Career options while facing a DUI charge.

[ryan19]

Just so i don't get eaten alive, here's the situation. I blew 0.10 after a mens leauge game and am now charged. I am fighting it and hope to get it reduced or acquitted but its going to take some time. I realize it was a huge mistake and now i've got to deal with it.

In the mean time i am looking at my options. I have done quite a bit of research and i'm unsure,
-if i can qualify for a RAIC pass,
-what specific background checks the airlines do,
-if current charges will show up in a major airlines check (theres a new bill 113 which is unclear on the matter),
-could i explain my situation to them?

I would really appreciate a reply if you are knowledgable on the topic. I realize what a huge mistake it was and if you are just commenting to lecture me, believe me i'm paying out the as* for my actions. We are all human and make mistakes. I didn't realize how fast 3 beers could change my life.

Thanks.

[Confliction]

Might be some info in this thread if I copied it correctly...

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopi ... 4&t=105721

[Old fella]

Only thing I can suggest to you is contact a qualified criminal defense lawyer who has experience in dealing with DUI and defended individuals like yourself who face charges. Qualified lawyers know the criminal code very well and will certainly advise you on your rights and repercussions if you are found guilty. Public forums are not the avenue for such discussions,your attorney will probably tell you to stay off social media and blog sites.........and save your act of contrition for court.

Now if you are trolling................

[fish4life]

Only issue I have heard with a RAIC is you can't get a temporary pass while you wait for your full one.

[altiplano]

1- get a lawyer specialising in DUI defence.

2- if you are convicted do not travel to the US until you are able to apply/receive a pardon... if the Americans learn of your conviction it will be a life of problems, even if you're later granted a pardon.

3- once you get a pardon in the eyes of employers it never happened and they can't ask.

4- I don't think it will affect your RAIC.

[cory_trevor]

1- get a lawyer specialising in DUI defence.

2- if you are convicted do not travel to the US until you are able to apply/receive a pardon... if the Americans learn of your conviction it will be a life of problems, even if you're later granted a pardon.

3- once you get a pardon in the eyes of employers it never happened and they can't ask.

4- I don't think it will affect your RAIC.

#2 is incorrect. You do not need a pardon from a DUI to travel to the USA and you will not have any problems as long as you are honest when they ask if you have ever been arrested.

[Airband]

A previous item regarding DUI & RAIC:

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopi ... 31&t=86713

[altiplano]

#2 is incorrect. You do not need a pardon from a DUI to travel to the USA and you will not have any problems as long as you are honest when they ask if you have ever been arrested.

You miss my point. I didn't say you couldn't be admitted, but save yourself a career of troubles.

Once you travel to the US and you are asked and admit to a conviction it is on your file with them forever - no matter if there is a subsequent pardon in Canada.

In your career you'll go through US customs so much that it will just save you a lot of hassle if you don't have to explain yourself...

Additionally, a prerequisite of employment is "the ability to travel unrestricted to the United States". While a single DUI may not required a waiver presently, it has in the past, may again in the future. Canada doesn't admit Americans with DUIs without a waiver...

[AirFrame]

The reality is, telling yourself "it was nothing, how do I get around it and forget about it?" is the wrong thing. You can't un-break an egg, you were busted doing something rather stupid. Part of the cost of that mistake is that it's going to follow you around. Knowing that's what happens is part of the deterrent to doing it in the first place.

Don't want the hassle? Don't drink and drive. Doesn't get much simpler than that.

[PROC_HDG]

I can't add any practical information to this, but don't let the keyboard warriors on here get you down. Without rehabilitation, we are a failed society. I hope your mistake makes you a better person in the long run, and wish you nothing but success in the future.

PROC_HDG

[Cat Driver]

Sorry ., I removed your comment to try and keep this on track.

[TG]

1+1=3. That's a mistake. DUI is a crime. You did it, live with it. I definitely wouldn't want to fly with a pilot with no logical thinking. I'm sure there are more people who think like me.

I don't think like you.

radubc, take the time to read this post below and hopefully you will review your judgement.
http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/2568 ... ost3028059
On a side note, it is followed by a post from . E. (aka Cat Driver)

I would fly with them any time without a single question.
And learn a lot about flying at the same time.

[rxl]

Without rehabilitation, we are a failed society.
PROC_HDG

Isn't this - thankfully - one of the cornerstones of our criminal justice system?

[Inverted2]

Get a good lawyer. Spend lots of $$$. Win the case. I know of a few guys who got their DUI charges thrown out who went to fly at a major Canadian airline.

[DanWEC]

I've been in this arena in all sorts of ways. Friends on both sides of the equation. I had a friend die at 22 from a psycho who hit her head-on at 7am while she was on her way to work. He was high on coke and fall down drunk. I've also had friends unfairly labelled with criminal records because of bumping the limit after only a drink or two.

People, especially those over 40, might think of a DUI and conviction as the old style where you're falling out of your car door, and just hit a street pole. That's what it took to get charged 30 years ago.
The current criminal system involving alcohol and driving is different, and broken. Under the current regime, people no longer have to be intoxicated or impaired in order to be charged. A person having no signs whatsoever of impairment, can now be charged with "Over 80". Which actually explicitly implies zero impairment but a BAC of over .05. It carries the same criminal record as a DUI.
But wait! You might ask, if you aren't impaired, you feel fine, then what are you doing wrong? No intent? Heck, not even any knowledge of an infraction? Good question. It's well known that different people can have radically different BAC's based on the same number of drinks. It's also well known that different people can show radically different levels of impairment from the same BAC. I've seen people blow after many drinks and not come close to the limit. Some seem drunk others don't. I've also seen people blow over after 2 drinks. Again some seem completely sober others don't. Makes your head spin a bit.

So here we have a yardstick with a huge arbitrary component being applied to people, to the point where someone who has only two drinks, cuts themselves off at that point, is perfectly fine in all respects with zero impairments whatsoever, can go through a ride program and BAM, is now branded a lifelong criminal with all the goodies that go along with that. This is not a joke, and a very serious issue.

Police reported impairment charges dropped quite a bit from 1980 to late 90's, but they have been unchanged for almost 20 years now. Almost 50,000 cases per year clog our court system. 14% of all criminal charges excluding the Territories. It is by far the highest proportion of all charges in the court system. Something is very wrong here.

Here's the biggest problem. It's not the people blowing .05 that are causing the fatal accidents. 40% of fatally injured drivers have alcohol in their system. Of that 40%: Only 15% of those drivers had BAC's below .08, 30% between .08-.160, and 55% are OVER .160. That's bombed.
That proportion is more than double the lower segments combined. Here is the REAL problem: This 3 part proportion has remained virtually unchanged in 50 years. So now, all you have is a system in place now that is making lifelong criminals out of people who aren't impaired, but this has had ZERO effect on the people who are actually KILLING other people's friends and families. It's an incredibly frustrating, broken system. Unfortunately, arguing the reality of this is a pretty unpopular viewpoint, until people actually pay attention to the numbers and realize what's going on.
(By the way, all of these statistics are available on Transport Canada's website)

I've resigned myself to a hard limit of one single drink if driving, just because of the uncertainty of being charged.

On the other side of things, regarding people that really do have a drinking problem, there is a clinical aspect to alcoholism that has proven a physiological brain chemistry aspect that makes is almost impossible for those to resist alcohol. There was a David Suzuki segment on CBC this week called "Addicted" that was pretty informative and makes me sympathize. Those people describe that it can take a lot of willpower and a lifelong battle to resist, but that's a different topic.

Now, for the OP, Were you charged with Over 80 or DUI? Same implications, just different proofs. Also, there is about a .02 variance that a lawyer can argue, if you're at .10 you might be in good position with a lawyer. Talk to a good one, not a cheap one. It's your life you're playing with.
Many of the defenses for these charges have been taken away by the courts. Unconstitutional? Sure, but they keep groups like MADD happy. (Fun fact, the founder and CEO of MADD left the organization years ago citing it's "Become radical".) 4 out of 5 court proceedings end up in a guilty verdict.

RAIC- It's fine. As mentioned, Pass control can't grant you a temporary, which might require affect some positions till it comes through.
Travelling to the States- As mentioned, 100% fine. Only issue is once you do pass with the conviction on your record, the US CBP computer polls CPIC and it's on there for good. That's fine for now, but you never know if laws will change in the future. If you can magically avoid the border until you get a "pardon", which is 5 years after the conviction... then you have nothing to worry about at all.
Getting a job- This will vary by operator. It will be easier once a pardon is granted.
Current charges show up under local police checks, I can't say with 100% certainty but I don't believe they are in CPIC for the basis of a background check. Someone else might know better. I can't advise on what to say to an employer other than as with everything in aviation, honesty and transparency is important to me, but every situation is different.

Good luck, don't let people like the above poster try to beat you down even more when you're already probably feeling the lowest of your life. It should be an upward journey now, not a downward one. Life goes on. and I bet your drinking decisions are changed for the rest of your life as well.

[radubc]

I removed your posts. Before you go off about attitude regarding this topic you should know something about me. I was a 35 year career paramedic who over his career saw way more death and destruction then one man should at the hands of drinking drivers and was even hit by an impaired driver. There are some out there that you will never fix, they simply do not care. I have seen this kind of person many times. The person that started this thread has demonstrated that he/she is not proud of what he/ she did, that is clear. Hopefully a lesson is learned and they go on with life. Of all the people on here I feel that I have the mileage to comment. Time will tell. A DUI is a wake up call for many to examine what is really important in their lives.

[DanWEC]

It's true, he certainly made a mistake, but the crux of what I'm saying is that when it's that close, some people don't even realize that they're even remotely near the limit and may be fine for all intents and purposes. I'm not defending his actions, but using BAC as a guide is a bit like using a rubber band as a yo yo string. Better off just to not push it. Live and learn. Hopefully he does.

Here's a real criminal: http://windsor.ctvnews.ca/reliving-a-tr ... -1.1864016. The previously mentioned psycho. Amazingly enough he did it again after getting out of jail.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Now, DUI shows poor judgement and planning. I don't see any valid argument aginst this fact. The fact that it happened to Cat Driver or any other diety on the forum doesn't make it right.

This subject is just far to more important to allow the above comment to go unchallenged.

First off radubc I am not a deity I am a normal human being that is not infallible and therefore subject to becoming addicted to any drug which I was.

Alcohol is a drug that is deadly even though it is legal in Canada.

I was addicted to alcohol and tried for years to quit drinking including A.A. which for me did not work.

However in January of 1985 I committed myself to Shick Shadel Hospital in Seattle WA. where I went through their addiction program.

The cure worked for me and allowed me to continue to work as a pilot until I retired in 2005 with an unblemished safety record and over thirty thousand flying hours.

To this day I have never had a drink of any alcoholic beverage and have zero desire to now or in the future.

Alcoholism is an illness that can be cured and allow the alcoholic to live a normal life.

[radubc]

That's exactly the thing. Alcohol impairs the judgement and you take the wrong decisions. This is why you make the decisions BEFORE you drink. Decisions like: no more than one beer (which happens to be my rule too), or: I' going to a game and I want to drink, so my car stays home.

I'm not talking about crazy idiots here, where the things are obvious. I'm talking about people who are reactive (get a lawyer) instead of being proactive (don't drink, leave the car home).

Another thing. If the OP wanted to be an accountant, lawyer, or even doctor, I wouldn't say anything. But you have to admit that things are different for pilots, or bus drivers for example.

[radubc]

., there is a huge difference between your attitude and the one of the OP. You say: I have a problem, I have to solve it. He sais: I have a problem, I have to get away wit it. In your case, the problem is unlikely to repeat. In his case it is likely to happen again, knowing that it worked once.

And another thing. If your problem was that bad and you solved it, you are an exception (ok, I might regret this later ). You can't le everybody off with it because it worked for you. The laws are written according to general behaviour of people, not exceptions).