Weekend Annuals.

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wrenchturnin
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Weekend Annuals.

Post by wrenchturnin »

So I've registered a business name, have my liability insurance all lined up and plan to do annuals on weekends. My first question is about tooling, I know I need a calibrated torque wrench/compression tester and RPM checker but what are you guys doing for a master compass for the swing? They seem to run 1500$! Is there a cheaper master compass option? And i'm not talking compass roses or swinging with the HSI I mean a cheaper master compass unit. And where in Canada can I ship my tools to be calibrated? (I know probably that these tools will come calibrated for the first year). Also will a 5 or 6 CFM 30 gallon electric air compressor run the compression tester?

Thanks Guys!
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ahramin
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by ahramin »

My compression tester says at least 15 cmf at 125 psi. Torque wrenches discussed here:

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopi ... 27&t=98727

A $1500 master compass sounds like a good deal. I don't imagine you could find cheaper. At that price does it come with a tripod though? Non-magnetic ones can be quite expensive.

What did you decide on for a spark plug tester?
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wrenchturnin
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by wrenchturnin »

I'm not going to use one, when I worked on airplanes, of the 4 years of M1 annuals at 2 different places we never tested spark plugs, only cleaned and gapped.
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Meecka
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by Meecka »

wrenchturnin wrote:I'm not going to use one, when I worked on airplanes, of the 4 years of M1 annuals at 2 different places we never tested spark plugs, only cleaned and gapped.
Are you serious!? :shock:
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wrenchturnin
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by wrenchturnin »

Show me where in 625 its says anything further than a mag drop that has anything to do with spark plug testing
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crazyaviator
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by crazyaviator »

IF the plugs come off the engine working specktacoulously,,then WHY test them,,,clean and regap and install ( doing annuals for 30 years)
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GyvAir
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by GyvAir »

ahramin wrote:At that price does it come with a tripod though? Non-magnetic ones can be quite expensive.
I've never seen a tripod used for doing compass swings, only hand held. I could see a monopod as possibly being helpful, but I picture a tripod as being quite cumbersome to get positioned accurately throughout the process, unless it was on casters or something.
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groncher
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by groncher »

Agreed, testing may not be required by CAR625. However, if you do have an excessive mag drop, it might be nice to know if one of the plugs is at fault, rather than just replacing them at a fairly large expense.

And if you happen to be using a Cessna 172 checklist... part of 100 hour

22 Spark Plugs - Remove. clean, analyze. test. gap, and
rotate top plugs-to-bottom and bottom plugs-to-top.
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iflyforpie
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by iflyforpie »

I've had dead plugs on the tester. Mind you, I've had dead plugs on the plane, too. Plug testing is a time-saver... saving you from installing all of the plugs, pushing the plane out, running it up, then having a problem.

One thing to remember is that a plug tester--like a compression check--only approximates the conditions in the combustion chamber. The actual pressures and temperatures when they fire are much higher... meaning that you can still have a plug pass the tester but fail in the aircraft.

Another thing--which is kind of highlighted by Meecka's comment--is asking yourself or the person teaching you why we do things and what regs or paperwork there is to back up doing that procedure. There are an awful lot of weird things that people come up with in aviation and lots of them keep going because 'that's the way we've always done it'. The guy who taught me to clean plugs made a half-day ritual out of it... and it took years of reading, asking other mechanics, and personal experience to cut it down to 15 min for a dozen plugs with very few problems.
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Jungle Jim
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by Jungle Jim »

I get doing an inspection on the weekend but what happens when the plane needs more work done that can't be squeezed into the weekend? Does it sit until the following weekend?

Just wondering.

Jim
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iflyforpie
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by iflyforpie »

What could possibly go wrong?
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photofly
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by photofly »

An annual inspection is an inspection. Inspect, give the owner a list of defects, sign the inspection as done.

Having "work done" is not part of the inspection.
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crazyaviator
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by crazyaviator »

An annual inspection is an inspection. Inspect, give the owner a list of defects, sign the inspection as done.
Not quite correct! Any and all airworthiness related defects MUST be entered in the Journey logbook ( If they are not rectified on the annual ) , NOT scribbled on a sheet of paper. Any one of the entered defects may invalidate the Aircraft airworthiness and void the insurance coverage. An accident resulting from the owner flying the plane may have Criminal// $$$ implications.

So, yes, you can scribble out non airworthiness defects ( like a torn seat fabric ) OR include them in a formal work order, referenced in the logbooks, BUT you CANNOT do that with airworthiness defects!

There is only 1 AMO in Canada that I know of that does things by the book Thats Skytek in Vernon BC
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CID
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by CID »

Cheap inspection, cheap results. I'm not crazy about the tone of the original post.
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dirtdr
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by dirtdr »

I didn't see anywhere in the original post about cheap anything... just a guy looking to do a little bit of airplane work on the weekends between his other commitments.

I know I could use a guy like that to help with some of the little things that pop up on my airplane between annuals instead of letting them pile up.
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Broken Slinky
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by Broken Slinky »

crazyaviator wrote:There is only 1 AMO in Canada that I know of that does things by the book Thats Skytek in Vernon BC
Not taking anything away from Keith, I know of a couple AMOs/AMEs that are by the numbers.
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GyvAir
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by GyvAir »

CID wrote:Cheap inspection, cheap results. I'm not crazy about the tone of the original post.
dirtdr wrote:I didn't see anywhere in the original post about cheap anything... just a guy looking to do a little bit of airplane work on the weekends between his other commitments.

I know I could use a guy like that to help with some of the little things that pop up on my airplane between annuals instead of letting them pile up.
I’m a little confused by your comment too, CID.
I see a guy who’s looking to do things correctly and trying to ask the right questions to make sure he does, without unnecessarily breaking the tool bank in order to do so.
There are lots of guys out there doing annuals, or at least signing them out, without a care in the world for having calibrated tools, proper consumables, a facility to work in, etc. Not to mention, a basic understanding of what liability they are taking on.
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hoptwoit
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by hoptwoit »

I understand a startup business needs to spend money wisely however. If my funds were limited and I was saving money on tools I would forgo a master compass and spend the money on a plug cleaner tester. I would make sure that the engine turning the big fan that keeps the pilot cool stays running. Pilots get lost regardless of the magnetic compass accuracy myself included. So for tools at minimum that means a good crank angle finder (tdc finder) , a mag timer, a differential pressure tester, a prop tach tool and a plug cleaner tester. These will cover the inspection part of the tools you will need more if there is a problem and you need to start troubleshooting.
Just my 2 cents.
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ahramin
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by ahramin »

Am I the only one here who thinks a boroscope is going to be necessary sooner rather than later?
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iflyforpie
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by iflyforpie »

No.... a borescope is an ESSENTIAL part of engine maintenance. I'd take a borescope before a compression tester.... and do a 'poor man's compression test' instead. I've actually done that a few times when ferrying aircraft that have sat for a long time where I didn't have access to maintenance facilities.
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comfail
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by comfail »

Ifly, what make of borescope works well for your typical small lyc/continental? I've tried a couple different cheaper units but image quality and positioning of the camera is almost impossible (o-200 cylinder).
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wrenchturnin
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by wrenchturnin »

hoptwoit wrote:I understand a startup business needs to spend money wisely however. If my funds were limited and I was saving money on tools I would forgo a master compass and spend the money on a plug cleaner tester. I would make sure that the engine turning the big fan that keeps the pilot cool stays running. Pilots get lost regardless of the magnetic compass accuracy myself included. So for tools at minimum that means a good crank angle finder (tdc finder) , a mag timer, a differential pressure tester, a prop tach tool and a plug cleaner tester. These will cover the inspection part of the tools you will need more if there is a problem and you need to start troubleshooting.
Just my 2 cents.
How do you propose I swing the compass legally then?
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hoptwoit
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by hoptwoit »

You are right. Get a master compass. I don't know what I was thinking. You absolutely cannot do without one.
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dstechnical
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by dstechnical »

On compass swing . Could you swing a compass with GPS
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GyvAir
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Re: Weekend Annuals.

Post by GyvAir »

dstechnical wrote:On compass swing . Could you swing a compass with GPS
Short answer: No. Not approved. Not practical.
Look about 20 topics down the list where this was recently discussed.
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