Future AME Discouraged

[Schimunga]

So who's fault is it that the AME is accepting that kind of wage and benefits? Definitely not AC's. To have people criticizing companies for poor wages when you have been stuck at one place accepting only a dollar raise over 10 years and to loose a week of vacation is hogwash. I think you have to start looking in the mirror and see where the problem really is.

[SeptRepair]

I checked out BCIT's tuition and the cost for all 4 terms is approx 10k including student dues etc. The cost of living cant be included because regardless of where you take your schooling or what you take it is a cost that you will endure. So to me, 10k for an education that you can expect to get about 20/hr to start, really isnt all that bad. But finding a job in this profession that is saturated with a bunch of 20 somethings fighting for a job opening is the real problem. Supply and demand my friends. The puppy mill I call BCIT is pushing out graduates every 8 weeks ( according to their website).

[iflyforpie]

So who's fault is it that the AME is accepting that kind of wage and benefits? Definitely not AC's. To have people criticizing companies for poor wages when you have been stuck at one place accepting only a dollar raise over 10 years and to loose a week of vacation is hogwash. I think you have to start looking in the mirror and see where the problem really is.

The thing is, I think a lot of AC employees have been hypnotized by the way things were and are holding out for more that isn't going to come. They gave up a lot to keep the company solvent. They are hoping that once things get better they will get something back.

If you have ten years in a company, a pension plan, a seniority number, you don't just throw it away. Add on to that a house, family and friends, familiarity, and there is a lot of pressure to stay. Hold out for more? Sure, but once a collective agreement is in place you have to wait until it is up. And for strike action... well... people are so up to their eyeballs in debt and obligations that they don't seem to make much of a stand.

I checked out BCIT's tuition and the cost for all 4 terms is approx 10k including student dues etc. The cost of living cant be included because regardless of where you take your schooling or what you take it is a cost that you will endure. So to me, 10k for an education that you can expect to get about 20/hr to start, really isnt all that bad. But finding a job in this profession that is saturated with a bunch of 20 somethings fighting for a job opening is the real problem. Supply and demand my friends. The puppy mill I call BCIT is pushing out graduates every 8 weeks ( according to their website).

Mine cost 7K 12 years ago and it was effectively covered by a Grant (3rd semester Student loan was forgiven) so other than time and tools it didn't really cost me anything.

[billy ray valintine]

So who's fault is it that the AME is accepting that kind of wage and benefits? Definitely not AC's. To have people criticizing companies for poor wages when you have been stuck at one place accepting only a dollar raise over 10 years and to loose a week of vacation is hogwash. I think you have to start looking in the mirror and see where the problem really is.

i really think you missed the point,Schimunga,i don't understand your response.
AME'S have given up a lot over the years(not only at A/C),and have received nothing in return for their efforts,just more cuts.
if the AME has to constantly give back to a company due to money saving etc,why would anyone get into this field? that just equals a low wage.
keep chasing the rainbow because at the end of it.....the owner(s)running away with the pot of gold.
bobby milton ring a bell?.....(and many more)
the money is going to upper management,they never seem to lose!,just the poor AME who has to start over and over and over again.

brv

[c170b53]

Most guys now have something going on the side and continue to work at AC for the benefits and pension. The wheels have come off the wagon, but it still continues to be dragged along. One good bump will be all it takes.
Smengy get a new lure.

[Stumper]

So who's fault is it that the AME is accepting that kind of wage and benefits? Definitely not AC's. To have people criticizing companies for poor wages when you have been stuck at one place accepting only a dollar raise over 10 years and to loose a week of vacation is hogwash. I think you have to start looking in the mirror and see where the problem really is.

Wow... Who would ever have guessed that the solution was right in front of us the entire time. I don't work for AC but my situation is very similar. I'm all in with your plan.

Could you just please direct me where to go to do better??/ Every job I seem to be able to find offers even less then I'm making now or wants me to move to Nigeria or spend six months at a time in the bush away from my family.

Where is this land of milk and honey???

[PJ1]

"The thing is, I think a lot of AC employees have been hypnotized by the way things were and are holding out for more that isn't going to come. They gave up a lot to keep the company solvent. They are hoping that once things get better they will get something back.

If you have ten years in a company, a pension plan, a seniority number, you don't just throw it away. Add on to that a house, family and friends, familiarity, and there is a lot of pressure to stay. Hold out for more? Sure, but once a collective agreement is in place you have to wait until it is up. And for strike action... well... people are so up to their eyeballs in debt and obligations that they don't seem to make much of a stand."



+1 I have to agree

[MjrPainless]

The puppy mill I call BCIT is pushing out graduates every 8 weeks ( according to their website).

Not to sure where you found that info...Because when i have been on the website looking at the AME-E (its the course that i was going to take) site the course is 50 weeks one only has one intake as far as i know. But from reading this forum and everyone responding, im seriously rethinking about this job, and i might for something else.

But if there is anyone who would be willing to let me shadow them for a couple of days, let me know!!! I just wanna get a first hand look at what the job entails!

[MjrPainless]

The puppy mill I call BCIT is pushing out graduates every 8 weeks ( according to their website).

Not to sure where you found that info...Because when i have been on the website looking at the AME-E (its the course that i was going to take) site the course is 50 weeks one only has one intake as far as i know. But from reading this forum and everyone responding, im seriously rethinking about this job, and i might for something else.

But if there is anyone who would be willing to let me shadow them for a couple of days, let me know!!! I just wanna get a first hand look at what the job entails!

[SeptRepair]

http://www.bcit.ca/files/pdf/admission/ ... uition.pdf . What I quoted was for the m course, but rereading it looks like the ame e course is a couple grand less. Here is the part I was getting my information from about the graduation rate. As well, the information about the graduation rate was for the M program. Here is a quote from their website.

"The Program
The program consists of 16 continuous months with short breaks in December and August. Approximately 50 per cent of the day is spent on theory discussions in a classroom setting, followed by hands-on practical training in the shops and hangar located at BCIT state of the art Aerospace Technology Campus. The program is designed to follow a national/international set of standards and is approved by Transport Canada (TC) and the Canadian Aviation Maintenance Council (CAMC). Successful completion of the diploma program will result in an experience credit of 18 months (of the 48 months) required by TC to obtain an AME M license. Successful graduation from this program may qualify you for national certification from TC and CAMC.

This program has multiple start dates throughout the year, with an intake and a graduation every eight weeks.'

[MjrPainless]

Ahh ok, thanks for the clairification, you scared me for a second!

[ourkid2000]

One thing everyone has to keep in mind here.....

You will not start off at $20 per hour in this business, well not likely anyways and definitely not if you work for an airline. I was several years in before I reached that level. Even when I started with Jazz I already had 3 years experience and they brought me in at $16 bucks an hour.

When I started at Canjet, I was only making $15 an hour......this is only a few years ago now. I took a couple different jobs after I left there and I still didn't make $16 per hour.

So yeah, to spend that kind of money on an education for these wages doesn't jive for me.

[Schimunga]

BRV--my point is that AME's have to stop accepting what these companies are dishing out. As a contractor and after my third fall season in a row wondering if I have a job over the winter(not to mention losing sleep over it) I said "screw this, there has got to be something more stable out there". So I decided to leave aviation. I went out to see what kind of job I can get with the skills I learned from being an aircraft mechanic. I ended up working for a company servicing and rebuilding industrial air compressors. Starting wage...$33/hr. They were happy to have me aboard because of the skills I learned from being an AME. Just think of all the things you do in your daily routines at work. Read electrical diagrams, installation diagrams, sheet metal repairs, composite repairs, using small measuring devices like micrometers and calipers to measure run-outs or wear on a blade pin bolts, using vib equipment and the list goes on. There are many companies out there who would love to have those skills in there employees and are willing to pay good money for it.

So BRV do you use any skills from being an AME and use them at your new job? Probably use a few I would think and now you have a job that you love. That is what I was trying to say. AME's have many skills that can be used outside of aviation and can make a good living from it. So if AME's are tired of how life is in the industry, walk away from it or if you stay and eat what these companies are feeding you then you can't blame anyone but yourselves.

And Stumper, I didn't have to go to Nigeria to make $350 a day, I made that in Alberta and I wasn't in the bush for six months either.

[ourkid2000]

Great post Schimunga!

[hella_bright]

Yes, the aviation industry sure didn't turn out to be everything I had hoped it would be... or was told it would be! Every time I drive by Stevenson Aviation here in YWG I'm tempted to burst into the classrooms and yell "STOP! You're all making a huge mistake!! Get out before you regret it 10 years from now!" But they wouldn't listen. The instructors have them all convinced how glorious it will be, just like me and everyone else that's gone through there. They should be ashamed.

[Stumper]

And Stumper, I didn't have to go to Nigeria to make $350 a day, I made that in Alberta and I wasn't in the bush for six months either.

350 per day / most likely a industry standard 12hr shift = just over 29 per hour. It seems it was contract so no benefits, o/t rate, training, vacation, pension, etc to figure in and you're responsible for your own insurance/workers comp payments.

And what are the working conditons to be had while raking in this kings ransom?

As a contractor and after my third fall season in a row wondering if I have a job over the winter(not to mention losing sleep over it) I said "screw this

What a dream opportunity, the line up starts behind me everyone...

Sarcasm aside, I'm in full agreement with your point that getting out of this screwed up industry is the answer. Good on you for having the balls and the good sense to make the move.

More and more good experienced AME's are coming to the same conclusion and voting with their feet. I will as well when the right opportunity arises. The lack of qualified people won't likley force the industry conditons to improve unfortunately. The industry will just lobby the goverment to import more cheap foreign labour as "they are unable to find enough qualified people within Canada" as they have done in the past. That along with the momentum towards watering down our license should be more then enough to supply the companys with enough cheap warm bodys to sign the books to keep the metal in the air and costs low. No one will care how badly safety is being compromised until it's to late.

[billy ray valintine]

BRV--my point is that AME's have to stop accepting what these companies are dishing out. As a contractor and after my third fall season in a row wondering if I have a job over the winter(not to mention losing sleep over it) I said "screw this, there has got to be something more stable out there". So I decided to leave aviation. I went out to see what kind of job I can get with the skills I learned from being an aircraft mechanic. I ended up working for a company servicing and rebuilding industrial air compressors. Starting wage...$33/hr. They were happy to have me aboard because of the skills I learned from being an AME. Just think of all the things you do in your daily routines at work. Read electrical diagrams, installation diagrams, sheet metal repairs, composite repairs, using small measuring devices like micrometers and calipers to measure run-outs or wear on a blade pin bolts, using vib equipment and the list goes on. There are many companies out there who would love to have those skills in there employees and are willing to pay good money for it.

So BRV do you use any skills from being an AME and use them at your new job? Probably use a few I would think and now you have a job that you love. That is what I was trying to say. AME's have many skills that can be used outside of aviation and can make a good living from it. So if AME's are tired of how life is in the industry, walk away from it or if you stay and eat what these companies are feeding you then you can't blame anyone but yourselves.

And Stumper, I didn't have to go to Nigeria to make $350 a day, I made that in Alberta and I wasn't in the bush for six months either.

Schimunga,
now that post i understood.
good for you for getting out and moving on,feels good doesn't it!
when i decided to call it a day,i finished my shift,got in my car and drove away from that shit hole for the last time. felt like the weight of the world was lifted off my shoulders.
AME'S are very talented people,and can use their skills in many industries.
i was like many here who had debt,mortgage,family etc and had to stay in aviation. when i look back,it wasn't a wise decision to stay,but i too was trapped but it payed the bills.(almost).
there is definitely life after aviation.

brv

[Schimunga]

Sorry Stumper but being in helicopters you don't do 12 hour shifts. Its 8 to 5 unless your out in the field.

[212wrench]

And in helicopters, with endorcements, in the field it is not to difficult to make $600 per day and live in hotels with per Diem thrown in. I know folks are going to call bull on this "but its the facts Jack."

[ourkid2000]

There's no doubt about it, helicopters are in a different world........

It's the airlines that are breaking down our trade (in my opinion anyways)