China_CAAC's Merged Threads

[Legacy]

Funny, never received any email from our MEC regarding this whatsoever not is there any talk of it on the ALPA forums. If you are just stirring the pot, again, JS , then you should quit being a d*ck.

[Fanblade]

Confirmed?

How about some substance to your claim.

[RidersRule]

Theres more drama in that post then the high school grad party I chaperoned last night

[BE02 Driver]

Well, it has been a long time coming: the day when I got to say, I told you so, regarding the end of the WPDL (aka One List) in the event that ALPA certified, is almost here.

As I just explained to Rezy, here, the WPDL is dead. We are just awaiting the funeral arrangements to be published.

I spent a fair bit of time and my own money over a year ago trying to show why ALPA could never authroize the WPDL without being the subject of legal action from OTS members. I showed very clearly why ALPA's Constitution and its Executive Board policy, along with Canadian legal precedent with respect to union constitutions all combined to prohibit ALPA from anything other than a DOH seniority list. Indeed, there is an position bid occuring right now that willl use this seniority list to award Swoop and WestJet pilot positions.

I was right. Everyone else (who disputed my findings) was wrong. However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence. No, there are too many losers as a result of what will happen shortly. I do not celebrate their anger, nor their misfortune. There will be huge winners too, those OTS pilots who will now leap frog (some by as much as 350 pilot numbers) ahead of their Encore flow pilot colleagues. If you add the unhappy-former-Encore-already-at-WJ pilots to the soon-to-be-unhappy WJ-soon-to-be-Swoop-pilots-who-will-work-for-less-than-WJ-pay to the unhappy-senior-pilots-who-aren't-geting-seniority-bidding to the unhappy-pilots-who realize-that-it-is-almost-impossible-to-remove-the-MEC-members-from-their-positions to the unhappy-pilots-who-will-be-working-18-days-a-month-versus-the-previous-max-of-16-days, why I think you start to get some unity there.

Ok Jungs, take care. I hope you all found it a worthwhile exercise, this whole ALPA flop. Me I cracked 50 bridge jumps on Friday in Twin Falls, and I think I'm headed back for a few more tomorrow. I have a 28,000 foot skydive planned for next Monday in Tennessee, so I have to work out my travel arrangements. In the meantime, y'all take care.

PS.,

Q. What is the plural of "y'all"?

A. "All y'all"!

In unity!

The MEC's email to Encore specifically addresses the 30 pilot positions displaced at Encore by the decision to give Swoop DOH. So the MEC is either correct, and you are wrong, or the MEC is misinformed or lying which makes you right. Based on your history I'll take option #1 for now.

[Rezy]

When the arbitrator references the “WestJet Pilot Seniority List” - I believe this is meant to be the WPDL as there’s no indication of it being otherwise changed, in name only. The MEC made it clear to Encore Pilots that 30 of them are displaced by Swoop hires. Showing that there is only one list, but if you want to take a few word differences and jump to conclusions I think maybe we could make you a “Jump to Conclusions Matt” #officespace

[Flyingsquirrelsuck]

Well, it has been a long time coming: the day when I got to say, I told you so, regarding the end of the WPDL (aka One List) in the event that ALPA certified, is almost here.

As I just explained to Rezy, here, the WPDL is dead. We are just awaiting the funeral arrangements to be published.

I spent a fair bit of time and my own money over a year ago trying to show why ALPA could never authroize the WPDL without being the subject of legal action from OTS members. I showed very clearly why ALPA's Constitution and its Executive Board policy, along with Canadian legal precedent with respect to union constitutions all combined to prohibit ALPA from anything other than a DOH seniority list. Indeed, there is an position bid occuring right now that willl use this seniority list to award Swoop and WestJet pilot positions.

I was right. Everyone else (who disputed my findings) was wrong. However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence. No, there are too many losers as a result of what will happen shortly. I do not celebrate their anger, nor their misfortune. There will be huge winners too, those OTS pilots who will now leap frog (some by as much as 350 pilot numbers) ahead of their Encore flow pilot colleagues. If you add the unhappy-former-Encore-already-at-WJ pilots to the soon-to-be-unhappy WJ-soon-to-be-Swoop-pilots-who-will-work-for-less-than-WJ-pay to the unhappy-senior-pilots-who-aren't-geting-seniority-bidding to the unhappy-pilots-who realize-that-it-is-almost-impossible-to-remove-the-MEC-members-from-their-positions to the unhappy-pilots-who-will-be-working-18-days-a-month-versus-the-previous-max-of-16-days, why I think you start to get some unity there.

Ok Jungs, take care. I hope you all found it a worthwhile exercise, this whole ALPA flop. Me I cracked 50 bridge jumps on Friday in Twin Falls, and I think I'm headed back for a few more tomorrow. I have a 28,000 foot skydive planned for next Monday in Tennessee, so I have to work out my travel arrangements. In the meantime, y'all take care.

PS.,

Q. What is the plural of "y'all"?

A. "All y'all"!

In unity!

Wow John, you did it!! You won and your the best.

You should have some incredible momentum on the de-certification drive now. When are you going to start sign up’s? Do you have a website? Are you going to be the leader?

I’m thinking once this gets all sorted out, you my want to delete that post.

Just sayin

[BE02 Driver]

Well, it has been a long time coming: the day when I got to say, I told you so, regarding the end of the WPDL (aka One List) in the event that ALPA certified, is almost here.

As I just explained to Rezy, here, the WPDL is dead. We are just awaiting the funeral arrangements to be published.

I spent a fair bit of time and my own money over a year ago trying to show why ALPA could never authroize the WPDL without being the subject of legal action from OTS members. I showed very clearly why ALPA's Constitution and its Executive Board policy, along with Canadian legal precedent with respect to union constitutions all combined to prohibit ALPA from anything other than a DOH seniority list. Indeed, there is an position bid occuring right now that willl use this seniority list to award Swoop and WestJet pilot positions.

I was right. Everyone else (who disputed my findings) was wrong. However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence. No, there are too many losers as a result of what will happen shortly. I do not celebrate their anger, nor their misfortune. There will be huge winners too, those OTS pilots who will now leap frog (some by as much as 350 pilot numbers) ahead of their Encore flow pilot colleagues. If you add the unhappy-former-Encore-already-at-WJ pilots to the soon-to-be-unhappy WJ-soon-to-be-Swoop-pilots-who-will-work-for-less-than-WJ-pay to the unhappy-senior-pilots-who-aren't-geting-seniority-bidding to the unhappy-pilots-who realize-that-it-is-almost-impossible-to-remove-the-MEC-members-from-their-positions to the unhappy-pilots-who-will-be-working-18-days-a-month-versus-the-previous-max-of-16-days, why I think you start to get some unity there.

Ok Jungs, take care. I hope you all found it a worthwhile exercise, this whole ALPA flop. Me I cracked 50 bridge jumps on Friday in Twin Falls, and I think I'm headed back for a few more tomorrow. I have a 28,000 foot skydive planned for next Monday in Tennessee, so I have to work out my travel arrangements. In the meantime, y'all take care.

PS.,

Q. What is the plural of "y'all"?

A. "All y'all"!

In unity!

Wow John, you did it!! You won and your the best.

You should have some incredible momentum on the de-certification drive now. When are you going to start sign up’s? Do you have a website? Are you going to be the leader?

I’m thinking once this gets all sorted out, you my want to delete that post.

Just sayin

I think he should leave it up. It's good for new people to learn about who these people are when they do a little research here.

[Legacy]

Why did we get him and not AC or AT.

[arsenal]

However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence.

What day will it be then?

[tailgunner]

Air Canada has a Psych Eval.

[Legacy]

Lol true

[rudder]

There is nothing illegal in having a provision in the collective agreement that permits a filling of a vacancy by a pilot not in the existing certified bargaining unit.

Air Ontario had a provision in the 1990’s that allowed ANY Air Canada Regional pilot to bid for ANY vacancy at Air Ontario and get full credit for seniority and service for all purposes. In effect - to parachute in using AC Regional DOH. Several pilots did so and there were no legal challenges by Air Ontario pilots.

Air Canada also at one time allowed ACR pilots to fill vacancies at AC with reserved seniority numbers (not ACR DOH).

Having said that, what comes of the WPDL is up to the WJ pilots.

[DropTanks]

.

[KAG]

Weed, (js) you sound manic, time to go back on your meds.

[WeedPro2000]

Oh yeah, I forgot to add to my original post the important fact that seniority, section 22 in the coming CBA, has already been negotiated, for the most part, by ALPA, prior to the start of arbitration. In the ALPA Special Update of May 26, the following excerpt is lifted. Aside from the fact that ALPA managed to get sweet f@ck all done since they arrived on property in May 2017, negotiating only the really simple stuff, seniority (in red) is listed as being finalized except for a few to be determined sections. Ergo, ALPA didn't hold out for a WPDL style list, they willingly agreed to a DOH list and turned their backs to the former and current Encore pilots. Swoop OTS pilots are now ahead of current Encore pilots who eventually flow.

In unity!

Tentatively Agreed

Arbitration
Commuting Policy / Pilot Commuter Travel
Deduction of Dues & Assessments
Flight Safety, Accidents/Incidents
Hotels & Transportation
Management Pilots
Medical Examinations
MISC – Legal
New Equipment
Pilot Recovery Program (LOU)
Preamble
Probation
Relocation Expenses
Training
Travel Privilege and Jumpseat
Discipline/Dismissal

Here is a list of unresolved sections (keep in mind, many of these sections are nearly complete with only a few outstanding issues):


Finalized Language except for a few TBSs (To Be Determined items)

Association Flight Release
Duration
Expenses
Filling of Assignments / Position Bids
General
Grievance
Layoff & Recall
Leaves of Absence
Missing & Internment
Seniority
Sick Leave
Uniforms
Vacation & Statutory Holidays

Sections in Progress

Benefits
Deadhead / Crew Rest
Hours of Service
OCD
Pay & Compensation
Pension
Reduced Block Program
Reserve
Scheduling Rules
Scope
Workplace Injury

[Legacy]

Shut up already

[BE02 Driver]

Having said that, what comes of the WPDL is up to the WJ pilots.

Yes and it is fully intact WJ/Encore/Swoop. In that order actually lol. Currently sits at about 2030 names with current Swoop pilots going all the way to the bottom.

Not true. 30 Encore pilots got cut off at the knees on this one. The last 3 classes all got superceded by Swoop.

[Checklist]

Having said that, what comes of the WPDL is up to the WJ pilots.

Yes and it is fully intact WJ/Encore/Swoop. In that order actually lol. Currently sits at about 2030 names with current Swoop pilots going all the way to the bottom.

Not true. 30 Encore pilots got cut off at the knees on this one. The last 3 classes all got superceded by Swoop.

The 26 captain positions kept by Swoop pilots suggests that ALPA can’t protect the pilots at Westjet; Encore is definitely in trouble.

[schnitzel2k3]

Well, it has been a long time coming: the day when I got to say, I told you so, regarding the end of the WPDL (aka One List) in the event that ALPA certified, is almost here.

As I just explained to Rezy, here, the WPDL is dead. We are just awaiting the funeral arrangements to be published.

I spent a fair bit of time and my own money over a year ago trying to show why ALPA could never authroize the WPDL without being the subject of legal action from OTS members. I showed very clearly why ALPA's Constitution and its Executive Board policy, along with Canadian legal precedent with respect to union constitutions all combined to prohibit ALPA from anything other than a DOH seniority list. Indeed, there is an position bid occuring right now that willl use this seniority list to award Swoop and WestJet pilot positions.

I was right. Everyone else (who disputed my findings) was wrong. However, today is not the day top celebrate my persistence and intelligence. No, there are too many losers as a result of what will happen shortly. I do not celebrate their anger, nor their misfortune. There will be huge winners too, those OTS pilots who will now leap frog (some by as much as 350 pilot numbers) ahead of their Encore flow pilot colleagues. If you add the unhappy-former-Encore-already-at-WJ pilots to the soon-to-be-unhappy WJ-soon-to-be-Swoop-pilots-who-will-work-for-less-than-WJ-pay to the unhappy-senior-pilots-who-aren't-geting-seniority-bidding to the unhappy-pilots-who realize-that-it-is-almost-impossible-to-remove-the-MEC-members-from-their-positions to the unhappy-pilots-who-will-be-working-18-days-a-month-versus-the-previous-max-of-16-days, why I think you start to get some unity there.

Ok Jungs, take care. I hope you all found it a worthwhile exercise, this whole ALPA flop. Me I cracked 50 bridge jumps on Friday in Twin Falls, and I think I'm headed back for a few more tomorrow. I have a 28,000 foot skydive planned for next Monday in Tennessee, so I have to work out my travel arrangements. In the meantime, y'all take care.

PS.,

Q. What is the plural of "y'all"?

A. "All y'all"!

In unity!

Wow John, you did it!! You won and your the best.

You should have some incredible momentum on the de-certification drive now. When are you going to start sign up’s? Do you have a website? Are you going to be the leader?

I’m thinking once this gets all sorted out, you my want to delete that post.

Just sayin

*may*

[DropTanks]

.