestyle is much more important than hours in my logbook. I make enough money during the season to live comfortably year round, in a place I enjoy living.

I feel that a pilot should never have to struggle financially, right from day one of work with 200-250 hours. If 36k a year is enough to live in your own place with food in the fridge and gas in the car, then great. Some low paying jobs have several other perks like crew housing, company vehicles, subsidized food, which make the low wage much better when compared to a similar wage at a job that doesn't have these benefits.

Lets go back to my breakdown of 32k (17,800NET per year)
That is 1480 Net per month.

Based on several places I have lived, always with roommates, I think a fair guess for rent is around $450 a month, plus probably another $200 average per month for basic utilities. I haven't budgeted in a long time, but lets be generous and say you can survive for $50 a week in groceries, for another $200 a month. Lets assume $50 to fill the gas tank on your car, once every two weeks. Insurance payment is likely around $100 a month. My student loan payment was $300 a month, maybe some people can do that for less, but it is not even accounting for the MIFR that I didn't get right away. This leaves you with $130 a month to do what you want with. That is not accounting for any birthdays, Christmas, car repairs, oil changes, clothes or entertainment whatsoever. In my mind, that is not a liveable wage. Add in a girlfriend and a kid and you haven't got a hope in hell starting out.

On that note, I don't blame the operators that are offering these low wages, it makes good business sense when there is what appears to be a never-ending pool of young pilots willing to accept them as that is the way it "has to be done". Simple answer is, if pilots stop accepting the wages, the employers will be forced to pay more to attract and keep pilots.

Also, the pm you sent me appeared but was deleted by you before I could read it. I think it sits in your outbox until I open it, and then moves to your sent box.

[cdnpilot77]

Lets go back to my breakdown of 32k (17,800NET per year)
That is 1480 Net per month.

I think your numbers are a bit skewed. Is someone making $32k going to be paying a 45% overall tax rate? It's been a while since I made 32k or less but I know 100% I was not paying 15k/yr in taxes when I was. It seems to me that it was less than 1/2 of that. Carry on

[zulutime]

Lets go back to my breakdown of 32k (17,800NET per year)
That is 1480 Net per month.

I think your numbers are a bit skewed. Is someone making $32k going to be paying a 45% overall tax rate? It's been a while since I made 32k or less but I know 100% I was not paying 15k/yr in taxes when I was. It seems to me that it was less than 1/2 of that. Carry on

FWIW...We pay some of our labourers just under $30,000.00 per year and they bring home more than $1,800.00 on their paycheck each month.

[Diadem]

The marginal tax rate on $32000/year is 15%, and if you got student loans you got some pretty significant tuition tax credits, so you would have gotten everything refunded.

Add in a girlfriend and a kid and you haven't got a hope in hell starting out.

Having kids with only one parent earning $32000 would be grossly irresponsible, and indicative of poor life and financial planning, regardless of the industry in which one works.

[Rowdy]

The marginal tax rate on $32000/year is 15%, and if you got student loans you got some pretty significant tuition tax credits, so you would have gotten everything refunded.
Having kids with only one parent earning $32000 would be grossly irresponsible, and indicative of poor life and financial planning, regardless of the industry in which one works.

Most people that have kids these days are grossly irresponsible.. I mean.. look at all the indignant little shits out there

[davecessna]

The marginal tax rate on $32000/year is 15%, and if you got student loans you got some pretty significant tuition tax credits, so you would have gotten everything refunded.
Having kids with only one parent earning $32000 would be grossly irresponsible, and indicative of poor life and financial planning, regardless of the industry in which one works.

Most people that have kids these days are grossly irresponsible.. I mean.. look at all the indignant little shits out there

Who are you calling little?

edit: I should add

[RickPilot33]

Rick,

I realize it isn't personal and never took it personally, although I do tend to get a little passionate about some debates.

A seasonal job works for me as lifestyle is much more important than hours in my logbook. I make enough money during the season to live comfortably year round, in a place I enjoy living.

I feel that a pilot should never have to struggle financially, right from day one of work with 200-250 hours. If 36k a year is enough to live in your own place with food in the fridge and gas in the car, then great. Some low paying jobs have several other perks like crew housing, company vehicles, subsidized food, which make the low wage much better when compared to a similar wage at a job that doesn't have these benefits.

Lets go back to my breakdown of 32k (17,800NET per year)
That is 1480 Net per month.

Based on several places I have lived, always with roommates, I think a fair guess for rent is around $450 a month, plus probably another $200 average per month for basic utilities. I haven't budgeted in a long time, but lets be generous and say you can survive for $50 a week in groceries, for another $200 a month. Lets assume $50 to fill the gas tank on your car, once every two weeks. Insurance payment is likely around $100 a month. My student loan payment was $300 a month, maybe some people can do that for less, but it is not even accounting for the MIFR that I didn't get right away. This leaves you with $130 a month to do what you want with. That is not accounting for any birthdays, Christmas, car repairs, oil changes, clothes or entertainment whatsoever. In my mind, that is not a liveable wage. Add in a girlfriend and a kid and you haven't got a hope in hell starting out.

On that note, I don't blame the operators that are offering these low wages, it makes good business sense when there is what appears to be a never-ending pool of young pilots willing to accept them as that is the way it "has to be done". Simple answer is, if pilots stop accepting the wages, the employers will be forced to pay more to attract and keep pilots.

Also, the pm you sent me appeared but was deleted by you before I could read it. I think it sits in your outbox until I open it, and then moves to your sent box.

I guess we can say we're on the same page with that one.. I personally Think that 32K/yr is quite frankly a BS salary....IF one had to actually take the salary I hope he/she is getting reasonable per diems like 50$ per day and a good package to go alone... That would make it worth while and probably add a couple of thousand to the annual pay (keeping in mind that its not taxable)

I am happy that we are not pilots in the US because I wouldn't want flying to be as a side job....I agree that there's no money to be made with some of these carriers. The only point I wanted to make is it seems in my experience looking at what's out there, that you need to start with that type of paycheck. IF you already have a family with kids then a career of flying would probably not be a good idea if you're just starting out.

Long story Short I think the carriers will have to start paying more but there will always be those low paying jobs...I hope my experience in life and in flying will allow me to get something decent!!

Good luck to you my friend

Cheers

(thanks about the pm info I am new to this site so I thought It hadn't gone through as it would be the case on Outlook.)

[sstef70]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

[Heisenberg666]

All I can say is you'll be disappointed. It doesn't get better with seniority either.

[tbaylx]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

Shouldn't you have asked those questions before you got hired?

[zulutime]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

Like tbaylx said, that might have been a good question during your interview. However, to simplify I would say that flight scheduling is like realestate, instead of course, location, location, location, it's attitude, attitude, attitude. Many on this forum will give you their opinion. Don't be so quick to hear what they have to say. If you've been hired by Air Georgian, I say, congratulations. Now you have a responsibility to give your job every effort it deserves. The day you feel you can't do that is the day you should hand in your resignation. Until then, work hard, keep your nose clean and stay off the radar and you will look back in ten years with some positive thoughts about your time at Air Georgian.

[sstaurus]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

Maybe you should put some effort into writing legible posts. I can only hope you didn't get hired with a resume that reads like that.

[razorblade]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

Maybe you should put some effort into writing legible posts. I can only hope you didn't get hired with a resume that reads like that.

Thank you! So many people need to fix that sh*t.

[thegrimm]

can anyone tells me what a pilote schedule looks like with Air Georgian
I am suppose to start soon and i wonder what thecondition are
thanks

Like tbaylx said, that might have been a good question during your interview. However, to simplify I would say that flight scheduling is like realestate, instead of course, location, location, location, it's attitude, attitude, attitude. Many on this forum will give you their opinion. Don't be so quick to hear what they have to say. If you've been hired by Air Georgian, I say, congratulations. Now you have a responsibility to give your job every effort it deserves. The day you feel you can't do that is the day you should hand in your resignation. Until then, work hard, keep your nose clean and stay off the radar and you will look back in ten years with some positive thoughts about your time at Air Georgian.

+1

[nottellin]

Probably french or something, lighten up.

[flemmr]

Brampton, Ottawa Aviation Services along with Sault College for the Mentor Program to add to the list.

Any idea if someone from the Waterloo aviation program can get hired on with the Mentor?