Howard DGA 15P

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Antique Pilot
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Howard DGA 15P

#1 Post by Antique Pilot » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:46 pm

I happened to be on the shuttle bus yesterday from the South Terminal. At the Harbour Air hangar across from the Flying Beaver is a Howard DGA 15P on floats US reg N26J. Aircraft is currently registered to a chap in Fairbanks AK but was for sale awhile ago. Just wondering if anyone knows where it is heading. This Howard was one of the first to be converted to floats by the late Clayton Scott of Renton WA in the late 1950's. I saw it passing through Dease Lake BC in 1972. Beautiful aircraft.

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#2 Post by beech 18 » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:05 am

Feb 12, 2015

Photo of N26J found on the web.
Photo taken in 1973.
Photographer not known.


Image
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#3 Post by Antique Pilot » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:46 am

Thanks very much for the pic. As I mentionned previously I met Clayton Scott and a group of senior Boeing execs when they were in northern BC on tour with this Howard in 1972. Met him again at Renton WA mid 1980's. BY then I had done a bit of research on Mr. SCott. Very accomplished man. During WW2 he was the chief production test pilot at Boeing. He flew more B17's then any other person. He also became Bill Boeing's personal pilot flying him around in a Douglas DC-5, yes a DC-5.

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#4 Post by DHC2eater » Fri Feb 13, 2015 6:17 am

Did you own a Howard at some point AP.....?

Any Pics?

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#5 Post by cook11 » Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:35 am

I met the owner of N26J I believe his name was Dan Owen.... at the Palm Springs Air Musesum this past November. Really interesting guy who was volunteering at the museum. Dan is quite fond of the Howards, he is currently having his second Howard Jobmaster being rebuilt in S. California to an Oshkosh winner and also a Pa-12 Super Cruiser. He showed me a few videos of N26J on his phone and he kept commenting how much better the Howards are compared to the Beaver which he has also owned in the past. I wish I would've gotten his email but I had to go and find my kids......
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#6 Post by Flybabe » Thu Dec 24, 2015 12:04 pm

How opportune!

An ex-coworker of mine just posted this on FB a couple days ago, along with the following link:

... wow...The first Howard DGA-15P that I got to fly at Skylark, N65046 was built in 1942.. I was sure I would never see her again after seeing her land with the top half of her fuselage fabric torn loose and draping from her fin. That was around 1976!

These aircraft were descendants from Benny Howard's famous Bendix Trophy racing 'plane: "Mr. Mulligan" ! "DGA" stood for Damn Good Airplane. The wings were designed with a very slim airfoil that left no room for a fuel tank (they would have 3 to 5 fuel tanks in the belly) and a rather high wing loading (38 lbs/ sq. ft.).

FAR Part 23 Single Engine Airplanes, today must have LESS THAN A 65 Knot STALL..HOWARDS WOULD STALL AROUND 85 KIAS. Ailerons were not differential, which would lead to a snap roll into a spin if you treated her roughly! She would do 160 KIAS WITHOUT A DOOR OR WHEEL PANTS AND ECONO CRUISE! Vne was 250 KIAS. The cabin side windows rolled up and down with a Model A Ford window crank...


http://flightaware.com/photos/view/7033 ... crafttype/
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#7 Post by Antique Pilot » Thu Dec 24, 2015 7:35 pm

cook11 wrote:I met the owner of N26J I believe his name was Dan Owen.... at the Palm Springs Air Musesum this past November. Really interesting guy who was volunteering at the museum. Dan is quite fond of the Howards, he is currently having his second Howard Jobmaster being rebuilt in S. California to an Oshkosh winner and also a Pa-12 Super Cruiser. He showed me a few videos of N26J on his phone and he kept commenting how much better the Howards are compared to the Beaver which he has also owned in the past. I wish I would've gotten his email but I had to go and find my kids......
Well I have a bit of time on the Howard and Beaver. They are both wonderful aircraft but each are quite different in their capabilities. For instance you would not be able to roll a 45 gal drum into a Howard. It can't handle bulky loads like a Beaver. Also the Howard does not have the STOL performance that a Beaver does. You could 3 point a Howard into a short field with full flaps but you will need a lot more room to get out. The flaps are not used for take off. They only provide drag for landing.

The Howard is a great long range fast and comfortable aircraft just like it was designed for back in the 1930's.

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#8 Post by Antique Pilot » Thu Dec 24, 2015 8:02 pm

Flybabe wrote:How opportune!

An ex-coworker of mine just posted this on FB a couple days ago, along with the following link:

... wow...The first Howard DGA-15P that I got to fly at Skylark, N65046 was built in 1942.. I was sure I would never see her again after seeing her land with the top half of her fuselage fabric torn loose and draping from her fin. That was around 1976!

These aircraft were descendants from Benny Howard's famous Bendix Trophy racing 'plane: "Mr. Mulligan" ! "DGA" stood for Damn Good Airplane. The wings were designed with a very slim airfoil that left no room for a fuel tank (they would have 3 to 5 fuel tanks in the belly) and a rather high wing loading (38 lbs/ sq. ft.).

FAR Part 23 Single Engine Airplanes, today must have LESS THAN A 65 Knot STALL..HOWARDS WOULD STALL AROUND 85 KIAS. Ailerons were not differential, which would lead to a snap roll into a spin if you treated her roughly! She would do 160 KIAS WITHOUT A DOOR OR WHEEL PANTS AND ECONO CRUISE! Vne was 250 KIAS. The cabin side windows rolled up and down with a Model A Ford window crank...


http://flightaware.com/photos/view/7033 ... crafttype/
Some information in the link is suspect to me.

The Howard DGA 15's only had 3 belly tanks. Perhaps some were modified but 3 tanks were standard. My manual states that the stall speed is 61 mph. From experience I can confirm that. Cruise speed with 28 inches and 1800 rpm would be 150 mph. This would be reduced to about 145 mph without wheel pants. Approach speed for me would be 85 mph with full flaps and full nose up trim. At 30-40 feet start the flare and reduce power and you would achieve a smooth 3 point landing.

VNE is 270 mph. Fastest my nerve ever allowed was 220 mph IAS.

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#9 Post by Flybabe » Thu Dec 24, 2015 8:32 pm

Can't say, AP. I have no reason to doubt my coworker. He is likely going from memory and not reading from a manual. That said, he is pretty close to what you have indicated!
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#10 Post by Antique Pilot » Thu Dec 24, 2015 9:16 pm

Flybabe wrote:Can't say, AP. I have no reason to doubt my coworker. He is likely going from memory and not reading from a manual. That said, he is pretty close to what you have indicated!
The only number that is close is the VNE. Your friend says 250kts, manual and cockpit placard says 270mph. 250kts = 278 mph.

Your friend says stall of 85kts which is 98 mph. Manual says 61mph. Big difference.

Your friend says Econ cruise of 160 kits or 184 mph. Best Econ cruise I ever got was 145-150 mph.

So Merry Christmas from AP
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#11 Post by BGH » Fri Dec 25, 2015 5:44 pm

I flew in that aircraft this summer as a mechanic friend was warming it up for an oil change.If I remember correctly they were experimenting with full flaps for take off as the high speed wing didn't like the low speeds on floats.Very nice handling aircraft at speed,little sluggish on the controls at the low end.

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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#12 Post by YVRLTN » Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:29 pm

Heres a photo of it at YVR

http://www.flickr.com/photos/23870098@N ... TyL-piaLnK

Theres another one at Langley too, been there a while

http://www.flickr.com/photos/23870098@N ... TyL-piaLnK
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#13 Post by AirFrame » Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:58 am

There was apparently a yellow one at Pitt Meadows yesterday... US Reg again.
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Re: Howard DGA 15P

#14 Post by 900 HP » Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:16 pm

Nice Pic! I brought a couple of Howards down to East Marblehead ( near Detroit) back in 1998 or 1999. They were a trade from the Western Canada Aviation Museum to a guy down there. I delivered them by truck so not much fun until we arrived. He threw me the keys to his Lotus and said "see ya tomorrow morning". I believe he has since restored them.
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