China_CAAC's Merged Threads

[seriousflyer]

OP sounds a little emotional and on edge from last week's news. This is all part of negotiations. Let the professionals at ALPA and the trusted MEC do their jobs.

Nobody wants a successful outcome more than ALPA and MEC.

[Greenbastard]

JS you need to go get, and enjoy life. It’s fine that you chose not to support your representatives and your pilot group, that’s your choice. Let’s be clear nobody will follow your lead off a cliff. People read your posts with mild amusement ( like a Trump tweet ).Your posts are foolish and cowardly.

[Checklist]

I see your “coming clean” thread was removed, Rotten. Very unfortunate, easily your best work.

Otherwise, I feel you were a tad overpaid.

[saltypilot]

Copied from another thread because it needs to be repeated

Rotten Apple #1, observing your posts I can’t help but feel they most certainly read like an individual with designs to draw out the worst in others. I don’t like it at all. You shouldn’t like how the words you choose seem to bring out incredibly negative responses not just from one but many. Nobody should be feeding into this awful game. It’s one nobody will win. I’d like to respectfully suggest that we divert some energy and attention away from inciting divisiveness & infighting over to adding value to aviators lives. Can we agree that would be a more constructive use of our time?

I’ll be the first to say I’m as guilty as anyone else of getting swept up in the emotion after all it’s really easy to get caught up in the politics of it all because our professional careers are attached to the outcomes so they MUST be positive outcomes. The alternative is unacceptable. Our families or our future families suffer every ounce as much as we do in every decision that is made throughout this process.

In a day and age where everyone is offended so easily

From one human to another, Live in grace man.

[NewCommercialPilot]

I might have been wrong about ALPA's motivation for choosing the conciliation approach to bargaining. Although, it does get them dues money which they are not getting (unlike JetBlue), it appears from this memo from the JetBlue MEC that all members are responsible for dues from the time they were eligible for membership in ALPA. For JetBlue this was about three months after certification, so for the WJ, I guess we could say that ALPA will be looking for dues back dated to roughly August 1, 2017.

Although ALPA won't be able to force the money from its members, anyone who doesn't pony up will be considered in bad standing and unable to vote etc.

In any event, better that ALPA get the dues flowing sooner rather than later like any corporation.

If were to become a member, my dues owing would be roughly $2000 at this point.

Cheers Big Ears!

[Alcoholism]

You have to give John credit. He has inflamed the passions of many here, the Westjet forum has never been so active. Is he a troll, or is he just a loud voice of the minority at WS? Maybe both? He has made good points and terrible ones. What does it matter, I said it before and I'll say it again, Swoop will be flown by WS pilots, why the whole debate and craziness is beyond me. Just chill, let ALPA handle it, if you don't have faith in them, then de-cert like Johnny boy wants.

[FL410AV8R]

You have to give John credit. He has inflamed the passions of many here, the Westjet forum has never been so active. Is he a troll, or is he just a loud voice of the minority at WS? Maybe both? He has made good points and terrible ones. What does it matter, I said it before and I'll say it again, Swoop will be flown by WS pilots, why the whole debate and craziness is beyond me. Just chill, let ALPA handle it, if you don't have faith in them, then de-cert like Johnny boy wants.

And another personality appears from the closet.

Talking about yourself in the third person and giving yourself credit is yet another low.

[lostaviator]

My lunch money is on one of his usernames being a moderator on the site. Would explain the multitude of user names and the change of original poster on this specific thread.

[Alcoholism]

You have to give John credit. He has inflamed the passions of many here, the Westjet forum has never been so active. Is he a troll, or is he just a loud voice of the minority at WS? Maybe both? He has made good points and terrible ones. What does it matter, I said it before and I'll say it again, Swoop will be flown by WS pilots, why the whole debate and craziness is beyond me. Just chill, let ALPA handle it, if you don't have faith in them, then de-cert like Johnny boy wants.

And another personality appears from the closet.

Talking about yourself in the third person and giving yourself credit is yet another low.

You could also be one of the many personalities. Or, what if this whole forum is just you and I? No one else

[WeedPro2000]

I'm thinking JetBlue pilots wouldn't approve of WestJet pilots who applied long after they were able to join not being responsible for past dues, while JetBlue pilots who didn't apply right away would be responsible for past dues. Come to think of it, it makes sense. Why not wait as long as you can to join and avoid the dues.

In any case, look at the screenshot and let me know what you think. I think #37 has a hotline to the ALPA inner sanctum so maybe he can figure out this situation.

Ergo, Uncle H., will WJ pilots have to pay back dues to ALPA? And if not, are the happy not happy JetBlue pilots okay with the double standard? What does ALPA's constitution say?

Later bater.

WP2K

[hurtin'albertan]

WeedPro/NCP/Rotten Apple/etc:

Get informed before you spout bullsh!t to stir the pot...

Canada, betch. Different rules than the US. If you had the smarts to actually be an ALPA member you would have gotten this in the fastread yesterday:

"ALPA Grants WestJet Pilots their 4th Quarter Budget
As you know WestJet pilots are not currently paying dues and will not be until we have ratified a collective agreement. There have been questions about whether ALPA is just loaning us the money to operate, essentially leaving us in considerable debt. This is not the case. We have been operating on a budget developed by MEC and the ALPA Finance Department that is similar in size to what we expect once we do begin paying dues. We are pleased to let everyone know our fourth-quarter expenditures came in well under budget. Also, those funds have been granted to the WJA MEC, leaving our pilot group in a debt-free position. Our MEC does not owe any money to ALPA. The same process will be followed until we begin paying dues and we intend to continue to maintain a balanced budget at all times."

[FL410AV8R]

I'm thinking JetBlue pilots wouldn't approve of WestJet pilots who applied long after they were able to join not being responsible for past dues, while JetBlue pilots who didn't apply right away would be responsible for past dues. Come to think of it, it makes sense. Why not wait as long as you can to join and avoid the dues.

In any case, look at the screenshot and let me know what you think. I think #37 has a hotline to the ALPA inner sanctum so maybe he can figure out this situation.

Ergo, Uncle H., will WJ pilots have to pay back dues to ALPA? And if not, are the happy not happy JetBlue pilots okay with the double standard? What does ALPA's constitution say?

Later bater.

WP2K

You are aware of that phenomenon know as he 49th parallel are you not?

This line also known as the Canada/US border acts as the dividing line between the sovereign nations of Canada and the United States of America. Different countries with different labour and employment laws and standards.

Trying to draw parallels between employees covered by the Railway Labor Act in the US and those covered by the Canada Labour Code here in Canada is disengenuous in the extreme.

[NéwCommercialPilot]

Why are you guys worried about multiple personalities.

[mbav8r]

Bump.
jsyk

Why?

[Schooner69A]

GM:

I think everybody should go by their real name; it would breed a lot more civility.

I started using the Schooner69 moniker years and years ago as it identified my Sabre squadron and my call-sign number. I tried to change it to my name but couldn't seem to do so.

Would you support a change to all real names instead of "handles"?

John Swallow

PS What is your name?

[Flyingsquirrelsuck]

I miss John. Where did he go? I hope he is ok

[WeedPro2000]

Well, it has been a long time coming: the day when I got to say, I told you so, regarding the end of the WPDL (aka One List) in the event that ALPA certified, is almost here.

As I just explained to Rezy, here, the WPDL is dead. We are just awaiting the funeral arrangements to be published.

I spent a fair bit of time and my own money over a year ago trying to show why ALPA could never authroize the WPDL without being the subject of legal action from OTS members. I showed very clearly why ALPA's Constitution and its Executive Board policy, along with Canadian legal precedent with respect to union constitutions all combined to prohibit ALPA from anything other than a DOH seniority list. Indeed, there is an position bid occuring right now that willl use this seniority list to award Swoop and WestJet pilot positions.

I was right. Everyone else (who disputed my findings) was wrong. However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence. No, there are too many losers as a result of what will happen shortly. I do not celebrate their anger, nor their misfortune. There will be huge winners too, those OTS pilots who will now leap frog (some by as much as 350 pilot numbers) ahead of their Encore flow pilot colleagues. If you add the unhappy-former-Encore-already-at-WJ pilots to the soon-to-be-unhappy WJ-soon-to-be-Swoop-pilots-who-will-work-for-less-than-WJ-pay to the unhappy-senior-pilots-who-aren't-geting-seniority-bidding to the unhappy-pilots-who realize-that-it-is-almost-impossible-to-remove-the-MEC-members-from-their-positions to the unhappy-pilots-who-will-be-working-18-days-a-month-versus-the-previous-max-of-16-days, why I think you start to get some unity there.

Ok Jungs, take care. I hope you all found it a worthwhile exercise, this whole ALPA flop. Me I cracked 50 bridge jumps on Friday in Twin Falls, and I think I'm headed back for a few more tomorrow. I have a 28,000 foot skydive planned for next Monday in Tennessee, so I have to work out my travel arrangements. In the meantime, y'all take care.

PS.,

Q. What is the plural of "y'all"?

A. "All y'all"!

In unity!

[George Taylor]

However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence.

No fear of that JS.

[eyebrow737]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[Ex DC10 Driver]

The list should have been kept simple. Your date of hire on the list is the date you started at WestJet. Still have 100 % flow and there is your carrot. But with no off the street out of sequence hiring. That’s not what happened and now we have the debacle of the list