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Redneck_pilot86
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 7:38 am 
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Somewhere on here I saw a pic of one tied on the outside of a beaver...Rowdy maybe?


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Mr. North
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:10 pm 
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Redneck_pilot86 wrote:
Somewhere on here I saw a pic of one tied on the outside of a beaver...Rowdy maybe?


I believe it's in "pics from a swamper" thread, although I don't know which of the 63 pages it's on.


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flyinggibbon
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:28 pm 
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I think I could have just developed a solution, using an internal winch (or the winch on the quad), some rope quides to make sure the pull is in the right direction, initially 90 degrees to the fuesalage or best angle in, then in line with it once the front is in, a loading ramp and four of these dolly jacks....

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/mater ... paignId=WP

Should be a two man job then, based on the mechanics I learnt packing countless scrums ( the controlled shunt).

I'm also thinking loading rear first could be a good plan.

I'm still thinking the AN-2, as it's wide, simple and has a really big door, however I will investigate the AN-3 conversion but with a PT-6.

Sorry if this is a little incoherent but it is 0127hrs local.

Best

FG


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Bushav8er
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:59 pm 
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Just as a side, once you get it all figured out, how about posting some pics of your solution?


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zed
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:17 pm 
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Wondering what types of ranges you are planning on carrying these ATV/trailer cobos? Just wanting to confirm that helo's aren't an option for you.


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burhead1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:19 pm 
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HHMMM


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zed
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:12 pm 
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Just checked, you don't have any registered in Australia but a DHC-5 Buffalo would probably fit your bill. But not many around anymore. According to their website Artic Sunwest Charters [http://www.arcticsunwest.com/#/our_fleet] have the only two in Canada. But someone else may be able to pipe up and say whether they are still being flown.

The Buffalo was purpose built for what your talking about. It was made for STOL on rough fields, and its got a ramp so you should be able to drive directly on/off. No special procedures or hassle. And the ramp dimensions are around 230cm by 205 cm, so your ATV and trailers should'nt be an issue in the slightest. Could almost drive two in side by side. But those dimensions are probably a bit off, but probably close enough, unless someone knows what they are exactly.

My understanding is that they made great military aircraft, but economically aren't as good for civil use, outside of some niche markets. Only about 120 were ever built, so its a pretty limited aircraft type. But once again huge grain of salt on my thoughts. I'll leave it to others who've flown or operated them to explain why they aren't in as much use today worldwide.


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Northern Flyer
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 5:18 pm 
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I think the Buffalo would have the capacity to haul all their quads, trailers and men at the same time. I had one of arctic sunwests buffalo's hauling drill rigs a reserve, and I was hauling them into a lake with an otter. They were an awesome aircraft but way too big and I believe the original poster was looking for a single.


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zed
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:32 pm 
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Ahh. Missed that part... "single or light twin" :oops: Suppose the Buffalo would be a bit of overkill... :smt040 Unless they had move a half dozen or more all at once, with trailers, gear and the people.


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square
PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:19 am 
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Well the way people always got quads into Caravans where I worked was to show up with a quad and tell the company to get it there. You're not buying an aircraft are you? Let the pilots work it out. You just wheel it in however far you can, lift + shift the back end to align it, pull the quad forward, lift + shift the back end again, pull the quad forward.. until it's in. We even got one into the amphib babyvan, which was offloaded at destination into a fishing boat.


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flyinggibbon
PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:55 am 
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Of course photo's and in this modern age, video's will be posted, only fair to put the result of this thinktank back into the general pool.

Helo's were considered but having done a lot of work with green painted ones in the past, underslung loads are a nightmare and the logistical support for anything that could carry a quad internally would also not be the best, there are various other reasons why this is not desirable as well.

As far as twin's are concerned, we're looking at CASA-212 to provide medium lift, ie 4wd pickup's etc, however, to use these to deliver the atv's would not be efficient as we need to drop a single quad team at several diferent locations so to use the 212 would mean putting a large amount of landing/takeoff cycles through the airframe etc.

Out of interest I note that Antonov are refurbishing old AN-2's up to AN-3 standard with a Glushenkov TVD-20M turboprop and modern avionics, which could be the perfect aircraft for the task as the later aircraft were produced in Poland, which is now in the European Union so they are not the pain in the arse to get on the commercial register everyone thinks (the EU has bilateral agreements with most countries aviation bodies), I've just dropped an email onto Antonov to get a rough order of magnitude (ball park figure, I still speak army I'm afraid) on these, it also struck me if they're being refurbished it might be worth seeing whether they can put a wider cargo hatch in and also whether they could use something like a PT-6 instead of the TVD-20M, I've a feeling the first would be possible whilst the second would drive the cost into pilatus PC-12 land, does anyone have any experience on turbine swaps in an airframe and the certification thereof?

Thanks once again,

FG


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Northern Skies
PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:51 am 
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I hauled several full-sized quads last summer in a De Havilland Otter on floats. It is not too challenging a job, can be done best with two or three people. There is nothing fancy required, basically a couple of boards is all. It takes about 10 minutes, much easier than tricky loads like large industrial generators, etc.

My advice is not to worry when you read the dimensions, trying to make it work on paper will give you a headache. I reality, the crux is when turning the corner after getting it through the door. If it doesn't fit in a straightforward way, you can briefly lift one side of the vehicle so that its width is oriented diagonally while rounding the corner.

I have only done the job on an otter. If you were in canada, i would wholeheartedly recommend one. However, an AN-2 or Caravan will do the job, and your decision comes down to what is available, and what works best for your operations.


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mag check
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:20 am 
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Any Fairchild Husky's for sale? That would be perfect, just open the rear doors, and drive it in.


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beaverbob
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:18 am 
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Mr. North wrote:
Redneck_pilot86 wrote:
Somewhere on here I saw a pic of one tied on the outside of a beaver...Rowdy maybe?


I believe it's in "pics from a swamper" thread, although I don't know which of the 63 pages it's on.



Could it have been a Seadoo?
BB


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rudeboy
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:36 am 
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anyone ever see a snowmobile in a similar type plane?


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Redneck_pilot86
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:49 am 
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smaller sleds are commonplace in the caravan, seen them in the twin otter, im sure they fit just fine in a single otter.


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Northern Flyer
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 6:08 am 
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Have hauled plenty of sleds. The big wide track working sleds, I used to take off windshield and handlebars, lay it on its side and slide her into the old otter. I would just leave it on its side for the trip. If all else failed or I needed to move a few a shorter distance you could pull the doors off the back and back her in sideways and just let her hang out a bit. Lots of fun...


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Maynard
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:14 am 
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It would have to be a pretty small quad to fit into a 206.....this pic is a 207


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nofate
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:22 pm 
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How about a Shorts Skyvan? They have the capacity and would be easy to load. There are several in Oz as listed here...

http://www.aussieairliners.org/bristol/skyvan.htm


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Bushav8er
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:37 pm 
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rudeboy wrote:
anyone ever see a snowmobile in a similar type plane?
Hell, I've had them in the 185, granted the Elan with skis and windscreen removed.


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fish4life
PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:46 am 
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nofate wrote:
How about a Shorts Skyvan? They have the capacity and would be easy to load. There are several in Oz as listed here...

http://www.aussieairliners.org/bristol/skyvan.htm



apparently these guys operate them to
http://www.sydneyskydivers.com.au/?page=

What kind of STOL do you need roughly? how long / what will you be landing on primarily?


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burhead1
PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 5:34 pm 
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nofate wrote:
How about a Shorts Skyvan? They have the capacity and would be easy to load. There are several in Oz as listed here...

http://www.aussieairliners.org/bristol/skyvan.htm


The wing on that thing is disturbing, seems kinda small


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angry inch
PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:14 pm 
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The Skyvan gets a significant amount (30 percent, I think..) of lift from the fuselage. If you look at it broadside, you'll notice it has an airfoil shape to it... hence the smaller wings.


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DHCdriver
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 3:32 am 
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Can't go wrong with choosing our Canadian classic's the Twin and single Otters.


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DHCdriver
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 3:35 am 
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burhead1 wrote:
HHMMM


Thats funny, you might want to shade out that registration :D


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