Coronavirus Numbers

[Inverted2]

People just flash their AR’s in the US to express their 2nd Amendment rights. If we tried that here we’d be locked up. I don’t agree with showing off one’s arsenal. I do agree with lawful gun ownership though. My AR-15 stays in the safe unless I go to the range which is now closed of course.

[Rockie]

People just flash their AR’s in the US to express their 2nd Amendment rights.

Now see this I don't get, because clearly these imbeciles don't give a shit about what the rest of the constitution says. If they did Trump would have been in prison 3.3 years ago.

[Old fella]

Right?

This has nothing to do with any mass shootings. And clearly these people weren't planning on shooting anyone because they didn't. Open carry with plans to do something unlawful is unlawful in itself.

Rights and freedoms aren't temporary things. They are entitlements and guarantees. They aren't something you can take away.
[/


“Open carry with plans to do something unlawful is unlawful in itself.”
Really?
Doesn’t that point to a big problem with someone carrying a firearm?
How do you know what’s going on inside those heads?
The fact that some random civilian or group of civilians has/have the tool to take away a life in an instant strapped to their sides doesn’t generate what I would call “respect” ... more like fear, intimidation and mistrust.
What kind of “freedom” does that result in?

I'm not saying I encourage it, but I understand they are trying to express themselves and it's their right.

Do you think that open carry of unrestricted firearms is illegal in Canada?

Let me put the question back to you. Is it legal here in Canada to pose on the steps of any legislative building from St. John’s NL to Victoria BC( and all in between) with the firearms depicted in the picture as posted. I say it certainly isn’t but please correct me if I am wrong.

[Rockie]

This is difficult and frankly horrifying to watch. It begins at the 1:50 mark, and if your stomach and nerves hold out the hostage statement begins at the 32:00 mark.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vf_waLOYm2k

[hamstandard]

When we can safely do that at the advice of the experts I'm sure we will, until then - again at the advice of experts - no.

For the 'follow the advice of the experts crowd' who keep changing the scientific advice, someone in the interview shown here said it the way it should be said, basically some of them are incompetent.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/jason- ... -1.5531191

But I think there is more to this. Have you noticed that a certain segment of the political spectrum is the most active against restarting the economy. It turns out that they(including the person I quoted) are the strongest supporters of the New Green deal kind of thinking. This is their opportunity and they are taking it. And you are seeing what the new green deal is like.

Must be working as it is a pretty cool spring in much of the country. So stop worrying about your house.

[Rockie]

Medical and public health experts change their guidance based on increased knowledge, experience and changing circumstances. Unlike the know-nothing blowhards who pull advice out of their ass which is the only alternative.

When I need medical advice I go see my doctor, not the guy down the street who treats furniture for stain protection.

When I bought new furniture last year I called furniture guy down the street, not my doctor.

When the furniture guy and my doctor go somewhere I'm sure both of them prefer I was up front than either one of them. And if I change plans partway through based on changing conditions furniture guy doesn't yank me out of the chair so the doctor can fly or vice versa.

All three of us seem to know our limitations and who the expert really is.

[hamstandard]

Medical and public health experts change their guidance based on increased knowledge, experience and changing circumstances. Unlike the know-nothing blowhards who pull advice out of their ass which is the only alternative.

When I need medical advice I go see my doctor, not the guy down the street who treats furniture for stain protection.

When I bought new furniture last year I called furniture guy down the street, not my doctor.

When the furniture guy and my doctor go somewhere I'm sure both of them prefer I was up front than either one of them. And if I change plans partway through based on changing conditions furniture guy doesn't yank me out of the chair so the doctor can fly or vice versa.

All three of us seem to know our limitations and who the expert really is.

Looks like the Taiwanese hired experts who knew what they were doing and haven’t had to change their minds.

I guess the medical experts are like pilots, some of them crash and burn. If you are lucky, they don’t take the economy with them.

I applaud the Alberta government for listening to the experts in Europe and US when it comes to testing.

[altiplano]

You are a toxic individual. All insult no conversation.

[Rockie]

I didn't insult anyone actually except some generic know-nothing, but then again some things are justly deserving of insult. Sounds "non-PC" I know but I thought the "non-PC" crowd liked that kind of thing.

You don't have anything to say about the expert/non-expert principle in my post?

[2R]

New numbers:
Germany requests 130 billion in compensation from China for the costs associated with the Pandemic .
First request there will be more .

[2R]

Bit of a thread drift to talk about furniture , but if you remember when Jack Layton had his blood tested for toxins , turns out his blood was polluted with toxic chemicals
Chemicals similar to those used to protect furniture from stains and retard furniture fire . Jack Layton died from Cancer .
Maybe avoiding stain resistant furniture might be a healthy lifestyle choice . Most of my furniture is high end leather cleaned with saddle soap , so I reduce the amount of toxic transdermal chemical exposure .

Still waiting on reports about long term exposure to chemtrail exposure when we have to fly through the wake of one of the larger chemtrail tankers . Is six miles enough to avoid the toxins behind the " Heavy " tanker

[hamstandard]

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/sw ... spartandhp

[rxl]

New numbers:
Germany requests 130 billion in compensation from China for the costs associated with the Pandemic .
First request there will be more .

This is not (yet anyway) an official government request. It came from the German tabloid newspaper Bild. It’s an itemized invoice for €149B or £130B.
There have been some class action lawsuits launched in the US in Florida and Nevada.
Interesting to see where this leads ...

[RippleRock]

Out of the National Post today.

COVID-19 reaches peak in Ontario and elsewhere in the country, with fewer people dying than feared.


Under Ontario’s grim modelling released earlier this month, the “best case” scenario had put the number of COVID-19 sufferers in intensive care at around 1,200 as of Monday.
According to Ontario government data, there were 247 people in intensive care on Monday morning, 193 of them on ventilators.
The earlier projections had also called for 1,600 deaths by April 30, and 80,000 cases. As of Monday morning, there were 584 reported deaths, 11,184 confirmed cases and 802 people in hospital.
Officials said the earlier models were reasonable and based on experiences in Italy and other countries, and that frightening data can get people to change their behaviours. The models are designed to plan for what could happen. However, the further out the forecast, the more uncertainty in the predictions. Brown said it’s hard to draw conclusions about mortality. While the expectation now is that Ontario will see a lower number of overall deaths, the ramp up of cases in long-term care homes “obviously makes it hard to predict a number of actual deaths.”

The pandemic curve in nursing homes (there are outbreaks in 127 long-term care homes in Ontario alone) homeless shelters and other places where a lot of people are brought close together is still accelerating upwards.
However, the Ontario curve, most provincial curves and even the national curve are showing signs of bending, Brown said. “We may be at a place where we are seeing roughly the same number of cases every day as we talk about peak.” Discussions are now happening about bringing some elective procedures back online while maintaining the ramped up hospital capacity as a buffer when the economy and society reopens “should we accidentally go back into a period of community spread,” said Matthew Anderson, president and CEO of Ontario Health.
British Columbia is now past the peak of new infections, Alberta is approaching its peak and Ontario and Quebec, “the worst-hit provinces, should reach their peaks within days,” Eric Hoskins, Ontario’s former health minister, recently wrote in the Globe and Mail. He added that barring any dramatic change in the epidemic, it would be reasonable to start cautiously loosening restrictions by early May.
About half of COVID-19 deaths in Canada have occurred in long-term care homes.



THE BEST CASE SCENARIO IN ONTARIO HAD 1200 PROJECTED IN INTENSIVE CARE BY NOW, AS OF MONDAY THEY HAD 247.
50% FROM LONG TERM OLD-AGE CARE HOMES. Meaning only 124 were from the general population.

The Government has clearly mis-managed this. They have used fear to manipulate the population. They really dropped the ball by NOT immediately securing and isolating the elderly in long-term care facilities and the disadvantaged housed in social support centers.

Great work Justin, now send us all the bill. A 5% Covid-19 recovery tax ---in perpetuity--- will suffice. (cuz taxes never seem to go away)

[AuxBatOn]

What is the definition of “peak”?

Most new cases in a day?
Most deaths in a day?
Most active cases?
Most ICU beds used?
Most ventilators used?

[RippleRock]

Even if you stick to the actual numbers showing up in hospitals, we are at only a fraction of the "best case" scenario projected overall.

Who would have thunk that the elderly in "close proximity long term care facilities" would produce the largest mortality numbers, and the most overall cases as a percentage of sub-groups?

Unreal. My 6 year old could have foreseen this before the Trudeau Government did. They are good at "reacting", that's about it.

Is anyone truly surprised?

[RippleRock]

What is the definition of “peak”?

Most new cases in a day?
Most deaths in a day?
Most active cases?
Most ICU beds used?
Most ventilators used?

Pick one, as they are all closely related but will have different numbers base on their percentage within the overall context.

No?

[Aviatard]

Unreal. My 6 year old could have foreseen this before the Trudeau Government did.

Then why didn't he?

[BTD]

Out of the National Post today.

COVID-19 reaches peak in Ontario and elsewhere in the country, with fewer people dying than feared.


Under Ontario’s grim modelling released earlier this month, the “best case” scenario had put the number of COVID-19 sufferers in intensive care at around 1,200 as of Monday.
According to Ontario government data, there were 247 people in intensive care on Monday morning, 193 of them on ventilators.
The earlier projections had also called for 1,600 deaths by April 30, and 80,000 cases. As of Monday morning, there were 584 reported deaths, 11,184 confirmed cases and 802 people in hospital.
Officials said the earlier models were reasonable and based on experiences in Italy and other countries, and that frightening data can get people to change their behaviours. The models are designed to plan for what could happen. However, the further out the forecast, the more uncertainty in the predictions. Brown said it’s hard to draw conclusions about mortality. While the expectation now is that Ontario will see a lower number of overall deaths, the ramp up of cases in long-term care homes “obviously makes it hard to predict a number of actual deaths.”

The pandemic curve in nursing homes (there are outbreaks in 127 long-term care homes in Ontario alone) homeless shelters and other places where a lot of people are brought close together is still accelerating upwards.
However, the Ontario curve, most provincial curves and even the national curve are showing signs of bending, Brown said. “We may be at a place where we are seeing roughly the same number of cases every day as we talk about peak.” Discussions are now happening about bringing some elective procedures back online while maintaining the ramped up hospital capacity as a buffer when the economy and society reopens “should we accidentally go back into a period of community spread,” said Matthew Anderson, president and CEO of Ontario Health.
British Columbia is now past the peak of new infections, Alberta is approaching its peak and Ontario and Quebec, “the worst-hit provinces, should reach their peaks within days,” Eric Hoskins, Ontario’s former health minister, recently wrote in the Globe and Mail. He added that barring any dramatic change in the epidemic, it would be reasonable to start cautiously loosening restrictions by early May.
About half of COVID-19 deaths in Canada have occurred in long-term care homes.



THE BEST CASE SCENARIO IN ONTARIO HAD 1200 PROJECTED IN INTENSIVE CARE BY NOW, AS OF MONDAY THEY HAD 247.
50% FROM LONG TERM OLD-AGE CARE HOMES. Meaning only 124 were from the general population.

The Government has clearly mis-managed this. They have used fear to manipulate the population. They really dropped the ball by NOT immediately securing and isolating the elderly in long-term care facilities and the disadvantaged housed in social support centers.

Great work Justin, now send us all the bill. A 5% Covid-19 recovery tax ---in perpetuity--- will suffice. (cuz taxes never seem to go away)

I won’t say this has been handled perfectly. In fact, a lot has been left to be desired, and I won’t defend Trudeau.

However, it is illogical to use the lower case numbers (which include mitigation measures such as social distancing) to argue that those mitigation measures were not required in the first place. We simply don’t know how bad it would have gotten had nothing been done. We only have one case study. It might have been a little worse than now or a lot worse.

That argument is like going skydiving and taking a parachute along for safety. Then after landing safely saying to yourself, well I survived that, why did I even bother with the parachute. Extreme comparison so maybe below is better.

Airbags are useless in cars. They are a waste of resources, they burn people’s hands and most people survive car accidents anyway. That argument ignores the fact that airbags are a significant reason people are surviving the accidents in the first place.

[goldeneagle]

Even if you stick to the actual numbers showing up in hospitals, we are at only a fraction of the "best case" scenario projected overall.

I have no information about Ontario. I have a lot of information about BC. Numbers in BC today are low. The goal of restrictions was to prevent our hospitals from overflowing. The hospitals in general were operating at / near capacity. To create capacity, elective surgery was cancelled, which created a significant amount of capacity to handle the expected influx of Covid-19 patients. At present, the hospitals are able to manage the loads coming in, we do not have a crisis like New York or some parts of Europe. For perspective, roughly 10 days ago, hospitals in New York were telling paramedics to not bring cardiac patients to the hospital if they required resuscitation, there was no capacity, so let the patients pass where they were.

The comparison our local folks are quietly making is to compare BC with Lousiana. Populations are roughly the same. In BC the message has been 'stay home', folks have been doing that, and our hospitals are not overflowing. In Louisana the message has been 'come to church', and they have been cramming folks 2000 at a time into the mega churches. Infection rate in Louisiana is 10x that of BC for a similar population. If our infection rate in BC was that high, then hospitalization rates would be also that much higher. If we had 10x the number of covid patients we do today, there wouldn't be enough beds in the hospitals for the covid patients, never mind all the other folks that are there for things like heart attacks, broken hips, etc.

So many folks just dont 'get it' on the reason for the path we are on, and get focussed on who is dieing from covid. We are on this path so that our hospitals have capacity for _all_ of the incoming patients and are not overflowing with covid-19 patients.