King Air PPC worth it?

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Blue_Yonder
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King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Blue_Yonder » Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:11 am

Firstly, does a King Air require a PPC? Secondly, why would an employer ask that I go out and pay $7000+ for a King Air type rating, and then come back so I can pay them a 10K+ bond on top of that, just to make $25K a year? Shouldn't a good company pay for this, or at the very least include it in a bond (not saying I'd sign one). I guess I thought the cost of the type rating was included in the bond. Is the PPC really that worth it? How many doors would it actually open, if any?
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Last edited by Blue_Yonder on Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Colonel Sanders
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Colonel Sanders » Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:22 am

why would I pay $7000+ for a King Air PPC, and then pay a 10K+ bond on top of that, just to make $25K a year?
I have no idea.
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Blue_Yonder
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Blue_Yonder » Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:26 am

Colonel Sanders wrote:
why would I pay $7000+ for a King Air PPC, and then pay a 10K+ bond on top of that, just to make $25K a year?
I have no idea.
Good one ;)

Corrected
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tdp19
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by tdp19 » Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:31 am

I think you must be misinformed because theres no way someone would make u pay 7000 G's for a PPC then pay a 10,000 k bond. I would love to know who that company is if that is in fact true. PPC is only required for a captain, a lot of companys will give people in the right seat a PPC but only a PCC is required. I pray to god people aren't stupid enough to pay 17,000 dollars for a job when a PPC is not even required.
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Blue_Yonder
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Blue_Yonder » Fri Nov 02, 2012 4:01 am

tdp19 wrote:I think you must be misinformed because theres no way someone would make u pay 7000 G's for a PPC then pay a 10,000 k bond. I would love to know who that company is if that is in fact true. PPC is only required for a captain, a lot of companys will give people in the right seat a PPC but only a PCC is required. I pray to god people aren't stupid enough to pay 17,000 dollars for a job when a PPC is not even required.
I won't name names, but there's plenty of company’s advertising King Air F/O positions with 500TT. Catch is the company’s seem to either want time on type, or some sort of type rating. And I know for a fact some of these company’s do require you to sign a bond.
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tdp19
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by tdp19 » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:25 am

Blue, I do understand what your saying but if you already have a current PPC you SHOULD NOT be required to sign a bond because there isnt very much training, if you have time on type but do not have a current PPC then i could possibly see a bond. Its one or the other, not both. Years back i signed a bond for 200PPC and it was one of the biggest mistakes I made during my career. The company shut down and fortunately I got the money back but i was hounding the company for weeks.
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JBI
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by JBI » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:43 pm

When bonds have been enforced by the courts, its on the basis that it is a contract.

The company provides you with training in exchange for you staying with the company for a certain amount of time. For a contract to be valid, generally, there needs to be an exchange of consideration.

If the company is not providing training, thus not providing their part of a bargain, I can't see what the exchange would be for a bond.
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richink
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by richink » Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:26 am

So Blue back to your original question, the answer is generally yes, some air services will handle the PPC and type rating as it were in house.

Bonds are there (not that I agree with them) generally to keep you around for more than a few weeks.

I wouldn't go of my own accord to get a PPC or type rating on any aircraft unless I knew absolutely there was a job waiting for me afterwards.
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Duncan Idaho
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Duncan Idaho » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:20 pm

No! These guys are trying to hose you. For one thing, never ever pay for your own training. That's not your responsibility. Any job you go to requires training, and I don't just mean flying jobs. If you go to a government job, nursing job, engineering etc you require training and none of them pay for their training. That being said, training for a new pilot is a little more expensive, it's not MUCH more expensive if you consider training personnel salaries at gov jobs but it's a bit more sure. So there's sometimes a training agreement, that if you leave before a year or two years that you have to pay the balance of a certain amount that is PRO-RATED. So if you leave after 18 months on a 2 year $10,000 bond you owe $2,500. That isn't too fair but it is fairly common, so I wouldn't fault you for taking that job, it's a job and you presumably need one so that makes sense. But don't go paying out of pocket for your own training. That's extortion.
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Doc
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Doc » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:23 pm

If you ARE going to pay "out of pocket" for training, make it training that will get you somewhere. Go out and get a B737NG rating! Only a complete IDIOT would go out and pay for a BE20 PPC! And, calling someone an IDIOT for paying for a BE20 PPC, AND then signing a bond is WAY too kind. You would have to be a brain dead, moronic, nit-wit, idiotic, bottom feeding lump of camel dung, even to consider such an idea. The word "WHORE" wouldn't do you justice!
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Oxi
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by Oxi » Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:30 pm

Could one please explain the PPC and PCC differences a little better.

oxi
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jschnurr
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by jschnurr » Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:44 am

Oxi wrote:Could one please explain the PPC and PCC differences a little better.
It's complicated, but basically:

You need a PCC when:
You are Captain of a 702/703 and fly Day VFR single engine aircraft.
You are Copilot of a 702/703 aircraft.

You need a PPC when:
You fly Captain of a 702 during IFR.
You fly Captain of a 703 during IFR, Night, or with a Multi engine airplane.
You fly Captain of 704 or 705.
You fly Copilot of 704 or 705.

Both a PPC and PCC have similar training (stalls, steep turns, flight at reduced airspeed, holds, approaches, takeoffs and landings). You also need to do ground school and company written tests. After the PCC training, the Chief Pilot will sign you off as competent. After the PPC training, you go for a flight test with an ACP (Air Check Pilot).

A PPC renews your IFR rating for 2 years, a PCC does not.

Hope this helps.
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by CFMEA » Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:42 pm

Hi Jschnurr,

Can you please tell me where you found the PPC information wrt the IFR ride reset?

All the best,

Bruce Williams
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lownslow
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by lownslow » Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:10 pm

Zombie thread alert!

1. Holy cow things have changed in the past 7 years.

2. Yes, a PPC can be an IFR renewal flight test and in some specific cases an initial.
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porcsord
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Re: King Air PPC worth it?

Post by porcsord » Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:28 am

But in the case of a Medevac Islander, it does not renew your IFR as it would have been a VFR PPC.
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