Air Canada and Transat announce Updated Purchase Price at $5 per share

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Fanblade
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Fanblade »

One factor that will hamper anything beyond domestic travel is medical insurance that does not exclude Covid. If it remains excluded it will put a real damper into travel except for those who are young or risk takers. If you take the 50 plus out of the travel equation it will hurt.

Me personally, I won’t be leaving the country for leisure until I can purchase insurance. I think this winter is a bit optimistic on that front as concerns of a second wave weigh on the minds of insurance companies. Or the insurance could be prohibitively expensive.
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tintin42
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by tintin42 »

altiplano wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 9:06 am
DanWEC wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 7:54 am An increasing number of analysts today are taking the interesting position that as a whole, leisure travel will rebound more in proportion to domestic flying.
Who? Do you have any links?

Consensus among carriers in the US and at AC is expecting domestic recovery first.
You're right, if I'm not mistaking, even CR said : domestic, leisure and then business. Even if there is a lot of domestic and leisure travel, I think most of the revenue at AC is from businesses. So will the recovery be longer for business carrier like AC than leisure carrier like AT? We can all speculate, but nobody really knows for sure...

On another topic, do you guys know any examples of a buyer wanting to acquire a competitor then, after learning all their secrets, having some control over the major decisions and the shareholders approving the price they decided it wasn't worth it and pulled out of the deal? If there is any, how did it end up for the company that almost got bought? That's a major concern for me if the deal doesn't go through, AC now knows all our strengths and weaknesses and would have a unfair advantage if the two companies continue to compete separately.
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Sharklasers
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Sharklasers »

Yes AC would pay 20-40 million for a peak up the skirt assuming they use their army of lawyers to break up the deal.
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rudder
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by rudder »

tintin42 wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:16 am ....if I'm not mistaking, even CR said : domestic, leisure and then business. Even if there is a lot of domestic and leisure travel, I think most of the revenue at AC is from businesses. So will the recovery be longer for business carrier like AC than leisure carrier like AT? We can all speculate, but nobody really knows for sure...
What CR said was - first domestic. Then trans border. Then international. Those are ‘markets’.

He also said that first travellers would be VFR - visiting friends and relatives. He seemed to be leaning towards family travel as first recovery. Other travel purposes would be either leisure or business. Those would be ‘segments’ of markets.

And as he correctly pointed out, it is not just demand affecting passenger travel recovery. It is how long jurisdictions impose entry/exit restrictions.

He is guessing just like everybody else. But the AC plan will implementing will be based on his guesses.
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Monkey_in_a_suit
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Monkey_in_a_suit »

[/quote]


That would be terrific! AC could spool up their very successful Rouge operation again in response to increased demand, thus foregoing the additional expense of integrating a struggling leisure only carrier.
This would be a benefit for all parties, AC employees would enjoy greater job security, the market would be happy as AC could preserve vital cash which we could use for the restart and offer exceptional deals to entice passengers back. Win Win! Let’s go leisure market!
[/quote]

Im sure that will work out just well for everyone involved. Instead of 1 large merged company working together for the cumbs, everyone can fight for the crumbs separately and everyone can lose. But hey you're couple seniority points are alot more important
Sharklasers wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:31 am Yes AC would pay 20-40 million for a peak up the skirt assuming they use their army of lawyers to break up the deal.
Would it be worth 200, 300, maybe even 400 million when the TRZ shareholder sue AC for damages plus the 40 mill to walk away from the deal. What about the corporate damage caused by the ensuing lawsuit? How much is that worth
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Daniel Cooper
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Daniel Cooper »

160tonoaha wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 7:02 am
altiplano wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 5:37 am
tdp19 wrote: Sun May 03, 2020 5:04 am

I am curious as to you what your seniority is? The more senior you are the less you worry.... Especially in post covid times. Although sharklasers was harsh, i completely agree.
I don't think tonah works at AC. Just pretender with a hate on.
Altiplano, you're incorrect again. I was at some pretty successful world brands before coming home to AC. I am a fairly recent new hire. For what it's worth, I was lucky enough to have offers from both transat and ac around the same time. I elected to go with AC. 2019 hire. I was PFO'd years ago from AC and decided to make a go of it as an ex-pat. Made my money and came home. In hindsight, I should've probably taken the PFO from AC years ago as a hint that I'm not a good fit. The wife and I are talking about leaving as soon as the dust settles again. You know what one of many contributing factors are? Experiencing the attitudes of people like altiplano on a regular basis. Not just at AC, but in Canada as a whole. There exists a very hypocritical, victimized, defensive, passive-aggressive attitude here. Probably cause the population keeps getting screwed over, and have no proper outlet to show their anger. Guess it makes sense that AC pilots would be representing the same when flying the flag since it's becoming the country's identity more and more. It definitely isn't like this with everyone. And some AC guys are phenomenal too. But seriously, a lot of ass holes in the mix as well. My only piece of advice for transat guys, don't let this shit culture change what you guys are bringing. Hopefully, I get the chance to experience it, but I think we probably won't cross paths. Working among colleagues like altiplano, shark, etc, makes one feel like a homeless man standing in line, grasping at straws for the last cup of soup. These types of people are definitely not leaders by example. And they make atrocious people to fly with. All they talk about are contracts, money, pension, transat, and how they didn't get their schedule the way they bid it. I'll leave you with this, I was at one of the M3 before coming home, and although we worked like dogs, there didn't exist this level of ignorance among us. Our brand and world recognition were better as well. Unlike AC, we actually had a reason to be proud of our jobs. Call me a hater all you want, but I bring perspective from working at some classy outfits. And as I've found very quickly, AC definitely isn't one of them. Sorry altiplano for exposing both of our horrible choices in careers :wink: At least I have an out, do you? It's starting to make sense why guys like you you're so defensive :goodman:
Get out of Toronto. The animosity between people and social angst is a direct result of the "cultural mosaic".
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tintin42
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by tintin42 »

Sharklasers wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:31 am Yes AC would pay 20-40 million for a peak up the skirt assuming they use their army of lawyers to break up the deal.
Yes but that's not a lot of money to take down a competitor. AC is losing that every 2 days. They didn't only had a peak, they also had some control. They asked Transat to stop the hotel project, every expense over a certain amount had to be approved (ac even had to approve APU changes). We even had delay on our CBA extension because it had to be approved by AC.

I don't think AC had bad intentions with the deal, but imagine a company that has bad intentions. They pretend to be interested in buying, learn everything about their competitors and even have some control over them, later they pull out the deal and are in a easy position to destroy the company they "wanted" to buy. Again I don't think that was AC's plan, but I hope there is something more than 40 millions to prevent company from doing that.

Again, does anyone know a company that was in a position similar to Transat, the buyer pullout and the company survived?
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Last edited by tintin42 on Tue May 05, 2020 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
FL320
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by FL320 »

Sharklasers wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:31 am Yes AC would pay 20-40 million for a peak up the skirt assuming they use their army of lawyers to break up the deal.
AT will most probably react like Embraer:

« The deal calls for a $100 million breakup fee but Embraer is poised to sue Boeing for significantly more, alleging that the long period of uncertainty has hampered sales of its E2 jets.

It said it would pursue “all remedies” against Boeing, without elaborating. »

You know it would cost way way more than 40 millions to AC...
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DanWEC
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by DanWEC »

All that makes perfect sense re: Ramping up markets at AC.

I mentioned in my post but maybe it wasn't clear. These analysts weren't talking about the chronology of returning markets from day zero, but more how market proportions will change once the smoke clears in the future.

Corporate best practices in the new normal will almost undoubtedly include less office attendance and less domestic business travel for the day-to-day, regardless of the economy.

One the other hand, there is no virtual leisure. (Ha, I should watch my mouth there.)

Leisure will only be affected by overall economic conditions, and in the short-medium term, the hangover conditions of travelling after covid. As was mentioned, insurance, quarantine requirements, etc.

The projections have nothing to do with the short term except for maybe preparedness. Just an interesting perspective I hadn't thought of.
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Sharklasers
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Sharklasers »

FL320 wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 11:14 am
Sharklasers wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:31 am Yes AC would pay 20-40 million for a peak up the skirt assuming they use their army of lawyers to break up the deal.
AT will most probably react like Embraer:

« The deal calls for a $100 million breakup fee but Embraer is poised to sue Boeing for significantly more, alleging that the long period of uncertainty has hampered sales of its E2 jets.

It said it would pursue “all remedies” against Boeing, without elaborating. »

You know it would cost way way more than 40 millions to AC...
I dont 'know' anything of the sort and neither do you. One thing we could agree on is that it will be tied up in the court and appeal system for the better part of a decade if Transat decides to walk that road.

There are numerous outs in the contract aside from the MAE clause related to TRZ solvency and finance obligations which will be difficult to meet if this drags on much longer. This is likely why you were so aggressive in cost cutting at the start of this. Transat is extremely limited in its options for recapitalization and access to credit facilities if it doesnt want to void the deal.

A decade is a long time for a company teetering on the brink of insolvency and maybe your creditors will settle for pennies on the dollar. Maybe AC enters CCAA in that time and *poof* no money for TRZ.

One thing that was said yesterday and repeated today is that AC will put the interests of their customers, employees and shareholders first.
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DanWEC
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by DanWEC »

Don't worry FL320, the purchase will go through since they've always wanted to replace AC Vacations with TS, and they'll simply cleave out all the TS pilots.

Let's play some golf after our first pairing in Ho Chi Minh! lol :partyman:
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jetpilot
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by jetpilot »

Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
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Oxi
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Oxi »

jetpilot wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:11 pm Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
Thats not true
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altiplano
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by altiplano »

jetpilot wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:11 pm Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
I don't think 600 jobs gone is anything to LOL about.
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sanjet
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by sanjet »

jetpilot wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:11 pm Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
Pop the champagne for laid off pilots. I’m some you don’t actually work for TRZ.
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Sharklasers
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Sharklasers »

He views every surplus AC pilot as a little life preserver who’s seat he can grab onto.
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FL320
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by FL320 »

altiplano wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:42 pm
jetpilot wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:11 pm Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
I don't think 600 jobs gone is anything to LOL about.
So what happen to people who’s seniority is not affected by the layoff but are on the MAX; will they still be fully paid while staying at home?
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Last edited by FL320 on Tue May 05, 2020 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
FL-280
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by FL-280 »

jetpilot wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 3:11 pm Just for my friend FL 280


AC reduction bid is out all Rouge position are gone....why you think? lol
I think it's to go around a clause in our contract in pay protections. And I second Sharklasers, you view us as a lifepreservers you can grab to avoid drowning. Its pathetic really. Funny how you have been very quiet in the last while about the stock price of TRZ, the Q1 Call and the comments involving Transat. Does we will refuse from commenting sound good to you?

By the way, 15% reduction is pretty good compared to 100%.... sounds pretty disproportionate to me. This will end either of two ways, you will have to apply at AC BOTL because TS folds or we will see you in court. This is not a great time for our industry, I have not been a saint on this page but man, kicking us tonight out of all nights is pretty low of you, and we wont forget.
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Fanblade
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by Fanblade »

It seems pretty obvious that AC has gone into a holding pattern on the transaction. They will probably just delay, defer, deflect and wait as long as they can.

There probably won’t be any substantial news for quite a while.
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tintin42
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Re: Air Canada and Transat announce Increased Purchase Price to $18 per Share

Post by tintin42 »

Sorry to hear about the 600 position lost 🙁. Are they the 600 that were possible layoff until September in the MOA or they are on top of that? I hope jetpilot was just told that all the pilot were going back to mainline and wasn't aware that it represented layoff because like some of you said it's not something to say lol to.
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