Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

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shawnthesheep
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Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:30 am

Hey guys,

I need your help! If I have a safety pilot with a instructor rating,

If he lets me be PIC...

Can I get PIC X/C time + PIC HOOD time? All during the same flight?
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by photofly » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:44 am

It depends if you have a RPP or PPL already.

If you don't, and you're flying using a Student Pilot Permit, then the instructor can't "let" you be PIC, because then he or she would be a passenger, and you can't carry a passenger with a Student Pilot Permit - the only way you can fly two-up is if the instructor is PIC.

However you can still log time spent under the hood as simulated instrument time, (there's no such thing as specifically "PIC Hood time").

If you already have a RPP, PPL or better, and can carry passengers, then your safety "pilot" doesn't need a pilot licence at all, and you can (and must) log all time as PIC.
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Last edited by photofly on Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by altiplano » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:46 am

I don't think transport will let you count for licensing 2 things. ie. hood/xc at the same time.

And how can you be pic with a hood on during a vfr flight?
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:48 am

photofly wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:44 am
It depends if you have a RPP or PPL already.

If you don't, and you're flying using a Student Pilot Permit, then the instructor can't "let" you be PIC, because then he or she would be a passenger, and you can't carry a passenger with a Student Pilot Permit - the only way you can fly two-up is if the instructor is PIC.

However you can still log time spent under the hood as simulated instrument time, (there's no such thing as specifically "PIC Hood time").

If you already have a RPP, PPL or better, and can carry passengers, then your safety "pilot" doesn't need a pilot licence at all, and you can (and must) log all time as PIC.
I have my PPL... But can I log PIC X/C and PIC Hood in the same flight.
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:49 am

altiplano wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:46 am
I don't think transport will let you count for licensing 2 things. ie. hood/xc at the same time.

And how can you be pic with a hood on during a vfr flight?
Transport lets you log PIC Hood on a VFR flight with a safety pilot. I've asked my examiner that, just don't know if I can do X/C and Hood...
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by photofly » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:50 am

I have my PPL... But can I log PIC X/C and PIC Hood in the same flight.
Yes you can (and should) log it in both columns. But you can only count it towards one or the other requirement for a licence or rating - not towards both.

What you record in your logbook isn't the same as what you count towards licences and ratings.
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Last edited by photofly on Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
Kirk: This is a dangerous mission. Likely, one of us will die. The landing party will be me, Spock, McCoy, and Ensign Ricky.
Ensign Ricky: Aw, crap.

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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:52 am

I understand there is no such thing as "PIC Hood" just "Hood"

The question is more of can I log both x/c time and Hood time in the same flight?
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by photofly » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:53 am

For the third time (I'm losing count) yes, you log it as both x/c and simulated instrument time.

But you can't count it towards both requirements for a licence or rating - when you add up the time to meet the experience requirements, you may only count it towards one or the other.
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Ensign Ricky: Aw, crap.

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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:00 pm

photofly wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:53 am
For the third time (I'm losing count) yes, you log it as both x/c and simulated instrument time.

But you can't count it towards both requirements for a licence or rating - when you add up the time to meet the experience requirements, you may only count it towards one or the other.
Also if I want to get hood time with another pilot and he doesn't yet have a PPL/RPP he can be my safety pilot as you stated earlier? I ask because I can save money on paying an instructor if a generic person can be my safety pilot...
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by photofly » Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:05 pm

shawnthesheep wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:00 pm

Also if I want to get hood time with another pilot and he doesn't yet have a PPL/RPP he can be my safety pilot as you stated earlier? I ask because I can save money on paying an instructor if a generic person can be my safety pilot...
Paying an instructor to be a safety pilot is a bad idea, because if you're paying an instructor, he or she is going to want to instruct you, and then you're not PIC. If you do pay an instructor to accompany you, make it clear to that person that he/she is NOT to log the time in their own logbook as instructional time or PIC time. YOU are the PIC, and they are a passenger. They might not be so keen, under those circumstances.

A generic person whom you trust to look out for other airplanes and to warn you to look up if there's something safety-related you need to see is a much better idea. I used to joke about training your dog to bark at airplanes, but I got scolded for it.
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Kirk: This is a dangerous mission. Likely, one of us will die. The landing party will be me, Spock, McCoy, and Ensign Ricky.
Ensign Ricky: Aw, crap.

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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by shawnthesheep » Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:21 pm

photofly wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:05 pm
shawnthesheep wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:00 pm

Also if I want to get hood time with another pilot and he doesn't yet have a PPL/RPP he can be my safety pilot as you stated earlier? I ask because I can save money on paying an instructor if a generic person can be my safety pilot...
Paying an instructor to be a safety pilot is a bad idea, because if you're paying an instructor, he or she is going to want to instruct you, and then you're not PIC. If you do pay an instructor to accompany you, make it clear to that person that he/she is NOT to log the time in their own logbook as instructional time or PIC time. YOU are the PIC, and they are a passenger. They might not be so keen, under those circumstances.

A generic person whom you trust to look out for other airplanes and to warn you to look up if there's something safety-related you need to see is a much better idea. I used to joke about training your dog to bark at airplanes, but I got scolded for it.

Solo Instrument time can not be used towards a Night Rating so is there really a point of getting hood time while I am PIC?
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by photofly » Tue Aug 06, 2019 12:23 pm

Hood time with a generic person is not "dual" time. Dual time must be with someone qualified appropriately for the giving of dual instructional time towards the licence or rating in question. (Often but not necessarily by having an instructor rating.)

"Hood" time with a safety pilot is useful towards the 20 hours of instrument time required for an instrument rating that is neither the 5 hours dual instrument time with an instructor nor the 15 hours of dual instrument time from a "qualified person" - that is, it counts towards the other 20 out of the total 40 instrument hours required.

It also counts towards the recency requirements for the holder of an instrument rating.

Other than that, simulated instrument time with a "safety pilot" doesn't count towards anything at all, other than being regular PIC and/or X-C time, so I'm not sure why you'd bother.
Solo Instrument time can not be used towards a Night Rating so is there really a point of getting hood time while I am PIC?
If you want an instrument rating, or for your own practice.
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Kirk: This is a dangerous mission. Likely, one of us will die. The landing party will be me, Spock, McCoy, and Ensign Ricky.
Ensign Ricky: Aw, crap.

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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by altiplano » Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:13 pm

Do you have an IFR rating? Are you flying an IFR panel? How can you be in command when you are operating under VISUAL flight rules and you aren't looking at where you are going?

That seems ridiculous if they allow that.

But further to your response:
shawnthesheep wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:49 am
just don't know if I can do X/C and Hood...
That's exactly what I answered:
altiplano wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:46 am
I don't think transport will let you count for licensing 2 things. ie. hood/xc at the same time.
You can put whatever you want in your logbook though.
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by Beefitarian » Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:32 pm

Hang out with a better instructor and get some actual IFR time.
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Can I get PIC PIC X/C PIC Hood all in one flight

Post by NormaUsani » Sun Aug 18, 2019 5:41 am

What would happen if you operate your club without one and someone gets hurt? Whats the worst that could happen, just wondering...

Image ;-)
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Re: Can I get PIC, PIC X/C, PIC Hood all in one flight?

Post by B208 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 10:56 am

shawnthesheep wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:48 am
photofly wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:44 am
It depends if you have a RPP or PPL already.

If you don't, and you're flying using a Student Pilot Permit, then the instructor can't "let" you be PIC, because then he or she would be a passenger, and you can't carry a passenger with a Student Pilot Permit - the only way you can fly two-up is if the instructor is PIC.

However you can still log time spent under the hood as simulated instrument time, (there's no such thing as specifically "PIC Hood time").

If you already have a RPP, PPL or better, and can carry passengers, then your safety "pilot" doesn't need a pilot licence at all, and you can (and must) log all time as PIC.
I have my PPL... But can I log PIC X/C and PIC Hood in the same flight.
You can put it in your personal log however you'd like. In terms of counting it towards your ratings, that depends. X-country under the hood for your CPL or even the 50 hrs x-country for IFR is likely a no go. Towards the ATPL may work.
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