Forced Approach from downwind in new flight test good or bad
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, Right Seat Captain, lilfssister, North Shore
Forced Approach from downwind in new flight test good or bad
T.C. has introduced new flight test guide for CPL is asking for a force approach from the downwind leg. No power only one warm up from the time the power is reduced landing shall be made within +400 to -50 ft. Can this be done every time the same way is this a valid exercise.
I think it's a great idea. Heck, every glider pilot does this every landing.
If someone doesn't have enough stick & rudder skill to pull the throttle to idle on downwind abeam the numbers, and then land without touching the throttle, he really doesn't deserve a commercial pilot's licence, imho.
Airlines like to run out of fuel - Air Canada, Air Transat come to mind - so this really isn't that silly a task.
If someone doesn't have enough stick & rudder skill to pull the throttle to idle on downwind abeam the numbers, and then land without touching the throttle, he really doesn't deserve a commercial pilot's licence, imho.
Airlines like to run out of fuel - Air Canada, Air Transat come to mind - so this really isn't that silly a task.
- C-150Pilot
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Yea my instructor always makes me practice engine failures on downwind. Always stick close to the airport But dont hug it!! Now if your were flying at CSS3( Les Cedres ) in the circuit, then you better line up with the highway/Field cuz they fly HUGEEEEE circuits and its for sure youll never make the runway.
Fly it until the last piece stops moving
"I give your landing a 9...on the Richter scale."
"I give your landing a 9...on the Richter scale."
I just did my class 4 ride and one of the things that the examiner talked about was the Power off glide in the circuit. He told me to make it clear it is NOT a forced approach. It is a power off glide to landing, you can pull the power off anywhere on the downwind or base, and I think he said even final. I don't believe you are allowed to clear the engine either.
I think it is a good thing to have on the test, and I could even see it happening in the future on the private ride. It is the actual transition of a glide to landing simular to a forced approach, but now we can see the final product not from 500AGL. I think it could be the make or break for alot of CPL students.
I think it is a good thing to have on the test, and I could even see it happening in the future on the private ride. It is the actual transition of a glide to landing simular to a forced approach, but now we can see the final product not from 500AGL. I think it could be the make or break for alot of CPL students.
The letter states it is NOT a forced approach, just simply a power-off 180 degree accuracy approach, however improved mastery of power off approaches are expected to give secondary benefits in improved performance of the forced landing task.
Personally I think its no big deal, somewhere along the line I demo and have all my students practice smoothly reducing power to idle at the end of the downwind and conduct a power off gliding approach with minimal to zero flaps. It works great to improve attitude & airspeed control during any approach.
Personally I think its no big deal, somewhere along the line I demo and have all my students practice smoothly reducing power to idle at the end of the downwind and conduct a power off gliding approach with minimal to zero flaps. It works great to improve attitude & airspeed control during any approach.
This will obviously depend on the aircraft and it's glide specs. I was in a Katana for 30 hrs and quickly learned that aircraft glides FOR EVER! You could pull the power and your cross-wind turn and still make a regular circuit!!scm wrote:Isn't that how a regular landing is performed? Idle at the end of downwind and glide to land? Although the circuit would be oval rather than rectangular.
- C-150Pilot
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Generally you would keep 60 knots, the best glide speed for the C150 for that kind of exercise. However that being said, I suppose that if you can make the field using 65 kts, if you were a little concerned about getting in, you could slow it down a bit to 60 kts.C-150Pilot wrote:In the 150 we set the speed to 65 knots and keep that and do like an oval shape circuit and if we are certain we will make the runway/ high we extend a few notch of flaps
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Yeah, I just did my PPL last year in Shearwater, Nova Scotia and my flight instructor did engine failures in the circuit all the time. Definitely sounds like they just added number to shoot for....but, the point is....if you're flying a single engined piston, be sure you can make it from any point in the circuit when you're at a low power setting and engine failure is more of a concern.
I'm sure everyone remembers their instructor asking "Do you think we could make the runway with an engine failure right now" whenever you set up your final too far away! A plane from Shearwater had just that happen to them. One COLD january day, long final, engine died and they touched down 100 feet before the runway....took out some lights but were alright. However, there's not always going to be a clearing before the runway!
I'm sure everyone remembers their instructor asking "Do you think we could make the runway with an engine failure right now" whenever you set up your final too far away! A plane from Shearwater had just that happen to them. One COLD january day, long final, engine died and they touched down 100 feet before the runway....took out some lights but were alright. However, there's not always going to be a clearing before the runway!
"Negative Ghostrider, the pattern is full"
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It's not a huge deal; as has already been mentioned it's a requirment for pre-solo anyway. The only difference is I've always told my private students I didn't care where on the runway they landed as long as they made it safely. It'll just take more precision on the part of a commercial student.