WJ Scab List

[George Taylor]

Hey Swallow, I'm sure your Ex will love the $400k T4, and it's pretty easy to see why you have one. I can only imagine what she went through.

[Legacy]

I couldn't

[J Roc]

Also, keep in mind, the CIRB has yet to rule on our first ULP. A positive ruling for the union could be a BIG game changer for those OTS hires. A positive ruling for the union will force the company back to the table with regards to swoop.

That's quite the wish sandwhich you just made yourself. I'm curious what you think a negative ruling brings.

John, what can I say – I love sandwiches!

Although some people choose to promote fear and infighting amongst our pilot group, while screaming at orange stickers and smashing clipboards across their knees, I choose a different approach. I choose to be as respectful as possible, to all parties involved, while trusting that my chosen representation has our pilot groups best interest in mind. Cautiously optimistic but none the less hopeful.

I don’t disagree with your assessment regarding the ULC business case though. I delete CK memos like everyone else…errr, I mean read CK's memos - I understand the business case that’s being presented. I believe everyone understands the business case.

Also, WJ can start ANY business venture they so please! I don’t give a fiddlers fart! However, when it affects our livelihoods and bargaining abilities, John? Well come on buddy! We have to act, which is what I trust our MEC has done. Our ULP's were never about keeping WJ pilots out of swoop tails, but I digress.

Truth be told, we have no idea what the final decision will look like, despite all of this banter, but at least our chosen representation isn’t just rolling over. I’m very thankful for our MEC effort and believe they’re working diligently on a solution which protects the careers of WJ pilots and not OTS hires. So, once again, I’ll repeat my advice to the OTS pilots – you better have a backup plan.

Simply glossing over this situation and assuming that our MEC has conceded to the will of WJ is just plain foolish. As foolish as picking a fight with an orange sticker.

Either way, you can't lose, john! ALPA may fail miserably and you’ll have more than enough ammunition for when you raid the union. OR, ALPA will succeed, negotiate a great CBA, secure swoop flying and you can fly your bag off in a pink airplane. Think of all that money you’ll make….for JT. Good for you, John. Good for you…

J RO

[cloak]

I’ll run the risk of divulging corporate info by providing the sketch of what the company is trying to do with WJ. Read this and then tell me where the overlap with the Swoop market space is.

...In essence, I compare what we’re doing to starting a new airline – based on the investment we’re making to go after this significant growth opportunity. To give premium guests what they expect from premium travel (table stakes from their perspective), we are investing in:

•A hub strategy to provide business guests with the #1 thing they value – a strong network with connectivity and schedule frequency / options;

•WestJet-owned and operated guest lounges (domestic, transborder and international lounges) in YYZ, YYC and YVR;

•A world-class B787 Dreamliner interior, including business class with lie-flat seats, and service to match;

•737 Aircraft configuration changes (details to be shared when the time is right);

•Onboard premium food and beverage service;

•A planned transborder joint venture with Delta Airlines to make it possible to profitably serve new transborder business destinations;

•Digital enhancements to provide our guests with innovative and seamless travel experiences; and

•Significant updates to our Rewards program to entice premium guest loyalty...

It sounds like they want to bring the current fleet standard higher to offer amenities usually offered on legacy carriers including service, network and so on, while starting a new airline to serve the lower end of the market, most likely resulting in lots of growth and opportunities in both places, especially on the 787. And how is it being received?

[infiniteregulus]

It sounds like an other company that already does these exact things today...

[J Roc]

Well, it's being received very well actually. Most pilots I speak with agree with the business case and are very excited for our growth opportunities. Im very excited for what our future holds and will ALWAYS be a proud Westjetter.

What ISN'T being received well is our pilot WAWCON being attacked for the sake of another amazing innovation by corporate america.

Regardless, they've shown their hand when they advertised for foreign pilots at $1200 US, contracted WJ maintenance at their current rates and offered signing bonuses to attract talent - this was NEVER about saving a few dollars in pilot wages.

As FC once said (past EVP at WJ) - "pilot costs are a FRACTION of CASM." Yah, I believe that comment may have gotten him " retired effectively immediately."

[LegoMan]

For reference

https://www.cockpitseeker.com/wp-conten ... t-2004.pdf

I'd like to point out the the co-pilot of the Enola Gay B29 is on that list.

[sportingrifle]

I think the term Scab has been lost in translation in this thread. Choosing to work at an upstart airline at the expense of those who work at the parent airline is not being a scab. Shortsighted yes, but for there to be scabs, there has to first be a strike. This may well happen. Scope is the most important thing in a pilots career, far beyond wages, working conditions, or profit sharing. Because without it, eventually there will be no wages, working conditions or profit sharing. There isn't much worth going on strike for but scope is one of them.

The term "scab" originated in middle English and Jack London had this to say about scabs:
"After God finished the rattlesnake, the toad, the vampire, He had some awful substance left with which He made a scab … When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the Devil shuts the gates of Hell to keep him out. No man has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with."

Those words may be a bit strong, but I have noticed that the scabs that were employed at two companies I worked at didn't have impressive careers afterwards. Things had a habit of not working out the way they wanted. They were probably surprised how quickly management forgot their "loyalty", but even after several mergers, their co-workers did not.

And FWIW, they never rode my jumpseat.

[WeedPro2000]

I do know that when ALPA was formed, the constitution prevented non-whites and women from being members, so it wouldn’t surprise me if a “scab list” was maintained.

I’m not a scab (yet), but I do identify as one.

[Flyingsquirrelsuck]

I do know that when ALPA was formed, the constitution prevented non-whites and women from being members, so it wouldn’t surprise me if a “scab list” was maintained.

I’m not a scab (yet), but I do identify as one.

What dose the constitution say now John?

[yyc757]

I do know that when ALPA was formed, the constitution prevented non-whites and women from being members, so it wouldn’t surprise me if a “scab list” was maintained.

I’m not a scab (yet), but I do identify as one.

If you're going to bring up such things then let's start talking about all the statues that need to be brought down. Then according to the same folks that believe such an action is correct we can continue with their logic or thought patterns and so we have to now say you have white privilege and also male privilege as well. Because of this privilege you are not allowed to have an opinion on such subjects!

Now.... answer Bede's question.

[Bede]

I do know that when ALPA was formed, the constitution prevented non-whites and women from being members,...

... complains the guy who plasters his posts with alt-right dog whistles.

[WeedPro2000]

yyc757, I expect you’ll be there picketing on the 8th so you can ask me in person, what you would like to know. But I suspect you’re courage is only on anonymous forums.

I don’t hold anything against you personally. I remember our pairing together and you seemed nice enough.

Same goes for bede, he can grow a set, drop the anonymity thing and ask me in person.

And to answer one of the posters above, you can add my name to that scab list now, with my approval. Unless you have something more than shame in your plans, it’s not going to stop me going to work. If I were you, I’d go the violence route. That might make me stop. ALPA members did that in the Air Nova strike in the late 90’s, use physical violence, so I’m pretty sure it’s still in the ALPA tool box.

[Checklist]

yyc757, I expect you’ll be there picketing on the 8th so you can ask me in person, what you would like to know. But I suspect you’re courage is only on anonymous forums.

I don’t hold anything against you personally. I remember our pairing together and you seemed nice enough.

Same goes for bede, he can grow a set, drop the anonymity thing and ask me in person.

And to answer one of the posters above, you can add my name to that scab list now, with my approval. Unless you have something more than shame in your plans, it’s not going to stop me going to work. If I were you, I’d go the violence route. That might make me stop. ALPA members did that in the Air Nova strike in the late 90’s, use physical violence, so I’m pretty sure it’s still in the ALPA tool box.

I wouldn’t expect an answer, JS’s contract probably prohibits him from answering a question that might give credence to ALPA.

[Checklist]

Aw John calling other people out for being anonymous....

Wasn’t WeedPro2000 at one time not just a confused, concerned, WestJet pilot with bad grammar?

[Jean-Pierre]

Answer Bebe question!

[WeedPro2000]

My contract?

You think I'm doing any of this because someone asked me to? You think that I'm being paid somehow, secretly or overtly, to somehow undermine ALPA?

Dude, no. I'm doing what I think is best purely in my own interest. I'm not thinking of anyone else but myself. I'm spending my own time, and my own money, furthering my own interests. I don't care about anyone else, as regards ALPA and its actions against WJ.

Now, please clarify what chicken bede asked me. I'm finishing off my German novel while I make plans to oppose ALPA's demonstration next week; in other words, I'm busy.

What's the question?

[WeedPro2000]

chicken yyc757, can you ask me the question then? I don't know what chicken bede's question was?

I'll gladly answer it.

John Swallow
2-five-zero two-08 seven-four-6-2

[yyc757]

Here is Bede's question. Now read it carefully. And once you understand it, please answer in English.



Hi John,

I respect your loyalty but I'd like your opinion on the latest info. According to the recent meetings, the company is proposing reserve, 19 days work, no OT until 87.5hrs. This would mean that your days of huge T4's would be all but over. This is the return on loyalty that the company is giving you. It seems like an awfully one sided relationship- you defend them at the cost of your relationship with your colleagues and in return they want to cut your wages. Would you agree that voting NO would only encourage management getting these concessions from us?

[tbaylx]

Here is Bede's question. Now read it carefully. And once you understand it, please answer in English.



Hi John,

I respect your loyalty but I'd like your opinion on the latest info. According to the recent meetings, the company is proposing reserve, 19 days work, no OT until 87.5hrs. This would mean that your days of huge T4's would be all but over. This is the return on loyalty that the company is giving you. It seems like an awfully one sided relationship- you defend them at the cost of your relationship with your colleagues and in return they want to cut your wages. Would you agree that voting NO would only encourage management getting these concessions from us?

And ALPA is proposing swoop flying at mainline wages, and a 30% cost increase to Westjet. Both sides seem to have thrown out a wish list. Guess you'll meet in the middle somewhere like negotiations usually do.