First Max

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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

RRJetPilot wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:03 am Flair CEO was just on CKNW radio in Vancouver (Sunday morning) talking about how he will get foreign pilots with 20-25000 hours coming to work for him. I think he said from the US. :lol: :rolleyes:
No, he didn't say foreign pilots. Listen carefully. Those pilots hired recently (plus more to come) are ALL CANADIANS. As another poster rightly says, they are coming home after work dried up overseas. Please get it right before you start a rumour with no basis in fact.
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Big Pistons Forever
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Re: First Max

Post by Big Pistons Forever »

There is a huge pool of out of work Canadian pilots from China and the Middle East to draw from. What I have heard is every every new hire FO has had over 10 K hours with significant command time. They are obviously hiring future expansion Captains not FO's.
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rudder
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Re: First Max

Post by rudder »

Airbrake wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:42 am
RRJetPilot wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:03 am Flair CEO was just on CKNW radio in Vancouver (Sunday morning) talking about how he will get foreign pilots with 20-25000 hours coming to work for him. I think he said from the US. :lol: :rolleyes:
He said that they are getting half their pilots from Canada and half from overseas. That most have 20-25 years experience and are mostly returning from overseas due to lack of work.
Didn’t mention US pilots or number of flying hours.

https://globalnews.ca/pages//audio-vault-cknw/
Discussion starts at around 8:17 on July 11
Most returning CDN experienced overseas pilots are looking for DEC opportunities.

I believe that currently the only two large aircraft operators that are hiring DEC is Cargojet and Flair.
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Airbrake
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Re: First Max

Post by Airbrake »

Overall the interview felt more like an advertisement then a true interview.

I don’t know the host, but he sure seemed to be sending softball questions to me.
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RRJetPilot
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Re: First Max

Post by RRJetPilot »

I think realitychex or whatever his name is was right.
They are using future ticket sales to pay for current operations and the loan at 18% which is insane. 18% think about that.

They literally have to expand to sell more seats to pay the loan.

I cant imagine with the profit margins in this industry you can afford those kind of loans AND operate Profitably.

I will be very impressed if this company is still around in 1 year. Good luck to all. Sincerely. We have it tough enough as pilots in this country. To keep starting over because the company is doing shady shit is very sad.
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acpaleaks
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Re: First Max

Post by acpaleaks »

Big Pistons Forever wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:55 am There is a huge pool of out of work Canadian pilots from China and the Middle East to draw from. What I have heard is every every new hire FO has had over 10 K hours with significant command time. They are obviously hiring future expansion Captains not FO's.
I know three FOs hired within the last year all without any significant command time and one with zero 705 time.

So I'm not sure where you're getting your information from.
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boeingboy
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Re: First Max

Post by boeingboy »

Of course Realitychecx is right....I've been saying the same thing. ULCC's will not work here, and a rapid expansion from nothing to everything will only bring you down that much faster. Flair has been through multiple owners and operation types since it started - never really finding a footing, very little money do do anything with and now they have a questionable investor that seems to be looking out for their own interests.

They may have been able to cobble through if they limited (slowed) and altered their Canadian expansion.....but full speed ahead and this US expansion just completely does them in I think.
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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

acpaleaks wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:08 pm
Big Pistons Forever wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:55 am There is a huge pool of out of work Canadian pilots from China and the Middle East to draw from. What I have heard is every every new hire FO has had over 10 K hours with significant command time. They are obviously hiring future expansion Captains not FO's.
I know three FOs hired within the last year all without any significant command time and one with zero 705 time.

So I'm not sure where you're getting your information from.
They were hired before Covid when there was a shortage. If they're the ones I'm thinking of, I heard they didn't make the grade and were let go during training.
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acpaleaks
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Re: First Max

Post by acpaleaks »

GRK2 wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:42 pm
acpaleaks wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:08 pm
Big Pistons Forever wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:55 am There is a huge pool of out of work Canadian pilots from China and the Middle East to draw from. What I have heard is every every new hire FO has had over 10 K hours with significant command time. They are obviously hiring future expansion Captains not FO's.
I know three FOs hired within the last year all without any significant command time and one with zero 705 time.

So I'm not sure where you're getting your information from.
They were hired before Covid when there was a shortage. If they're the ones I'm thinking of, I heard they didn't make the grade and were let go during training.
Doesn't sound like the same people. One I know just returned to the line after the "layoffs" and is requalified now. The other two I haven't talked to in ages but I am pretty sure they are all still employed.

It's not really that hard to be a 737 FO... let's be honest.
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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

acpaleaks wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 10:30 pm
GRK2 wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:42 pm
acpaleaks wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:08 pm

I know three FOs hired within the last year all without any significant command time and one with zero 705 time.

So I'm not sure where you're getting your information from.
They were hired before Covid when there was a shortage. If they're the ones I'm thinking of, I heard they didn't make the grade and were let go during training.
Doesn't sound like the same people. One I know just returned to the line after the "layoffs" and is requalified now. The other two I haven't talked to in ages but I am pretty sure they are all still employed.

It's not really that hard to be a 737 FO... let's be honest.
Sooooo. actually not hired in the last year. The last FO's that were hired (my source) all did groundschool a year ago March then were furloughed. Three didn't finish training after being recalled this spring. All hiring since then has been DEC positions. Your claim that being a 737 FO isn't hard depends purely on your attitude. Put in the work? Yes...try to mail it in? Not a hope.
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qwe221sd
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Re: First Max

Post by qwe221sd »

GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 8:05 am
acpaleaks wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 10:30 pm
GRK2 wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:42 pm

They were hired before Covid when there was a shortage. If they're the ones I'm thinking of, I heard they didn't make the grade and were let go during training.
Doesn't sound like the same people. One I know just returned to the line after the "layoffs" and is requalified now. The other two I haven't talked to in ages but I am pretty sure they are all still employed.

It's not really that hard to be a 737 FO... let's be honest.
Sooooo. actually not hired in the last year. The last FO's that were hired (my source) all did groundschool a year ago March then were furloughed. Three didn't finish training after being recalled this spring. All hiring since then has been DEC positions. Your claim that being a 737 FO isn't hard depends purely on your attitude. Put in the work? Yes...try to mail it in? Not a hope.
So...the less experienced pilots were "laid off" or just "furlough"? Flair let them go through training failed?
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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

Same thing. Laid off=furlough. Being furloughed is purely done on a seniority basis. It's done from the bottom up and recalls are done in seniority. (Are you sure you're a pilot?) Flair pilots are unionised so to get terminated during training is a serious deal. Plenty of remedial training given but at some point a decision has to be made. I'm 100% sure other carriers have the same deal.
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qwe221sd
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Re: First Max

Post by qwe221sd »

GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:10 am Same thing. Laid off=furlough. Being furloughed is purely done on a seniority basis. It's done from the bottom up and recalls are done in seniority. (Are you sure you're a pilot?) Flair pilots are unionised so to get terminated during training is a serious deal. Plenty of remedial training given but at some point a decision has to be made. I'm 100% sure other carriers have the same deal.
Thanks for explanation.
Yes, I'm not a pilot , I am planing to do flight training and become a pilot in canada.
What I said is because I am from asia, the management there usually failed pilots during training or sim check who they dislike or want to let go for some reason.
I think it's not going to happen in Canada especially unionised company.
Anyway , I thought they failed by flair was because their capability not policy.
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acpaleaks
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Re: First Max

Post by acpaleaks »

qwe221sd wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 11:36 am
GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:10 am Same thing. Laid off=furlough. Being furloughed is purely done on a seniority basis. It's done from the bottom up and recalls are done in seniority. (Are you sure you're a pilot?) Flair pilots are unionised so to get terminated during training is a serious deal. Plenty of remedial training given but at some point a decision has to be made. I'm 100% sure other carriers have the same deal.
Thanks for explanation.
Yes, I'm not a pilot , I am planing to do flight training and become a pilot in canada.
What I said is because I am from asia, the management there usually failed pilots during training or sim check who they dislike or want to let go for some reason.
I think it's not going to happen in Canada especially unionised company.
Anyway , I thought they failed by flair was because their capability not policy.
I think GRK2 is full of shit. It's next to impossible to get released from a 705 airline in Canada unless you are like bottom of the barrel. And even then, the support there is to get through training is huge. And he says MULTIPLE people were released?

Unlikely.
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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

acpaleaks wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:09 pm
qwe221sd wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 11:36 am
GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:10 am Same thing. Laid off=furlough. Being furloughed is purely done on a seniority basis. It's done from the bottom up and recalls are done in seniority. (Are you sure you're a pilot?) Flair pilots are unionised so to get terminated during training is a serious deal. Plenty of remedial training given but at some point a decision has to be made. I'm 100% sure other carriers have the same deal.
Thanks for explanation.
Yes, I'm not a pilot , I am planing to do flight training and become a pilot in canada.
What I said is because I am from asia, the management there usually failed pilots during training or sim check who they dislike or want to let go for some reason.
I think it's not going to happen in Canada especially unionised company.
Anyway , I thought they failed by flair was because their capability not policy.
I think GRK2 is full of shit. It's next to impossible to get released from a 705 airline in Canada unless you are like bottom of the barrel. And even then, the support there is to get through training is huge. And he says MULTIPLE people were released?

Unlikely.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: You're very uninformed I have to say.
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acpaleaks
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Re: First Max

Post by acpaleaks »

GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:25 pm
acpaleaks wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:09 pm
qwe221sd wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 11:36 am
Thanks for explanation.
Yes, I'm not a pilot , I am planing to do flight training and become a pilot in canada.
What I said is because I am from asia, the management there usually failed pilots during training or sim check who they dislike or want to let go for some reason.
I think it's not going to happen in Canada especially unionised company.
Anyway , I thought they failed by flair was because their capability not policy.
I think GRK2 is full of shit. It's next to impossible to get released from a 705 airline in Canada unless you are like bottom of the barrel. And even then, the support there is to get through training is huge. And he says MULTIPLE people were released?

Unlikely.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: You're very uninformed I have to say.
Well if I am that uninformed, then it sounds like Flair is a pretty shit place to work. Which doesn't surprise me at all.

Based on some of the posters here who work there, I guess it is where bottom barrel pilots go to have a chance after being rejected everywhere else. Or lower time pilots doing whatever they can to get a job, then leave to WJ or AC. I won't fault them.
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GRK2
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Re: First Max

Post by GRK2 »

acpaleaks wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:26 pm
GRK2 wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:25 pm
acpaleaks wrote: Mon Jul 12, 2021 12:09 pm

I think GRK2 is full of shit. It's next to impossible to get released from a 705 airline in Canada unless you are like bottom of the barrel. And even then, the support there is to get through training is huge. And he says MULTIPLE people were released?

Unlikely.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: You're very uninformed I have to say.
Well if I am that uninformed, then it sounds like Flair is a pretty shit place to work. Which doesn't surprise me at all.

Based on some of the posters here who work there, I guess it is where bottom barrel pilots go to have a chance after being rejected everywhere else.
Oh dear, I've ruffled your feathers...Well...sorry not sorry. Unless you have intimate personal knowledge of who posts and works there, or you actually work there yourself, anything you have to say is just empty and stinks like guesswork. I won't use the standard comeback of "What? Didn't get hired?" as a witty comeback because it's old and tired just like your sleepy old "shitty place to work" quip. So tell me, do you know anyone personally at Flair? Do you have access to the latest hire list of pilots? (It's in the media if you want to open your eyes and look for it). Did you take a look at the requirements to get an interview? No? Thought so. I'd say good try but it wasn't. More like a schoolboy mistake.
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