Flying school costs

[ray011]

Hey everyone,

I am thinking about making a career change and making the dream of becoming a pilot come true.

I am from Europe, where as I can see online, the cost (including CPL + PPL + night rating + multi engine instrument rating + multi engine) is around 60000-80000 euros.

My family can’t really help me financially so I will basically work and save as much as I can to join a flying school asap (I am 27 years old).

I would like to do it abroad and my first choice is Canada. I am checking several schools online and I can see the cost goes from $77000 (Montair school) to +$100000 (Proifr school).

Could anyone tell me an estimate cost and recommend a couple of flying schools with reasonable costs in Canada?

I am also a bit confused about all the different courses and trainings, I understand a pilot is ready to join the airline’s world after completing the CPL, PPL, night rating, multi engine instrument rating and the multi engine. Is there any other necessary module missing? any of these is not really necessary?

My last question is on how to obtain the required hours to be able to join an airline. Is it the easiest way to become an instructor? To become an instructor, I should take the instructor rating and RPP, isn’t it?
Is there any other cheaper way to obtain the hours?

I will appreciate any clarification on these questions, I just started to have a look at the different schools, courses and I am kind of lost. I am also a bit stressed about the cost as I was just counting on the costs of the CPL and PPL… I didn’t know about the other necessary courses (multi engine, night rating…) and my estimate expenses just went much higher.

Thank you in advance.

[flyingjerry]

In the past year, I've just completed my PPL, CPL and M-IFR for a total of $55,000 CAD including living expenses.

I've used schools that are known for efficiency, lived minimally and used block rentals (private aircraft) to build time to be able to do it for this price. PPL + CPL at Harv's Air (staying at their Accommodations), M-IFR at Cornwall (staying at their accommodations). Block rentals can be found through this site or usually by hanging out at the airport and asking around.

In Canada, 200 hours and a CPL will not get you to the airlines (yet). For me, finding a job with 200 hours has proven to be a massive hassle. Options are typically instructing or to find a job flying anything from survey to pipeline to a right seat 703/704 position until at least 500 hours. With 500-1000 hours you are now competitive to regionals. 2 or so years later and you can try your luck with our major(s).

In Europe, there are multiple cadet programs offered by airlines that will take care of training expenses and put you as a SO or even FO upon graduating. Look into Ryanair's or any others. It's really a much more efficient way to go.

Either way, the best thing to do is to 1) get a class 1 medical and 2) beg, borrow, or steal funds to get training right away. A little bit of debt is worth it for the amount of time made up at the top of the pay-scale.

Best of Luck

[ray011]

Hey Jerry

Thanks for your reply buddy, it has been really helpful.

I will surely keep these two flight schools for the future. I have seen Harv's air offers this program called Professional Pilot Course, it includes PPL, CPL, Night rating, Instrument rating, multi engine rating, for $47000/$52000, depending location.

How can it be so much cheaper compared for example to Proifr (it is more than the double)?

[flyingjerry]

I'm not familiar with PROIFR. However, Harv's Air quotes based on the minimum and from what I saw, they rarely had students complete licenses in minimum time. If you're going to Harv's for the whole thing, plan $~1200/month for living expenses and ~$65,000-$70,000 for the training. I can guarantee it won't be $47K.

[OldInstructor]

You need not cost out a night endorsement as it is part of the commercial licence. Recommend you try to complete the instrument portion as much as possible at night. That way the non instrument portion of the flight can be logged as night dual. Night pilot In command often difficult to acquire so get as much as you can while training for commercial. Working in Canada May be an issue so research that as well. Converting Canadian to your country may require additional training or tests, check that as well.

[ray011]

Hey guys,

thank you both for your replies.

@flyingjerry, I thought the same about the $47K price. In order to estimate the total living expenses, if the price of the training was $70K, how many months would it take?

One last question, I don't really get the ATPL, I thought that once you had the PPL, CPL, Night rating, Instrument rating, the multi engine rating and the minimum required hours.. you would be able to join an airline... I just noticed abut the ATPL, what is it? does it have an extra cost?

Thanks in advance

[ray011]

Once you obtain all the licenses I mentioned before, you can apply for an ATPL theoretical exam (if I am not wrong, I have seen it is around $5000), at this point you would get the "frozen ATPL license" and when you reach the 1500h you "unfroze" the license, is it how it works?

[wrightflyer]

ATPL exams are SAMRA(meterology) and SARON(rules). You can do the exams at any time however once you have completed the exams you have two years to meet all the hours requirements(Total, PIC, Cross Country, Night, night cross country etc) for the issuance of the ATPL. If you don't get all the hours in two years you will have to re-write the exams. There are companies that run a two-three day course (cram session) to prep for the exam, and generally speaking if you do the exam right after the course you will very likely pass.

this link details the exam requirements https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/ ... u-5038.htm

CARS 421.34 details all the requirements for the issuance of an ATPL(which i have extracted the following from)
"(4) Experience
An applicant shall have met the training requirements for the issue of a Commercial Pilot Licence - Aeroplane that is not restricted to daylight flying and completed a minimum of 1500 hours total flight time of which a minimum of 900 hours shall have been completed in aeroplanes. The total flight time shall include a minimum of:
(amended 2000/09/01; previous version)

(a) 250 hours pilot-in-command flight time in aeroplanes which shall include where applicable, a maximum of 100 hours pilot-in-command under supervision flight time completed in accordance with Section 421.11. The pilot-in-command and/or pilot-in-command under supervision flight time shall include a minimum of 100 hours cross-country flight time of which a minimum of 25 hours shall have been by night;
(b) 100 hours night flight time as pilot-in-command or as co-pilot of which a minimum of 30 hours shall have been acquired in aeroplanes;
(c) 100 additional hours cross-country flight time as pilot-in-command or 200 hours as co-pilot or any combination thereof, with flight time calculated in accordance with section 421.10. Flight time as pilot-in-command may be part of the 250 hours pilot-in-command flight time specified in paragraph (a); and
(amended 2005/12/01; previous version)
(d) 75 hours instrument flight time of which a maximum of 25 hours may have been acquired in approved instrument ground trainers and a maximum of 35 hours may have been acquired in helicopters. Instrument ground time shall not be applied toward the total 1500 hour flight time requirement."

[455tt]

One last question, I don't really get the ATPL, I thought that once you had the PPL, CPL, Night rating, Instrument rating, the multi engine rating and the minimum required hours.. you would be able to join an airline... I just noticed abut the ATPL, what is it? does it have an extra cost?

The route you would follow assuming you don't have the 1,500 hours for the ATPL is to simply write the IATRA type rating written, which, along with your CPL will allow you to act as co-pilot on a 2 crew aeroplane. So you can technically "join an airline" with just 250 hours, a CPL with IR and ME and the IATRA completed, and the airline will complete your training and type rating once you are hired. Then when you have built the 1,500 hours and have completed the ATPL writtens (SARON and SAMRA) you can move to the left seat. You can sit the IATRA with just 125 hours. Everything you need to prepare for the IATRA can be done via self study texts. Completion of the IATRA is an excellent low cost career move that will greatly enhance your employment prospects. By the way, night privileges are already included in the CPL. Good luck!

[chris_h1976]

Another school to consider is Moncton Flight College. They have an integrated ATPL course which is 52 weeks and the cost is $56000 for the 2017-2018 program. I plan on taking this course next year.
They also have a 2-year diploma program, a 4-year university degree program, as well as shorter integrated CPL courses which are a bit cheaper but with less qualifications.

http://mfc.nb.ca/main.html

[ray011]

thank you everyone for your replies, its been a great help.

@chris_h1976 $56000 sounds great but I have kinda of given up to the idea of getting my license in Canada, although it would be cool to move there to do it + it is a lot cheaper than in Europe.
After finishing the whole thing, I don't think I could work as a flight instructor or join any cadette program as I would not have any right to work in Canada as I am not a Canadian citizen.
I feel like if I went to Canada to do it, I would be stucked. I could not get any job to get hours as I would not have work permit and if I came back to Europe to join a cadette program or to work as a flight instructor, I could not as it would not be an EU valid license... then I would have to spend extra money to convert it and if I am not wrong is about $30K the conversion course.
Do you know if flying schools sometimes arrange work permits in Canada? For instance, if I took a flight instructor course with a Canadian school (I have read they sometimes employ their own students), it could be possible they would sort out my visa so I could work for them?
Some of my friends who are studying at university in Australia, they will get one year work permit after finishing so they can get experience/recover financially (no idea if this applies to flight schools tho, it could be), does this happen in Canada for students who went to a flight school?
It looks to me that many international aspiring pilots go to Canada as it is cheaper but how to get the hours once finished?! they just go home and convert it?

[David Bayyari]

thank you everyone for your replies, its been a great help.

@chris_h1976 $56000 sounds great but I have kinda of given up to the idea of getting my license in Canada, although it would be cool to move there to do it + it is a lot cheaper than in Europe.
After finishing the whole thing, I don't think I could work as a flight instructor or join any cadette program as I would not have any right to work in Canada as I am not a Canadian citizen.
I feel like if I went to Canada to do it, I would be stucked. I could not get any job to get hours as I would not have work permit and if I came back to Europe to join a cadette program or to work as a flight instructor, I could not as it would not be an EU valid license... then I would have to spend extra money to convert it and if I am not wrong is about $30K the conversion course.
Do you know if flying schools sometimes arrange work permits in Canada? For instance, if I took a flight instructor course with a Canadian school (I have read they sometimes employ their own students), it could be possible they would sort out my visa so I could work for them?
Some of my friends who are studying at university in Australia, they will get one year work permit after finishing so they can get experience/recover financially (no idea if this applies to flight schools tho, it could be), does this happen in Canada for students who went to a flight school?
It looks to me that many international aspiring pilots go to Canada as it is cheaper but how to get the hours once finished?! they just go home and convert it?

I believe when you come to Canada on a student visa, after finishing the programs you are entitled for an work permit after graduation.
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-re ... ility.html

You have to have studied over 8 months fulltime, you hood a CPL, FI rating AND a job offer.