Request from a Recip pilot

Discuss topics relating to Air Canada.

Moderators: ahramin, sky's the limit, Sulako, North Shore

Post Reply
Message
Author
stickontheice
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 203
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:13 am

Request from a Recip pilot

#1 Post by stickontheice » Tue Jan 07, 2014 3:32 am

Hi everyone is there anyway that you guys can talk to your people in charge and make listing easier? Perhaps this day in age even list on the web?

I fly for WJ and I'm not sure how easy it is for you to list but man this phone number you guys have is always busy, if you get thru it's forever on hold, and ten it closes for the night. Trying to get from YVR to the island last minute and you think I'd be asking to reinvent the wheel when I called the reservation line.

As I wrote this I'm taking the bus to the ferry to go home. Too cheap for a cab! There were two YCD flights I wanted to get before I gave up. Started trying at 1900 and now it's 2115 and I'm freezing my a$$ off at a bus station. When I got they on the normal reservation line after 30 mins in hold she couldn't help me and we were disconnected. Super frustrating. Anyways rant over. Happy New Year. Fly safe
---------- ADS -----------
  

705dreamer
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:00 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#2 Post by 705dreamer » Tue Jan 07, 2014 12:00 pm

A web listing for recip pilots sure would be nice. At least you guys have the call back option on your phones...sometime. I have also spent up to an hour on hold trying to list for a WJ flight and just got frustrated and hung up. Life of commuting...
---------- ADS -----------
  

Koolaid
Rank 0
Rank 0
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:13 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#3 Post by Koolaid » Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:22 pm

I have an idea for you. How about you stop complaining about access to free airline tickets. Better yet why don't you just pay full fare and you will be able to book right online as you would like. AC passes are a privilege, perhaps you should be grateful to have them. Maybe instead of asking AC to change their system for you, you can ask WestJet to start operating into the island. . . . . Rant Over ;) Happy New Year
---------- ADS -----------
  

bcflyer
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 8:35 am
Location: Canada

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#4 Post by bcflyer » Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:32 pm

Wow that's quite a rant. Are you perhaps a bit jealous that someone has access to something you don't?
Stickontheice, just ignore the new guy, there are many of us at AC who are quite embarrassed at the ridiculous process to get recip pilots listed. In my eyes it jeopardizes agreements we have with other carriers. Unfortunately fixing the problem is very low on the priority list at AC. It's a program that benefits one group only so diverting funds to make it work properly is unlikely to happen in the near future. :(
---------- ADS -----------
  

razorblade
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 250
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:31 am
Location: YYZ

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#5 Post by razorblade » Thu Jan 09, 2014 2:55 pm

Stickontheice,
Yeah the AC phone number is quite the pain on most days, but I guess there really is no way out at the moment.
But if anything (I'm sure you knew this already)- WS has the "call-back" feature if the hold is way too long! Absolutely amazing. Even that would help out the AC line out!
---------- ADS -----------
  

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#6 Post by ahramin » Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:24 pm

In my eyes it jeopardizes agreements we have with other carriers.
That's really the point. A reciprocal jumpseat agreement is negotiated with the company by the pilots at that company in order to be able to jumpseat on other companies. My company offers so little to AC pilots that we would never cancel our jumpseat agreement with AC no matter how difficult listing is. It's still an advantage for us. I suspect WJ pilots are in somewhat of a similar situation.

If several big foreign carriers canceled their agreements with with AC, then there would be ammo for the AC pilots to push for a change. In my opinion this is not outside the realm of possibility as the AC listing system is way, way worse than anything I've encountered or even heard of.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
BKerns
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 37
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:44 am
Location: Canada

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#7 Post by BKerns » Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:42 pm

I happily pay full fare to get yqt to Toronto for the days off. Fly when I want, dress how I want, and don't have to suck up to the gate agents and beg to get a ride home. I don't like being treated like a donkey unless I'm really cheap or trying to go on a longer route. For 250 bucks it's worth it for me to pay.

It's not my place to complain about the free ride woes so I take my pick and deal with it.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Fake it till you make it.

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#8 Post by ahramin » Thu Jan 09, 2014 6:45 pm

Stickontheice, as long as we're on the subject, how about Westjet changes its policy so that reciprocal jumpseat pilots can check in at a kiosk like we can with Air Canada instead of having to wait in long lines with all the people not smart enough to figure out how to check in themselves?

In Vancouver I usually book one jumpseat ticket on Air Canada to get a boarding pass, and one on Westjet to actually get to where I'm going.
---------- ADS -----------
  

TheStig
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 563
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:34 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#9 Post by TheStig » Thu Jan 09, 2014 7:00 pm

ahramin wrote: I usually book one jumpseat ticket on Air Canada to get a boarding pass, and one on Westjet to actually get to where I'm going.
That's really clever.
---------- ADS -----------
  

sstaurus
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 555
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 4:32 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#10 Post by sstaurus » Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:24 pm

ahramin wrote:Stickontheice, as long as we're on the subject, how about Westjet changes its policy so that reciprocal jumpseat pilots can check in at a kiosk like we can with Air Canada instead of having to wait in long lines with all the people not smart enough to figure out how to check in themselves?

In Vancouver I usually book one jumpseat ticket on Air Canada to get a boarding pass, and one on Westjet to actually get to where I'm going.
I always wonder, why are there so many people in these lines? Is this their first time flying and they have no idea what checking in means?


Also just to note, I've gotten the 'we'll call you back' service on AC as well, but it doesn't always work. WJ doesn't always work either, sometimes you need to call back 2 or 3 times to get it.
---------- ADS -----------
  

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#11 Post by ahramin » Fri Jan 10, 2014 11:58 pm

I've never had a problem with WJ's call back and I call a lot.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Jack In The Box
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 238
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:51 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#12 Post by Jack In The Box » Sat Jan 11, 2014 4:35 pm

razorblade wrote:Stickontheice,
Yeah the AC phone number is quite the pain on most days, but I guess there really is no way out at the moment.
But if anything (I'm sure you knew this already)- WS has the "call-back" feature if the hold is way too long! Absolutely amazing. Even that would help out the AC line out!
I truly wonder how much business this loses AC. I realize they aren't exactly targeting the every day average customer like WJ is, but I can't help but wonder if not investing in this technology hurts their bottom line...I know of several friends that don't even bother calling AC to book, they just call WJ for this very reason. Silly? Maybe, but it's still effective.
---------- ADS -----------
  

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#13 Post by ahramin » Sat Jan 11, 2014 6:49 pm

I think your freinds are part of a very small minority. Most people book their flights on the internet nowadays. Most of those are on iPads or some other form of tablet, and WJ's site is quite bad for mobile users. Add that to the excellent app AC has and I think WJ is loosing more money than AC from lack of technology investment.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
justwork
Rank 6
Rank 6
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 7:59 am

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#14 Post by justwork » Sat Jan 11, 2014 9:47 pm

Koolaid wrote:I have an idea for you. How about you stop complaining about access to free airline tickets. Better yet why don't you just pay full fare and you will be able to book right online as you would like. AC passes are a privilege, perhaps you should be grateful to have them. Maybe instead of asking AC to change their system for you, you can ask WestJet to start operating into the island. . . . . Rant Over ;) Happy New Year
:shock:
What a DICK! Don't worry, the Encore Q400 will soon be crushing AC on their Vancouver Island routes.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
daedalusx
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 139
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:51 am

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#15 Post by daedalusx » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:15 am

The irony is that I would be more than willing to pay 15 $ each time to get to a human being in less than 15 minutes. Last two calls were more than 90 min.
---------- ADS -----------
  
In twenty years time when your kids ask how you got into flying you want to be able to say "work and determination" not "I just kept taking money from your grandparents for type ratings until someone was stupid enough to give me a job"

3down&loct
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 64
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:52 am

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#16 Post by 3down&loct » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:47 am

Tonight 20mins just to get into the que. 2.00 hrs and still on hold. Bottom line, as pilots in the industry we need to make it easier for each other. We are one big family and should help each other. Really sucks for Jumpseaters to have to go though agent at WJ to check in and really sucks to try and book with AC with their long holds.
The states from what I understand take care of each other.
BTW hanging up now. I f##king give up AC.
Cheers!
---------- ADS -----------
  

Norwegianwood
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 291
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 3:16 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#17 Post by Norwegianwood » Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:05 am

3down&loct wrote:Tonight 20mins just to get into the que. 2.00 hrs and still on hold. Bottom line, as pilots in the industry we need to make it easier for each other. We are one big family and should help each other. Really sucks for Jumpseaters to have to go though agent at WJ to check in and really sucks to try and book with AC with their long holds.
The states from what I understand take care of each other.
BTW hanging up now. I f##king give up AC.
Cheers!
Welcome to the acpa world.......... 'nuf said!!!! :arrow:

Oh I forgot .......... :smt078
---------- ADS -----------
  

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#18 Post by ahramin » Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:13 am

Yesterday I was jumpseating on AC and got to help out a very confused United Airlines pilot. He managed to get a pass to get through security to the gate, but then the gate agent of course couldn't find him in the system. He was trying to explain to the gate agent that he wanted to be listed for a jumpseat and the gate agent was trying to explain to him that he would have to call AC to list but the flight was boarding in 10 minutes and it usually takes longer than that to list.

Americans are completely flabbergasted when they encounter our system because it is insane that any pilot would accept it. In the US the Captain of any flight would simply wait until the jumpseater got on or the plane wouldn't leave. They simply refuse to accept any system that takes cockpit jumpseats away from pilots.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Elessar_44
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 177
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:34 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#19 Post by Elessar_44 » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:58 pm

I waited 2h 44m a few Saturdays ago as I had to switch to the next day's flights last minute, and the check in agent said she couldn't move my ticket to the following day, had to call the line. I'm surprised I got through as it was after 9pm when someone finally picked up. Best part of it all, the actual call lasted all of 3 minutes to get the flight switched.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Stu Pidasso
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2010 12:55 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#20 Post by Stu Pidasso » Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:32 pm

justwork wrote:
Koolaid wrote:I have an idea for you. How about you stop complaining about access to free airline tickets. Better yet why don't you just pay full fare and you will be able to book right online as you would like. AC passes are a privilege, perhaps you should be grateful to have them. Maybe instead of asking AC to change their system for you, you can ask WestJet to start operating into the island. . . . . Rant Over ;) Happy New Year
:shock:
What a DICK! Don't worry, the Encore Q400 will soon be crushing AC on their Vancouver Island routes.
Now we have two dicks ! I used the WJ JS the other day out of YZ, stood in line for over an hour while ONE ticket agent worked the crowd. Nothing's perfect.......
---------- ADS -----------
  

RVR6000
Rank 5
Rank 5
Posts: 347
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 7:25 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#21 Post by RVR6000 » Sun Feb 23, 2014 11:13 am

ahramin wrote:Yesterday I was jumpseating on AC and got to help out a very confused United Airlines pilot. He managed to get a pass to get through security to the gate, but then the gate agent of course couldn't find him in the system. He was trying to explain to the gate agent that he wanted to be listed for a jumpseat and the gate agent was trying to explain to him that he would have to call AC to list but the flight was boarding in 10 minutes and it usually takes longer than that to list.

Americans are completely flabbergasted when they encounter our system because it is insane that any pilot would accept it. In the US the Captain of any flight would simply wait until the jumpseater got on or the plane wouldn't leave. They simply refuse to accept any system that takes cockpit jumpseats away from pilots.

Not true, its frustrating jumpseating in the States too. You have to list yourself on vague websites that are tough to find, impossible to get heads up on loads, and explaining how you can't ride that actual J/S that you need a seat in the back. I've had operates hang up on me when trying to list - United. I have found Southwest to be the easiest to Jumpseat.
---------- ADS -----------
  

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5499
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#22 Post by ahramin » Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:19 pm

Did you try just walking up to the gate and requesting a jumpseat? I don't have reciprocals with United but that is how it works with Delta, Jetblue, US Airways, Virgin America ...

Obviously as we aren't CASS approved, we can't sit in US cockpits. In my experience though, as a Canadian it's easier for me to get a jumpseat ticket on a US airline, than it is on a Canadian airline. Plus internal jumpseat travel in the US is free free as opposed to $30 free.

And obviously as a US pilot jumpseating on any US airline, you aren't going to be left behind on the ground with 4 empty jumpseats in the plane because the cabin filled up with baggage handlers' friends and relations. Regularly happens to me in Canada though, which is the point I'm trying to make. They tried to push that system on the pilots in the US, and it didn't last long.
---------- ADS -----------
  

shagger
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 32
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 12:18 pm

Re: Request from a Recip pilot

#23 Post by shagger » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:06 am

justwork wrote:
Koolaid wrote:I have an idea for you. How about you stop complaining about access to free airline tickets. Better yet why don't you just pay full fare and you will be able to book right online as you would like. AC passes are a privilege, perhaps you should be grateful to have them. Maybe instead of asking AC to change their system for you, you can ask WestJet to start operating into the island. . . . . Rant Over ;) Happy New Year
:shock:
What a DICK! Don't worry, the Encore Q400 will soon be crushing AC on their Vancouver Island routes.

You are both dicks. Fact is the 1 800 number for AC blows goats for employees too. As an AC pilot the wj one is FAR superior and we are lucky to have the agreement. I will say for US airlines they can be just as frustrating as AC with long wait times. The call back thing with wj is very good but I have had to wait up to an hour and a half to list. At least the phone wasn't pasted to my face.

Long wait times for employees are industry standard. Paying customers first.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Post Reply

Return to “Air Canada”