March Maui Sched from ALberta

[YWGVOR]

Are there any planned dates/departure times set for Maui yet out of YYC yet? Im going to Maui in March and would like to go WJ.. I don't see anything on the site at all though... The YVR has a nice arrival time in the afternoon vs AC where your whole day is gone travelling...

[whiteguy]

Are there any planned dates/departure times set for Maui yet out of YYC yet? Im going to Maui in March and would like to go WJ.. I don't see anything on the site at all though... The YVR has a nice arrival time in the afternoon vs AC where your whole day is gone travelling...

Take another look. WJ flight leaves at 0730 every Saturday arriving at 1140. Returns at 2200.

You spend more of your day traveling through YVR on WJ than you do on AC. Non stop on AC from YYC leaves at 1430, arrives at 1830 and the WJ from YVR arrives at 2230.

Price comparison, WJ non stop $1671.60 taxes in, AC $1235.86!!! March 6th return the 13th.

[YWGVOR]

Ahhhh OK thanks... didn't realize they were Saturday only... I already have my condo booked from March 12-Apr 3 so I guess its the YVR option.. hopefully it goes on sale.. eveything seems tobe on sale before I want to go!! Last year at this time I had $800 return purchased already... play the waiting game I guess

Actually WJ has a flight that leaves YVR at 9:40AM arriving OGG at 13:50... AC doesnt get you in until 8PM local OGG through YVR and 6:30PM through YYC... I can squeeze a 60km training ride in if I go WJ

[Four1oh]

Price comparison, WJ non stop $1671.60 taxes in, AC $1235.86!!! March 6th return the 13th.

Good to hear. I guess that means WJ is filling the plane if the price is that much higher.

[whiteguy]

Price comparison, WJ non stop $1671.60 taxes in, AC $1235.86!!! March 6th return the 13th.

Good to hear. I guess that means WJ is filling the plane if the price is that much higher.

Filling it to 95 pax.

[stickontheice]

Ahhhh OK thanks... didn't realize they were Saturday only... I already have my condo booked from March 12-Apr 3 so I guess its the YVR option.. hopefully it goes on sale.. eveything seems tobe on sale before I want to go!! Last year at this time I had $800 return purchased already... play the waiting game I guess

Actually WJ has a flight that leaves YVR at 9:40AM arriving OGG at 13:50... AC doesnt get you in until 8PM local OGG through YVR and 6:30PM through YYC... I can squeeze a 60km training ride in if I go WJ

Don't forget to tag on some extra time for the AC passengers to endure a nice big long line up at Customs in Hawaii. US Customs in YC are going to refuse to Pre-Clear because they're understaffed and aren't going to accept a wide-body passenger load through their lines. A nice 6 hour trip and then a couple of hours in a humid customs line up. Sounds like the perfect way to start your vacation to me.

[tonysoprano]

A nice hot meal on board should help.

[turbo-prop]

Not for $1235.86.

[tonysoprano]

Not for $1235.86.

a)That's still cheaper than the narrow body flight, apparantly.
b)I'd be willing to bet nobody will be paying that price as people will be buying packages which will bring that price down considerably.
and c)The hot meal is still there.

[Four1oh]

Not for $1235.86.

a)That's still cheaper than the narrow body flight, apparantly.
b)I'd be willing to bet nobody will be paying that price as people will be buying packages which will bring that price down considerably.
and c)The hot meal is still there.

You and FICU can both hold on to that 'hot meal' theory all you want!

[tonysoprano]

We will. We will. Let's put it this way, at least we're providing a more civilized service. But then again civilized passengers went the way of the dinosaurs a long time ago. We'll just have to see.

[Four1oh]

We will, we will.

[tonysoprano]

Hey Four.
You're right. I have to agree with your sarcasm. I mean why would a customer pay less money and get a hot meal when they can pay more and eat peanuts on a single isle airplane on a five hour flight? Yep, that's the world we live in. Let's not forget these flights will depart from cowboy territory. That's where my team is at a disadvantage from the start. They just love to see a toothless smile as long as it comes from the ranch, right? Anyway, to be "serious and professional" for a brief moment, I think WJ's idea of the empty middle seat is genius, excellent idea. And I mean that. You guys seem to have a way with pleasing your crowd, in a twisted but effective way. Good luck buddy. Are you qualified for ETOPS?

[turbo-prop]

Come on Tony you just trying to be dumb. Obviously the cheaper flights are already sold on Westjet and there is still room on AC. There is no way in hell AC would be selling tickets that cheap and still giving out hot meals, the price for that on AC will be about 2500.

[tonysoprano]

Come on Tony you just trying to be dumb. Obviously the cheaper flights are already sold on Westjet and there is still room on AC. There is no way in hell AC would be selling tickets that cheap and still giving out hot meals, the price for that on AC will be about 2500.

Ah, no. We still serve hot meals on flights over four hours (might be five, not sure) no matter where you're sitting. So, as I said earlier, these flights will be heavily discounted while providing full service. The question for the bean counters is, where is the yield point? I honestly don't believe AC will make much money on these flights. We don't do well on tourist destinations because of the huge discounts on the tickets. Somebody might prove me wrong. Let's see how long the Alberta pineapple express will last. Doesn't concern me. I do schwienhog, schnitzel
and Paulinar beer on the other side of the world.

[DanJ]

So, as I said earlier, these flights will be heavily discounted while providing full service. The question for the bean counters is, where is the yield point? I honestly don't believe AC will make much money on these flights.

My arms length thought is that AC is trying to poke WS in the eye with these flights, and WS is poking back, and both are trying to lose less than the other guy on these routes, with no real expectation of making money on them.

[Realitychex]

So, as I said earlier, these flights will be heavily discounted while providing full service. The question for the bean counters is, where is the yield point? I honestly don't believe AC will make much money on these flights.

My arms length thought is that AC is trying to poke WS in the eye with these flights, and WS is poking back, and both are trying to lose less than the other guy on these routes, with no real expectation of making money on them.

[Jastapilot]

Hey Four.
You're right. I have to agree with your sarcasm. I mean why would a customer pay less money and get a hot meal when they can pay more and eat peanuts on a single isle airplane on a five hour flight? Yep, that's the world we live in. Let's not forget these flights will depart from cowboy territory. That's where my team is at a disadvantage from the start. They just love to see a toothless smile as long as it comes from the ranch, right? Anyway, to be "serious and professional" for a brief moment, I think WJ's idea of the empty middle seat is genius, excellent idea. And I mean that. You guys seem to have a way with pleasing your crowd, in a twisted but effective way. Good luck buddy. Are you qualified for ETOPS?

I think I'll take the high road, this time. Tony, but thanks for the compliment.

[stickontheice]

So Tony not too long ago in the "How Low can you go thread" you told me:

"Stick.
AC has had to slash fares because someone else (wink wink) started it first. There isn't much of a choice. When passengers stop flying, you guys choose to lower your fares. The whole deal with Canadian North is the smaller scale of the WJ/AC competition. Because of your lower costs, you can afford to slash prices a la Walmart. Careful though. If someone who provides a more complete, better service than you goes under because of your price tactics, the boys in Ottawa might wrap your knuckles. But hey, who cares right? Lower prices were the aim of politicians when they deregulated our industry. I personally think there will come a day when we will revisit all this."

Now all of a sudden it's ok for AC to be "heavily discounted while providing full service" from Calgary to Hawaii? What's the difference between this and YZF that you were so opposed to before? Personally I think AC has done WJ a service. You've woken up management to practicality of widebodies. Now there's a reason for them. Kind of reminds me of that scene in the movie Pearl Harbour where the Admiral is being congratulated for the surprise attack and all he can think is how he's awoken a sleeping giant. 10 years from now when were debating the price on YVR to Asia remember your hot meal theory.

Also not sure if I agree on your comments about our advantage just being in the West. Granted those are our roots but we've have been jammed packed on a lot of our flights lately. I have had more than a few 160+ loads on the 800’s. Even had to put a FA in the jump seat the other day out of YQB as that flight was packed.

Personally I just don't think the public is ready to accept that Air Canada has changed. All that BS that Rovinescu is putting out there about changing culture isn’t resonating with Canadians. It’s still the same old airline and no one is fooling anyone. That is why your loads aren’t supporting a higher price and that’s why you’re going to continue to bleed tax payer money.

[tonysoprano]

Stick.

Now all of a sudden it's ok for AC to be "heavily discounted while providing full service" from Calgary to Hawaii? What's the difference between this and YZF that you were so opposed to before? Personally I think AC has done WJ a service. You've woken up management to practicality of widebodies. Now there's a reason for them. Kind of reminds me of that scene in the movie Pearl Harbour where the Admiral is being congratulated for the surprise attack and all he can think is how he's awoken a sleeping giant. 10 years from now when were debating the price on YVR to Asia remember your hot meal theory.

Air Canada's route structure includes many routes that are mainly tourist based. That means that many seats on the flight are purchased in bulk by tour operators at heavily discounted prices. As a result, we lose tons of money. These routes are world wide. It is NOT AC's desire to set such low prices but rather the customer's ability to negotiate cheap fares in that kind of environment. You, on the other hand set the bare minimum price you can afford, knowing full well you could make much more money charging the higher price but in the interest of running everyone else out of business, you accept the lower price. Nothing wrong with that, right? It puts you in a great position. As for YZF, I don't recall getting too involved in that conversation.

Also not sure if I agree on your comments about our advantage just being in the West. Granted those are our roots but we've have been jammed packed on a lot of our flights lately. I have had more than a few 160+ loads on the 800’s. Even had to put a FA in the jump seat the other day out of YQB as that flight was packed.

I apologize, that was the Chianti's fault.

Personally I just don't think the public is ready to accept that Air Canada has changed. All that BS that Rovinescu is putting out there about changing culture isn’t resonating with Canadians. It’s still the same old airline and no one is fooling anyone. That is why your loads aren’t supporting a higher price and that’s why you’re going to continue to bleed tax payer money.

Stick, please. I know load factor doesn't necessarily mean profits but it does mean that people accept to use your service. Our planes are full, most of the time, most of the routes. And like you, we thank them on a daily basis on each flight. You guys really need to stop throwing the "bad service" stone at us because that is the biggest crock of gossip that's out there. It's getting old and outdated. Oh I'm sure you'll be posting some of that gossip every occasion you get just to try and prove me wrong but I won't waste my time. The price is not set by us. The price is set by the customer and the competition. Please make an attempt to get informed before shooting your mouth off. You have no idea. Perhaps it's time question all those things they are feeding you. Maybe then we can have nicer, more cordial conversations on this forum.