Jet/Turboprop 2nd IC hours VS Cessna PIC hours for staring pilot

Peachtrees · Post by **Peachtrees** » Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:11 pm

If you have a choice which hours would you pick between small jet/Turboprop hours as a first officer vs PIC time as an instructor?

As a CPL/MIFR with around 300hours, I know that I'm going to need PIC time in order to upgrade to an ATPL and get a job in the left seat later down the line.

Get a job and fly as a SIC for a few years or should i just get an instructor rating to get some PIC then worry about airline job later down the line?

fish4life · Post by **fish4life** » Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:27 pm

Get the turbo-prop time now, most instructors need to go fly them after getting instructing hours anyway.

Ki-ll · Post by **Ki-ll** » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:11 pm

Why not do both?

Cessna driver · Post by **Cessna driver** » Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:51 am

i went the instructor -> turbo prop route, which in turn actually worked out for me, got upgraded to captain in a year and a half, the instructing time got me all of the PIC time and then right seat turbo prop got me the rest of the time for the AAs, we dont fly very much where im at so the instructing time was well worth it

rentdressyk · Post by **rentdressyk** » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:41 am

Would you be able to claim ag endorsement if only working for an ag company as groundcrew or at any time as long as you have cpl?

goingnowherefast · Post by **goingnowherefast** » Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:53 am

Jet/Turboprop FO for sure. Even the high time instructors go to the SIC seat of a turboprop once in the 703/704 world. Most 703 aircraft don't require an ATPL anyway, so you will get the PIC requirements once you upgrade there.

Now if you like instructing and want to do that, then definitely do it. Once you are into the 703/704/705 world, past instructors usually make better training captains. Class 1, 2 and 3 instructor ratings look really good on a resume, especially if you are an ex-CFI.

If you are instructing just to build time, it's probably not a good idea. You'll hate your job and your students won't be getting the best instruction.

HansDietrich · Post by **HansDietrich** » Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:59 pm

If you want to go the airline route:
- Fastest way to a turboprop / jet and 1500 hrs on it
- Write your AAs
- Fastest way to get the 150 hrs PIC (100 can be PICUS once you're in at a regional) so you can ge those 250 hrs for the AAs
- Get that seniority number in
- ENJOY LIFE - STOP CHASING METAL

Pt6-42 · Post by **Pt6-42** » Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:20 pm

HansDietrich wrote:If you want to go the airline route:
- Fastest way to a turboprop / jet and 1500 hrs on it
- Write your AAs
- Fastest way to get the 150 hrs PIC (100 can be PICUS once you're in at a regional) so you can ge those 250 hrs for the AAs
- Get that seniority number in
- ENJOY LIFE - STOP CHASING METAL

Avcanada needs the like button, about 1000 hr into this goal right now

kmf.kenif · Post by **kmf.kenif** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 8:32 am

I took the instructing route. I got my CPL, Instructor's Rating, and Multi/Sea Endorsement prior to part-time instructing during my last year at university. Then when I graduated, and able to fully engage myself in this career path, I moved to a larger school to work full time.

Instructed for two years and got my Instrument Rating somewhere in the middle, and changed to another FTU employer. I got in a SIFR job in a Caravan, four months in became a line indoc Capt. Another 15 months in became a BE02 FO/ and Caravan Training Pilot. Finally, fast forward to today, with 8 more additional months cross trainer as a Captain on both machines. That was what I did, to paint you a picture.

I know of another pilot who routed through the turbo-prop company. Flew max duty for two years to then come back on a smaller machine to get PIC before moving to the airlines. Without giving you too much details, all roads lead to Rome.

Good luck

SuperchargedRS · Post by **SuperchargedRS** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:19 pm

Having your first job be a PIC job will make you a better pilot.

As far as trying to get into "the airlines" a month or so faster, whatever.

If I were on the hiring panel, I'd hire a pilot, not a copilot, the judgement and decision making skills a single pilot IFR guy, or a backcountry single pilot guy will have, it's like comparing a CPL to a pre solo student.

If you make the best out of the journey, don't try to rush everything, you'll end up better at your craft, you'll have a better QOL and enjoy the ride, that is if you got into aviation for the right reasons

altiplano · Post by **altiplano** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:18 am

I disagree with that.

You should absolutely get PIC experience during your development as a pilot - but it doesn't have to be your first job necessarily... and single pilot jobs only ultimately won't get you to the airlines.

There are lots of great pilots who started their career as an FO - and you're going to learn a lot even as SIC.

If I was on the hiring board, I'd hire the guy that has a diverse background, including PIC, with a history of working well with other pilots (multicrew) over the single engine instructor, SPIFR guy anyday.

atphat · Post by **atphat** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 8:41 am

What are the right reasons to get into aviation?

SuperchargedRS · Post by **SuperchargedRS** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 8:46 am

altiplano wrote:I ... and single pilot jobs only ultimately won't get you to the airlines.

Now I may be a little south of you, but all my hours (ATPL a few times over) are PIC, I could walk into a airline job if I wanted to go that route.

altiplano wrote: I'd hire the guy that has a diverse background, .

So all the kids who went from mom basement to a college flight program, to a FO wouldn't be getting a job lol

The guys with diverse backgrounds (dictionary definition, not new age soft shoed definition) would likley be found in the bush, or the more odd ball flying jobs, which are mostly PIC gigs.

altiplano wrote: with a history of working well with other pilots (multicrew) over the single engine instructor, SPIFR guy anyday.

A history of working well with others LMAO!

For one that's not a quantifiable attribute, but it is something a experienced person should be able to tell in about 5 minutes from just talking to the person.

And working well with others, you'll find much more socially developed people tend to be the ones who would work more with clients, it's easy to deal more experienced pilots in aviation matters, it takes more skill to do the same when your "boss"/client doesn't even know about aviation. If you want someone who can really handle dealing with humans, hire someone who worked high end sales.

atphat wrote:What are the right reasons to get into aviation?

Someone who would love to fly a J3 across the country

Someone who would rather work in normal clothes than wear little gold bars

Someone who doesn't go by their title

Someone who truly enjoys aviating

Someone who is always looking to add to their plots license, gliders, gyros, sea, whatever.

altiplano · Post by **altiplano** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 10:34 am

Supercharger, your creative editing of my quotes is off... maybe you didn't read it well... All that time talking to yourself is having lasting effects...

You should absolutely get PIC experience during your development as a pilot

I'd hire the guy that has a diverse background, including PIC

Of course command time is important and I stated as such, but if you think that an instructor or single pilot job will take you all the way in this career you're wrong. It will typically get you a right seat job in a turbine twin...

I logged a ton of 2 crew time in both seats - from piston twins to turboprops to heavy jets - from northern strips to gravel to ice to international airports - from medevacs to crew changes to cargo to regional to overseas ops - and that's the pilot I'd hire for my airline...

But it's not just me... Airlines have showed they will hire the from multicrew, multi engine turbine operation with command time over the guy with 1500 instructing and 1500 in a 206... That's a fact...

If your experience is otherwise then I guess we'll have to disagree.

There are lots of ways to get there, but disparaging pilots whose careers and experience aren't as amazing yours is misleading the OP.

SuperchargedRS · Post by **SuperchargedRS** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 1:08 pm

I really didn't say much about myself, but whatever.

Look the point I was making was to be a well rounded aviator and not try to pick the fastest route to the airlines, if you got into aviation because you enjoy aviating more than being a "aviator" you'll have more fun, and a better QOL along the way.

Take my advice or don't, I'm still going to have lunch the next day.

Sulako · Post by **Sulako** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:52 pm

I think turbine time is more important than PIC assuming you have enough PIC to get your ATPL already.

I also totally agree with SRS - enjoy the ride while you`re working on your goals. Depending on how many jobs you have, you might only do a certain type of flying once in your life and it might be a hell of a lot of fun, so don`t forget to smell the roses as you ascend into the flight levels. Or something - that's a crap metaphor but I hope you get what I mean.

goingnowherefast · Post by **goingnowherefast** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 7:35 pm

The most fun I ever had was single engine, single pilot (flying floats). The only reason I moved on was in search of more stable employment, the seasonal lay-off always sucked.

Flight levels are actually quite boring.

Cat Driver · Post by **Cat Driver** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 8:31 pm

Flight levels are actually quite boring.

But every once in a while there can be very enjoyable flights in the flight levels.

My last flight the day before I retired was awesome, we climbed to FL410 out of Amsterdam and flew all the way down to Turkey without a cloud in the sky in the dark it was truly amazing to look at Europe so clearly from that height.