Aerobatic Training

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StepOnTheBall
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Aerobatic Training

Post by StepOnTheBall »

Can anybody recommend a place in southern Ontario where one can recieve reasonably priced aerobatic training? Any info on personal experiences, aircraft types, specific instructors, etc. would be appreciated.
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Hedley
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Post by Hedley »

There is precious little aerobatic instruction offered in Ontario, which I understand suits Transport just fine.

I might suggest Gerry Younger in his Pitts S-2A at Kitchener-Waterloo, but I had heard he'd retired from doing that.

You might try Air Combat Canada in St Catharines, but I'd heard their Extra 300's went down south. They weren't cheap when they were in the business, if you calculated their hourly rate.

Hey, there must be somebody with a Zlin in Toronto that could get you upside down. I know there are a couple of aerobatic instructors in Toronto, I dunno if all the aerobatic aircraft are privately-owned or not.
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Cat Driver
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Post by Cat Driver »

Buy my Aerobat. :mrgreen:
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TorontoGuy
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Post by TorontoGuy »

The Internatuional Aerobatic Club website lists 4 places in Ontario:

Brampton Flight Centre
Classic Wings, Inc., in Courtice
Grimsby Aviation
Island Air Flight School, Toronto

just go here, and click on "Canada" for details:
http://www.iac.org/begin/schools.html#P455_20154

Pretty recent, the page was last updated Jan. 16.
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AOW
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Post by AOW »

I know that neither Island Air nor Brampton Flying Club offer aerobatic instruction.

I do know that there is a company, Future Air, that advertises Aerobatic instruction at the Holland Landing airpark.
Future Air Aerobatic Training Webpage
They have a 7KCAB Citabria (150hp, no flaps, inverted fuel/oil system for up to 3 minutes of inverted flight). I have no personal experience with this company, although I do know at least one guy who's flown their Citabria, just for taildragger experience. I spoke to someone more recently who said that they may not be the best bet for aerobatic training, but I don't know what other options there are, nearby.
I have limited aerobatic experience in powered aircraft, only one flight in a 7ECA Citabria (only 100hp, but it was a blast!) So 50 more horses on essentially the same airframe should be a pretty good setup.

So I can't speciffically recommend anybody in the GTA, these guys seem to be worth a shot.
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Hedley
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Post by Hedley »

Brampton Flight Centre
http://www.bramfly.ca/4_training.html says:
AEROBATICS - Not Available at this time.
Classic Wings, Inc., in Courtice

Classic Wings Inc., Contact: Stan Miller, 1748 Baseline Rd. W., Oshawa, Ont., L1E 2T1. Tel.: 905-259-1280; Fax: 416-284-5499; E-mail: hawkefield@sympatico.ca.
Base: Oshawa
Training includes: Classic, tailwheel, aerobatic
Training fleet: Harvards, Tiger Moth, J3 Cub
That looks pretty cool - I guess they have a Harvard for aerobatics?
Grimsby Aviation
They don't seem to have a website, I found this:
Grimsby Aviation 905-945-6161 CNZ8, Ralph Meyer is the instructor, $130 hr, in a Citabria.
Island Air Flight School, Toronto
I found this:

http://www.flyislandair.net/

which doesn't mention anything about aerobatics in the "Flight Training" page, and on the "Our Fleet" page doesn't like any aerobatic aircraft, and on the "Our Staff" page doesn't advertise anyone as an aerobatic instructor, and "Our Prices" doesn't like anything related to aerobatics, either.

Hope this helps,
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Brewguy
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Post by Brewguy »

Hedley wrote:You might try Air Combat Canada in St Catharines, but I'd heard their Extra 300's went down south. They weren't cheap when they were in the business, if you calculated their hourly rate.
Sorry, the Canadian branch office of Fighter Combat International (formerly Air Combat Canada) is no longer in business. One of the aerobatic instructors from FCI was doing some private instruction on a Decathlon over the summer months, but I don't think he has that airplane any more.
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bcrosby
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by bcrosby »

Almost 4 years later....

Same question... present day. Anyone have any suggestions for aerobatic training in Southern Ontario? A few of the places mentioned previously in this post have broken websites or are out of business.
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mcrit
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by mcrit »

Well, your best bet is to buy an aerobatic aircraft (or a share in one) and then engage an instructor. That is the route I had to take. You can pick up a basic aerobatic a/c for a good price these days (try COPA or Barnstormers.com). There are a few aerobatic instructors in southern Ontario. I'd suggest Ken Lam. He was at BFC and someone at Brampton should be able to get you in contact with him.
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av8tor_assrope
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by av8tor_assrope »

Hey just on a side note....Stan Miller of Classic Wings actually passed away a while ago. I'm not quite sure who's running it now. I was fortunate to have him do 2 of my flight tests and he also gave me a backseat ride in one of the company Harvards. He flew Lancs in WW2 and instructed at Seneca for years.

Cheers
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hz2p
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by hz2p »

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Last edited by hz2p on Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cgzro
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by cgzro »

Yes, lots of acro at CYND, P-51, Spit, Harvard and my Pitts on most nice weekends. Unfortunately no dual.
OAC at Ottawa has a 2 seat Grob and some good basic Acro instruction however.

Peter
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chippy
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by chippy »

I might be able to help you out if you have access to an airplane.
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172PIC
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by 172PIC »

For anyone going commercial would it help having the aero training just as an extra? Obviously you're not going to be doing loops with customers on board but just wondering if it would be one of those lines on the resume to set you apart from all the others?
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bcrosby
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by bcrosby »

That's exactly it. I just want to get some extra experience with unusual attitudes. I think it would totally help with confidence and preparedness.

Not to mention fun! :)
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Snare_TS
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by Snare_TS »

I've tried looking up everything I could for a school offering aerobatics, but looks like they are all closed for good. I too am looking for something to keep me busy on my way to my CPL. Guess only way to go is to find an instructor with some free time on their hands and a plane for that matter.

Anyone willing to tutor in the GTA?
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Hedley
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by Hedley »

I know of at least two different outfits that tried to offer aerobatics in the GTA and both went broke.

If you can't make a living offering acro in the GTA - with it's huge market - it's going to be difficult making a go of it someplace with only say one tenth of the potential customers.

Pretty short season in Canada for acro. It's just not the same as California or Florida.
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Brewguy
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by Brewguy »

Hedley wrote:...If you can't make a living offering acro in the GTA - with it's huge market - it's going to be difficult making a go of it someplace with only say one tenth of the potential customers...
+1

Besides that, it's sad to say, but a very large percentage of pilots in Canada are cheap - and don't want to pay for this type of training. Hearing people compare the cost of an hour of advanced training to how much time they could rent a 172 at their local flying club is enough to make you want to scream.
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by bcrosby »

Brewguy wrote:Besides that, it's sad to say, but a very large percentage of pilots in Canada are cheap - and don't want to pay for this type of training.
Yeah, it really is a shame. I think it's important from a safety point of view that you experience "true" unusual attitudes and not just spins/spirals.

Learning how to get into these attitudes (to know how *not* to get yourself in that situation) and how to get out of them (so that you can survive if you do end up upside down by accident) is important to staying alive when the fit hits the shan.

A few hours of acrobatic training is worth it. Guess I'm in the minority.
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Ground Thumper
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Re: Aerobatic Training

Post by Ground Thumper »

You could try acrobatics in a glider. A number of clubs have acrobatic programs. Just a thought.
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