Beaver Tips

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Stearman
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Beaver Tips

Post by Stearman »

Just started flying one as a part time gig. From my regular flying job. But have never flown one before.

Looking for some tips.

Anything would be good. Esspeacially with regards to T/O technique and flap settings, and flying her with a load.
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xsbank
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by xsbank »

Turn your ailerons full deflection and match them with the flaps - ergo bingo TO flaps setting.

Make sure the oil cap is on tight.

Pick the fullest tank (should be the front).

Do a mag check and run the prop through.

Carb heat is essential - check it always.

Hot start - mags on crank and pump the throttle once twice then crack the throttle a half inch. Vroom.

Flaps up before power reduction (I always hated that).

Using primer? Make sure its locked.

NEVER use part-throttle for take-off.

NEVER check mags in flight.

Fuel pressure twitch? Switch tanks!

Get used to her before you use full flaps for landing.

Put your can of Pledge behind your seat cushion at your lumbar area to help with "Beaver Back."

An oil pressure drop that stabilizes at a lower setting means the oil screen is bypassing and she's gonna blow!

NEVER NEVER NEVER take the old gal for granted or she'll finish you off. That wrinkle in the dashboard? Somebody else' forehead who DID take her for granted.

This is fun - might still be able to drive one.....

Almost forgot - 2 good paddles, cans of oil, Pledge, axe, 100 ' rope, float pump, first aid kit, a good sharp knife on your belt (for seat belts and laces) and I'll think of more....
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xsbank
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by xsbank »

Forgot (how could I?) get a good pfd and do the immersion course - could save your life. If you're alive you can help your passengers - your job, right?

I knew a couple of guys who flew Beavers virtually all their careers and they eventually crashed them and killed themselves. She's a great a/c and one that will never forgive, either. Don't get complacent.

Boring Old Fart.................................SWITCH OFF
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Mr. North
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by Mr. North »

Thats some sound advice Xsbank;
Get used to her before you use full flaps for landing.
You can't stress that one enough. Full-flap is probably the most unforgiving configuration a Beaver can be in. Keep plenty of power on if you find yourself in that situation.

Make sure the oil cap is on tight - no big deal if you forget about this one.. it'll make such a mess you'll figure it out pretty quick!!
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xsbank
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by xsbank »

Thanks Mr. North - I'm very surprised that I haven't been jumped all over for these posts - I guess most drivers are hard at it this time of year! Either that or they've all got videotron and they're all crapped out!
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by beaverbob »

I never pump the throttle for start up. Cold or hot. Prime only. 4 to 6 squirts cold 1or 2 warm.
Pumping the throttle increases risk of fire.

However many do pump the throttle, so make sure you only do so with the starter engaged.

I always shut off with the mags and it will then start with no prime or pumping whatever, unless you are too long between shut down and start up.

Bob
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beaverbob
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by beaverbob »

Very important: Never try a level turn exceeding 30 degrees bank without extending some flap. climb flap will do.

Without getting into exact numbers; at some bank angle exceeding 30 degrees the stall speed increases and the airspeed decreases until they are one and the same.

Because the wing is not tapered and has no washout like a Cessna, a turning stall is very abrupt if it does happen.

Bob
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tcraft
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by tcraft »

First, every engine starts different. When they are warm you can start them by pumping the throttle, but make sure it`s turning over a few times before hitting the mags. Cross wind take off with a wind from the left, use climb flap till on the step, then take off flap once on the step.
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ilovelamp
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by ilovelamp »

xsbank wrote:NEVER use part-throttle for take-off.

Why is this?
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polar one
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by polar one »

I had the same thought. On wheels we routinely used 30 inches on take off. Sea level in the arctic and light loads. You simply dont have to run the old engine to red line to perform well. On floats, hot day, full load. You have to think differently.

I suspect that the poster is referring to float flying without thinking through the absoluteness of the statement as it applies to all Beaver flying. It is one of the dangers of giving tips. Get into the habit of only using full power for takeoff and it is easy to forget that if you transition or there are different circumsatances things might be a bit different.

Generally, I kind of liked the tips given
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Stearman
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by Stearman »

I have been on the road for a few days with no access to a computer. I was wondering what kinda of responses I would get from this board.

It sounds like a number of you are Beaver pros, so thanks you for all the tips and keep them coming if ya think of anymore. They are Greatly appreaciated.

I like the airplane so far, she comes off the water pretty nicely, just seem that once that is over... watch out as she is no home sick angel eh.
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by HS-748 2A »

If you ever find you've got that sinking feeling, go for flaps before you worry about power. Flaps are paramount to the whole thing.

Always leave the selector handle in the down position.

The guys who have tried to fly them like a 185 get bit pretty hard.

A high time Beaver driver told me one time, "you don't fly a Beaver, you shepherd it around."
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Last edited by HS-748 2A on Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ilovelamp
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by ilovelamp »

I've got a few questions for some of you beaver vets, Proper use of carb heat, All I know is keep it in the green. Hot days; The oil temp gets right up to redline, Ive had it there twice and its not a great feeling, is this normal on really hot days?
STOL landings with steep approaches; she builds a lot of airspeed when you nose her down, Do you use guys side slip her down? or just let her build that extra speed. Strapping 45 gal. drums in her....all the attach points are low and they like to slide down the barrel after a little while, how do some of you guys do it? thanks for the replys.
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xsbank
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by xsbank »

YOU GUYS!

Using part-throttle on a radial will kill it as fast as any way I know! All of the 'extra' throttle movement and extra noise is pumping raw gas into the cylinders for cooling them to prevent detonation. This is particularly important these days as we are using low-lead fuel. The engine was designed for 80/87 gas and even on that fuel we were never allowed to use low-power for take-off. Why else would we be taking off in Full Rich? You get more power leaned out, but you burn cylinders and valves. I've seen cylinders destroyed by detonation and its ugly. Besides, when you are flying your Beav, is there any other time you want your engine to stop besides being on the ground? Don't tell me you also lean for the take--off (unless you are very high)?

Totally false economy. You are asking the engine to put out significant power with insufficient airflow for cooling. Remember the phrase "air cooled?" These engines have been around almost as long as Cat and you should not try and re-invent the ops manual.

Our engines always went 'on condition' using full take-off thrust every time.

How long are you allowed to use full rated take-off power for? What does the book say? I forget now but I'll put a Guinness on it being 5 minutes.

I'll repeat what I said and I'll stand by it - don't EVER use partial throttle for take-off!
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by Cat Driver »

I'll repeat what I said and I'll stand by it - don't EVER use partial throttle for take-off!
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by angry inch »

XS.... I like my Guinness served slightly cooler than room temp :drinkers: My ancient DeHavilland book says 1 minute at 36.5 inches and 2300RPM. Max continuous is 33.5 inches and 2200.

You seem to have a good memory & good advice about the rest though!!

Fly Safe
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by iflyforpie »

xsbank wrote: I'll repeat what I said and I'll stand by it - don't EVER use partial throttle for take-off!
One caveat I think. Never use a MP more than max power for takeoff.

AFAIK, any engine with boost either has to have a pressure carburetor or fuel injection and meters fuel based on MP, not throttle position. So you will still get fuel cooling at partial throttle if you are at max power (limiting MP) for your particular engine.

For fancy engines with boost controllers, full throttle all the time for sure. But for ground-boosted supercharged engines and fixed-waste gate turbos, full throttle might send jugs flying off depending on what MP it is boosted up too. I've operated a few planes where full-throttle is a no-no as a result of engine limitations...
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by A2G »

xsbank wrote: The engine was designed for 80/87 gas and even on that fuel we were never allowed to use low-power for take-off. Why else would we be taking off in Full Rich? You get more power leaned out, but you burn cylinders and valves. I've seen cylinders destroyed by detonation and its ugly. Besides, when you are flying your Beav, is there any other time you want your engine to stop besides being on the ground? Don't tell me you also lean for the take--off (unless you are very high)?
Wouldn't the extra octane number in the 100LL be more than adequate to prevent detonation on an engine designed for 80/87? That's 13-20 more octane points. You could pretty much double your compression ratio( I don't know what a stock CR on a beaver is so don't quote me on this) and still not detonate with that?
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by xsbank »

Thanks for the clarification, (do I call you Angry or Inch or Mr. Inch or Capt. Angry? I'm confused over the protocol) I did think, while noodling about at work, that 5 minutes would be a looooong time at TO power...

I can remember dynamite hauls to the Queen Charlottes that probably pushed those limits somewhat....

I don't have any crusty old engineers nearby who might remember what a radial engine is, but I am POSITIVE that a reduced-power take-off compromises engine cooling and detonation control.

On a R-2800, wet power was the injection of water-methanol into the intake system so that the mixture could be leaned out. This resulted in about a 300 hp gain, just because of the leaned mixture and the water mixture prevented the engine from melting. Remember that CPAir DC-6 in Prince Rupert that had a 3-going on 4-engine failure when the mechanics put wing-defrosting fluid in the water-meth tanks? I'm showing my age, somewhat.

Reduced-power take-offs are a manifestation of turbines and jet engines and have no effect on a modern turbine. You used to have to use water-meth on those old Darts, but that wore them out faster.

I might be available to pay off that Guinness in a a week or so, at the Flying Beaver - I'll let you know.
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Re: Beaver Tips

Post by mag check »

This is particularly important these days as we are using low-lead fuel. The engine was designed for 80/87 gas
What is it that you are saying here? Detonation limits would obviously be reduced, and 100LL has 4 times more lead than 80/87, so what is so important?
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