WJPilotFacts.com

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Flyingsquirrelsuck
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WJPilotFacts.com

#1 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:29 am

WJPilotFacts.com

More bargaining in public by the executive.
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WeedPro2000
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#2 Post by WeedPro2000 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:12 am

88 days until Swoop starts flying (and a 4th airplane being added in August) with WJ pilots NOT in the front seats and you're big worry is that CK is keeping the pilots informed of FACTUAL information rather than a mixture of fact and rumo(u)r? And how's the recruitment ban working out? Gotta love IFALPA love-ins in Luxembourg while the issues are back here in Canada...

It's unfortunate that ALPA forced the negotiation to take place in such a short window. With only 10 scheduled bargaining days left until conciliation is scheduled to end, well, good luck.

By the way, if you are truly interested in sucking a flying squirrel, give me a call.

P.S. I notched my 4th orange sticker from a clipboard last night on the flight from LAX. Hope you guys have lots.
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Maritimer
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#3 Post by Maritimer » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:31 am

Let me get this straight, you are removing stickers from the flight deck, placed by your coworkers, that detail who to call and what to do in the event of an accident/incident?

You are much lower than I ever thought. You are a cancer to this group. Please leave.

P.S. at least your post confirmed some of the rumours that have been circulating about you. I’ll let you figure out which part.
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Flyingsquirrelsuck
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#4 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:43 am

WeedPro2000 wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:12 am
88 days until Swoop starts flying (and a 4th airplane being added in August) with WJ pilots NOT in the front seats and you're big worry is that CK is keeping the pilots informed of FACTUAL information rather than a mixture of fact and rumo(u)r? And how's the recruitment ban working out? Gotta love IFALPA love-ins in Luxembourg while the issues are back here in Canada...

It's unfortunate that ALPA forced the negotiation to take place in such a short window. With only 10 scheduled bargaining days left until conciliation is scheduled to end, well, good luck.

By the way, if you are truly interested in sucking a flying squirrel, give me a call.

P.S. I notched my 4th orange sticker from a clipboard last night on the flight from LAX. Hope you guys have lots.
I’m conflicted John whether to feel sorry for you, or just not pay attention anymore. Do me a favour please don’t ever sign an ALPA card. I don’t want you ever having a chance to vote on my future at Westjet.

If you actually knew what was going on behind closed doors you would know that website is not completely truthful when talking about the negotiation process. And now switching the comparators yet again from previous internal emails.

The thing is John, the day that you might need to call the ALPA accident/incident hotline (202)797-4180, someone will answer the phone and provide you and the crew with full support and assistance.
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digits_
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#5 Post by digits_ » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:40 am

What stickers are you talking about? Do you have a picture?
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landshark
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#6 Post by landshark » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:46 am

14270244-F812-4D53-9BD2-D8BD1A264FC1.jpeg
14270244-F812-4D53-9BD2-D8BD1A264FC1.jpeg (831.78 KiB) Viewed 5933 times
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digits_
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#7 Post by digits_ » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:50 am

landshark wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:46 am
14270244-F812-4D53-9BD2-D8BD1A264FC1.jpeg
Where are you supposed to hang those?

Wouldn't it be an issue to put up instructions that are different from the ones in your ops manual?
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landshark
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#8 Post by landshark » Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:14 am

They’re given to ALPA members. Some people take the initiative to place them on the flight deck clipboard. Definitely not a spot in the COM where to hang them!
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Mach1
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#9 Post by Mach1 » Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:21 pm

Flyingsquirrelsuck wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:43 am
If you actually knew what was going on behind closed doors you would know that website is not completely truthful when talking about the negotiation process. And now switching the comparators yet again from previous internal emails.
Same comparators in the email I got. With that said, I find it amusing that the idea was actually forwarded that one of our only two comparators is our contract from 5 years ago. Yay.... we can work our way all the back to where we were 5 years ago!! I'm very excited to hear that.
landshark wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:14 am
They’re given to ALPA members.
I have never received one.
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I'm going to knock this up a notch with my spice weasle. Bam!

Dyna
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#10 Post by Dyna » Sat Mar 24, 2018 2:20 pm

Thanks for posting the picture landshark, I have saved a copy to my phone. Some jackwagon can remove them all he wants now. If I ever need that phone number I may not remember to grab the clipboard before I leave the flight deck, but my phone is always in the holster on my hip.

Thank you John! I wouldn’t have thought to do this otherwise.
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lostaviator
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#11 Post by lostaviator » Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:19 pm

Does the number just send you to the DK desk like the WJPA number did??? :lol:
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Demeter
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#12 Post by Demeter » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:08 pm

The holster on your hip! Lol :wink:
Agreed keep the bloody stickers of the stuff in the plane.
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#13 Post by groundpilot » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:39 pm

From the website:

Our compensation philosophy during negotiations is to compare ourselves to our true competition, which are other value carriers operating in our shared market, such as Rouge and Air Transat. As we continue to evolve in order to eventually achieve and exceed our See It 2022 vision of becoming a global carrier that is well established and effectively competing in the premium / business traveller space (not a simple or immediately achievable task), our comparators may evolve to also include Air Canada.

Rouge and Air Transat are your true competition?

Is this some kind of joke?

Last time I checked, I see WJ in LGA, LAX, ORD, JFK, DEN, etc operating to all major airports throughout Canada, which except for a few minor exceptions (YYZ-YYJ for example) is all done by Air Canada MAINLINE.

I dont understand how they dont see WJ as a direct competition and a true comparator to AIR CANADA MAINLINE

Smoke & Mirrors?!

Hope ALPA sorts this garbage out
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PostmasterGeneral
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#14 Post by PostmasterGeneral » Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:25 pm

As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
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Flyingsquirrelsuck
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#15 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:40 am

PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:25 pm
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
Best to check the ticket prices between Westjet and AC. You will be surprised, there is not allot of difference and it’s common you pay the same for the same flight.

From an employee perspective, we fly more, spend more time away from home, and fly the same aircraft. (737 Max)

Westjet has heavy aircraft, a regional airline and flies internationally.
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#16 Post by PostmasterGeneral » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:25 am

Flyingsquirrelsuck wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:40 am
PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:25 pm
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
Best to check the ticket prices between Westjet and AC. You will be surprised, there is not allot of difference and it’s common you pay the same for the same flight.

From an employee perspective, we fly more, spend more time away from home, and fly the same aircraft. (737 Max)

Westjet has heavy aircraft, a regional airline and flies internationally.
That just goes to show the validity of my point even further. Just because you’re paying the same, doesn’t mean you’re getting the same product. Westjet competes with Rouge, Sunwing, Transat, etc.

As far as Westjet’s heavy aircraft, how can you compare that to AC mainline or even Rouge for that matter? WS operates 4 767’s. By the time they take delivery of their first 787, AC/Rouge will have over 100 widebodies in operation.
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mbav8r
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#17 Post by mbav8r » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:43 am

PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:25 am
[quote=Flyingsquirrelsuck post_id=<a href="tel:1034703">1034703</a> time=<a href="tel:1521978032">1521978032</a> user_id=58022]
[quote=PostmasterGeneral post_id=<a href="tel:1034702">1034702</a> time=<a href="tel:1521955528">1521955528</a> user_id=22560]
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
Best to check the ticket prices between Westjet and AC. You will be surprised, there is not allot of difference and it’s common you pay the same for the same flight.

From an employee perspective, we fly more, spend more time away from home, and fly the same aircraft. (737 Max)

Westjet has heavy aircraft, a regional airline and flies internationally.
[/quote]

That just goes to show the validity of my point even further. Just because you’re paying the same, doesn’t mean you’re getting the same product. Westjet competes with Rouge, Sunwing, Transat, etc.

As far as Westjet’s heavy aircraft, how can you compare that to AC mainline or even Rouge for that matter? WS operates 4 767’s. By the time they take delivery of their first 787, AC/Rouge will have over 100 widebodies in operation.
[/quote]
Are you a pilot or management?
From a pilots perspective, if you’re doing the same work as another operator that is apples to apples.
Take two trucking companies, each charge 1.00/mile, one has a fleet of brand new trucks and the other old beat up trucks. They are both hauling widgets for the same customer from the same warehouse to the same destination, do the drivers give a rats ass how much profit these companies are making or do you think what they themselves make is what they are concerned with.
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hurtin'albertan
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#18 Post by hurtin'albertan » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:48 am

.
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Last edited by hurtin'albertan on Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

hurtin'albertan
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#19 Post by hurtin'albertan » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:50 am

.
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Last edited by hurtin'albertan on Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

hurtin'albertan
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#20 Post by hurtin'albertan » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:51 am

PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:25 pm
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
The same product? Of course Westjet does. What "product" or "service" do WestJet pilots offer? Safe, professional, efficient transportation between A and B. A whole bunch of those A's and B's (if not all) are the same as Air Canada's A's and B's on their similar (and sometimes bigger) equipment.

If you are talking about the product behind the flight deck door, that's irrelevant to this discussion. WJ pilots do the same job, on the same equipment and offer the same service to their pax as Air Canada guys do. Our safety record is fantastic, our landings are just as smooth, we are just as good (some would argue better: D) looking (uniforms notwithstanding), etc.

Just cause our company decides to have a lower standard of service in the cabin, or even "unbundle" them, does not mean the guys driving the bus should be compensated less. A pilot is a pilot is a pilot.

So when you look at it through the proper lens, yeah, we offer the same product. Everything behind the FD door has no effect on how the guys up front do the job.
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#21 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:50 am

mbav8r wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:43 am
PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:25 am
[quote=Flyingsquirrelsuck post_id=<a href="tel:1034703">1034703</a> time=<a href="tel:1521978032">1521978032</a> user_id=58022]
[quote=PostmasterGeneral post_id=<a href="tel:1034702">1034702</a> time=<a href="tel:1521955528">1521955528</a> user_id=22560]
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
Best to check the ticket prices between Westjet and AC. You will be surprised, there is not allot of difference and it’s common you pay the same for the same flight.

From an employee perspective, we fly more, spend more time away from home, and fly the same aircraft. (737 Max)

Westjet has heavy aircraft, a regional airline and flies internationally.
That just goes to show the validity of my point even further. Just because you’re paying the same, doesn’t mean you’re getting the same product. Westjet competes with Rouge, Sunwing, Transat, etc.

As far as Westjet’s heavy aircraft, how can you compare that to AC mainline or even Rouge for that matter? WS operates 4 767’s. By the time they take delivery of their first 787, AC/Rouge will have over 100 widebodies in operation.
[/quote]
Are you a pilot or management?
From a pilots perspective, if you’re doing the same work as another operator that is apples to apples.
Take two trucking companies, each charge 1.00/mile, one has a fleet of brand new trucks and the other old beat up trucks. They are both hauling widgets for the same customer from the same warehouse to the same destination, do the drivers give a rats ass how much profit these companies are making or do you think what they themselves make is what they are concerned with.
[/quote]

At least you get the argument mbav8r. I argue that Westjet isn’t a true low cost airline. But uses that definition to pay its employees below standard. It uses the “low cost” label to make us believe we can’t afford Min Credit, trip rigs, night pay, nav pay, YOS etc.

It costs the pilots to work at Westjet!
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Flyingsquirrelsuck
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#22 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:54 am

hurtin'albertan wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:51 am
PostmasterGeneral wrote:
Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:25 pm
As an impartial third party observer here, Maybe because WJ does not offer the same product as AC mainline? WJ is a low cost carrier, Swoosh is an Ultra low cost carrier.

Best to compare apples to apples.
The same product? Of course Westjet does. What "product" or "service" do WestJet pilots offer? Safe, professional, efficient transportation between A and B. A whole bunch of those A's and B's (if not all) are the same as Air Canada's A's and B's on their similar (and sometimes bigger) equipment.

If you are talking about the product behind the flight deck door, that's irrelevant to this discussion. WJ pilots do the same job, on the same equipment and offer the same service to their pax as Air Canada guys do. Our safety record is fantastic, our landings are just as smooth, we are just as good (some would argue better: D) looking (uniforms notwithstanding), etc.

Just cause our company decides to have a lower standard of service in the cabin, or even "unbundle" them, does not mean the guys driving the bus should be compensated less. A pilot is a pilot is a pilot.

So when you look at it through the proper lens, yeah, we offer the same product. Everything behind the FD door has no effect on how the guys up front do the job.
Agreeded...great post! Especially better piloting (kidding). We need to maintain a level of respect within the industry and bring the standard up from previous agreements and representation

Our ALPA reps are doing an amazing job working for our group.
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WeedPro2000
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#23 Post by WeedPro2000 » Sun Mar 25, 2018 1:06 pm

Speaking of bargaining, maybe ALPA could bargain and get A P P R O V A L to place their orange stickers on company property.

Just an idea.

Since the appearance of these stickers in my place of work, I've had to adjust my operating procedures so that in the event of an accident or incident, I will immediately call the company and request a hotel room, or as I like to call it, a "safe place", and sequester myself from ALPA.
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#24 Post by WeedPro2000 » Sun Mar 25, 2018 1:43 pm

I forgot to mention my Orange Sticker Club. Members receive a poster sized membership with spaces for ten orange stickers. For every ten stickers redeemed, the member will receive a free copy of the forthcoming German language non-fiction bestseller Ich Habe Mich Geschwüpt (loosely translated in English as I Schwooped Myself) wherein the author the describes how he ate too much BS at the ALPA buffet and forgot the old saying "der Spatz in der Hand ist besser als die Taube auf dem Dach."

88 days.
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Flyingsquirrelsuck
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Re: WJPilotFacts.com

#25 Post by Flyingsquirrelsuck » Sun Mar 25, 2018 1:57 pm

WeedPro2000 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 1:43 pm
I forgot to mention my Orange Sticker Club. Members receive a poster sized membership with spaces for ten orange stickers. For every ten stickers redeemed, the member will receive a free copy of the forthcoming German language non-fiction bestseller Ich Habe Mich Geschwüpt (loosely translated in English as I Schwooped Myself) wherein the author the describes how he ate too much BS at the ALPA buffet and forgot the old saying "der Spatz in der Hand ist besser als die Taube auf dem Dach."

88 days.
Your an inspiration John. A true liability to our pilot group.
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