WestJet to Purchase 787's

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complexintentions
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WestJet to Purchase 787's

#1 Post by complexintentions » Tue May 02, 2017 5:11 am

Thought I'd put it in it's own thread...


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-o ... e34871959/
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#2 Post by mato » Tue May 02, 2017 6:38 am

Great news for WS. Excited to see this happen, and curious what new routes we may see.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#3 Post by Old fella » Tue May 02, 2017 6:44 am

Congrats to WJ, I am sure they will do quite well in the International long haul market.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#4 Post by FICU » Tue May 02, 2017 6:57 am

"Now pilots... unionize and the 87s are off the table for you and will be run by a non-union workforce similar to Encore." ;)
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#5 Post by atphat » Tue May 02, 2017 7:59 am

Good news for everyone at WJ.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#6 Post by tailgunner » Wed May 03, 2017 6:58 am

Actual pilot numbers are going down, No?
Ordered 10 787's, and changed 15 737 confirmed orders into options. Ergo, 5 less fins overall and less pilots overall.
A 787 heading to Europe only needs 2 pilots ( under the current contact ) to operate 8-10 hours. And 2 more to return a few hours later. So, as near as I can tell, that is 4 pilots per 24 hours. A 737, with the current contract and route structure, probably needs 6 pilots per 24 hour period. So, as far as overall pilot numbers are concerned, the cancelling of these 737 confirmed orders with the 787 order, is an actual NET LOSS of overall pilot numbers required at WJ.
Perhaps some of the enthusiasm should be tempered if one is not yet on the property, or if one is looking to upgrade soon.
Anyways, have a cheery day in WJ land..
Cheers.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#7 Post by DropTanks » Wed May 03, 2017 10:41 am

Going down? Ummmm don't think so.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#8 Post by gasbag1 » Wed May 03, 2017 11:09 am

The wording of the announcement is interesting. Boeing has not announced anything. Usually they are out on every social media site announcing an order like this. Confirmed orders are always announced, so why not this one...

Good news but more information is required.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#9 Post by Transonic » Wed May 03, 2017 12:08 pm

tailgunner wrote:Actual pilot numbers are going down, No?
Ordered 10 787's, and changed 15 737 confirmed orders into options. Ergo, 5 less fins overall and less pilots overall.
A 787 heading to Europe only needs 2 pilots ( under the current contact ) to operate 8-10 hours. And 2 more to return a few hours later. So, as near as I can tell, that is 4 pilots per 24 hours. A 737, with the current contract and route structure, probably needs 6 pilots per 24 hour period. So, as far as overall pilot numbers are concerned, the cancelling of these 737 confirmed orders with the 787 order, is an actual NET LOSS of overall pilot numbers required at WJ.
Perhaps some of the enthusiasm should be tempered if one is not yet on the property, or if one is looking to upgrade soon.
Anyways, have a cheery day in WJ land..
Cheers.
From a highly credible source, WS needs 4-7 more 737 tails (Dec 2016 amount) to feed 20 787s. To reduce future capital spending in the early 2020s, WestJet will hold on to the NGs longer as the average fleet age is approx 7.5years.

As a rule of thumb, 10 crews per wide body aircraft.

Net gain for WS pilots.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#10 Post by Jean-Pierre » Wed May 03, 2017 12:41 pm

gasbag1 wrote:The wording of the announcement is interesting. Boeing has not announced anything. Usually they are out on every social media site announcing an order like this. Confirmed orders are always announced, so why not this one...

Good news but more information is required.
Because they must get the news out before the union vote?
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#11 Post by tailgunner » Wed May 03, 2017 1:51 pm

Transonic,
the required uplift of 4-7 737 to feed 20 787's actually breaks down to 2-3.5 for the 10 confirmed 787 orders. Furthermore, the change in status of future 737 deliveries from 'confirmed' to 'options'does not lead me to believe that WJ mainline will be counted on to "feed" the 787's. Does not Encore have 15 more DHC400's to be delivered? In my estimation, that is exactly where the feed growth for the 787's will be seen. I estimate that the current fleet of 737's will remain static in number at best, or even reduce in number, while Encore will grow.
But just my 2 cents.....
Further questions need to be asked of the WJPA and WJ management.
Cheers.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#12 Post by aerobod » Wed May 03, 2017 2:10 pm

tailgunner wrote:Transonic,
the required uplift of 4-7 737 to feed 20 787's actually breaks down to 2-3.5 for the 10 confirmed 787 orders. Furthermore, the change in status of future 737 deliveries from 'confirmed' to 'options'does not lead me to believe that WJ mainline will be counted on to "feed" the 787's. Does not Encore have 15 more DHC400's to be delivered? In my estimation, that is exactly where the feed growth for the 787's will be seen. I estimate that the current fleet of 737's will remain static in number at best, or even reduce in number, while Encore will grow.
But just my 2 cents.....
Further questions need to be asked of the WJPA and WJ management.
Cheers.
No need to ask WJ management about the fleet plans, it is public information. The latest fleet plan is on P21 of the quarterly report here, including all the MAX deliveries and 787s: https://www.westjet.com/assets/wj-web/d ... Report.pdf
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#13 Post by twinpratts » Wed May 03, 2017 3:53 pm

gasbag1 wrote:The wording of the announcement is interesting. Boeing has not announced anything. Usually they are out on every social media site announcing an order like this. Confirmed orders are always announced, so why not this one...

Good news but more information is required.
There is a pic of a Deamliner on the boeing.com website... is that proof enough for ya? :lol:
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#14 Post by DanJ » Wed May 03, 2017 7:02 pm

twinpratts wrote:
gasbag1 wrote:The wording of the announcement is interesting. Boeing has not announced anything. Usually they are out on every social media site announcing an order like this. Confirmed orders are always announced, so why not this one...

Good news but more information is required.
There is a pic of a Deamliner on the boeing.com website... is that proof enough for ya? :lol:
And there's a press release there too.
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Re: WestJet to Purchase 787's

#15 Post by gasbag1 » Fri May 05, 2017 11:01 am

I see the Boeing announcement as a commitment, not a firm order. My question is a what is a commitment these days? Is it you can announce but money must be paid by X date or some other requirement.
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