SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

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montado
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#1 Post by montado » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:53 pm

I think the plan is that WS pilots will fly the aircraft that end up at Swoop. In 3 years, probably flow from encore to westjet via swoop. You can Swoop your way to Westjet, now ain't that an Encore if I ever seen one.
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swimming
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#2 Post by swimming » Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:23 pm

They are lease returns being replaced by MAXs. 6 returns being replaced by 7 MAXs in 2018.
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m9:24
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#3 Post by m9:24 » Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:01 pm

Between new duty regs coming requiring an increase in pilots, plus staffing the 787s by year end, WJ likely has enough pilots right now to meet all demand, especially as tails migrate to Swoop. The chance of any hiring in the new future at WJ is pretty unlikely in my mind.
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mmm..bacon
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#4 Post by mmm..bacon » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:06 am

m9:24 wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:01 pm
Between new duty regs coming requiring an increase in pilots, plus staffing the 787s by year end, WJ likely has enough pilots right now to meet all demand, especially as tails migrate to Swoop. The chance of any hiring in the new future at WJ is pretty unlikely in my mind.
...Well, until AC starts poaching 737-rated pilots ...
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Rotten Apple #1
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#5 Post by Rotten Apple #1 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:57 am

YVR Lurker wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:42 pm
As WJ migrates 10 tails to Swoop, what happens to the 100 or so pilots that the company is now fat on? What happens in 3 years when they migrate another 10-30 tails?
The Single Employer provisions of the CIRB were designed to expressly deal with the situation you envision. If jobs start to migrate to Swoop, then ALPA will rightly be in a position to claim Single Employer and combine Swoop's pilots with the ALPA bargaining unit at WJ and therefore boost Swoop's pay and work conditions to that of WJ.

Praise KeK!
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Boreas
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#6 Post by Boreas » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:13 am

Rotten Apple #1 wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:57 am
YVR Lurker wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:42 pm
As WJ migrates 10 tails to Swoop, what happens to the 100 or so pilots that the company is now fat on? What happens in 3 years when they migrate another 10-30 tails?
The Single Employer provisions of the CIRB were designed to expressly deal with the situation you envision. If jobs start to migrate to Swoop, then ALPA will rightly be in a position to claim Single Employer and combine Swoop's pilots with the ALPA bargaining unit at WJ and therefore boost Swoop's pay and work conditions to that of WJ.

Praise KeK!
They're gonna help out the same pilots they just blacklisted? :rolleyes:
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#7 Post by saltypilot » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:29 am

Rotten Apple #1, observing your posts I can’t help but feel they most certainly read like an individual with designs to draw out the worst in others. I don’t like it at all. You shouldn’t like how the words you choose seem to bring out incredibly negative responses not just from one but many. Nobody should be feeding into this awful game. It’s one nobody will win. I’d like to respectfully suggest that we divert some energy and attention away from inciting divisiveness & infighting over to adding value to aviators lives. Can we agree that would be a more constructive use of our time?

I’ll be the first to say I’m as guilty as anyone else of getting swept up in the emotion, after all it’s really easy to get caught up in the politics of it all because our professional careers are attached to the outcomes so they MUST be positive outcomes. The alternative is unacceptable. Our families or our future families suffer every ounce as much as we do in every decision that is made throughout this process and that includes the words we choose or the actions we take.

In a day and age where everyone is offended so easily

From one human to another, Live in grace man.
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#8 Post by skybaron » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:05 am

Can someone that works at WJ provide some insight on why they are operating 3 companies under the same Holding Company?

From a layman’s point of view, it seems like an aweful lot of WASTED “man power” in the sense that each of these companies, particularly Encore and now Swoop, all have their own corporate hierarchy who report to GS and the BOD.

Example: Encore has its own president and Vp’s, who all take direction from GS, and I imagine Swoop will be no different. Combine that with separate crews, crew schedulers, dispatchers etc (the list goes on), but same operations control, it seems like aweful waste of additional salaries when they could’ve just used the one that is existing - WJ’s.

The salaries of the executives alone at these “separate entities” must be pretty significant in terms of expense - especially that they have no say in anything that GS doesn’t approve of. Kind of makes their roles useless - as WJ’s BOD’s controls everything.
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Re: SWOOP startup/WJ Tail loss

#9 Post by altiplano » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:43 am

They piss money up a rope with the duplication, loss of economies of scale, loss of flexibility between aircraft and crews...let alone customer and brand confusion...

But...

Division is priceless.
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