AT Pilots Reach TA

Discuss topics relating to airlines.

Moderators: ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore

Message
Author
User avatar
Flying Low
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 914
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:22 pm
Location: Northern Ontario...why change now?

AT Pilots Reach TA

#1 Post by Flying Low » Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:17 am

---------- ADS -----------
  
"The ability to ditch an airplane in the Hudson does not qualify a pilot for a pay raise. The ability to get the pilots, with this ability, to work for 30% or 40% pay cuts qualifies those in management for millions in bonuses."

Spaceshuttle
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:37 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#2 Post by Spaceshuttle » Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:46 pm

---------- ADS -----------
  

DanWEC
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1457
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:05 pm
Location: 404

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#3 Post by DanWEC » Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:48 pm

A union official says the agreement brings pilot wages “into line with their peers,” although no details will be released pending a ratification vote expected to begin next month.
I'm assuming since this statement came from a union official that it means an increase in wages? Honest question.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Jean-Luc Monette
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 87
Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 9:47 am
Location: The Laurentians, QC

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#4 Post by Jean-Luc Monette » Mon Mar 21, 2016 2:32 pm

---------- ADS -----------
  

aerosexual
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 209
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:28 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#5 Post by aerosexual » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:08 am

Great news Jean-Luc!
---------- ADS -----------
  

DropTanks
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 131
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 7:56 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#6 Post by DropTanks » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:18 am

Any word on the pay scales? Improvements? Coles notes?
---------- ADS -----------
  

DutyFree
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2016 9:18 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#7 Post by DutyFree » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:57 am

On that note...there's lots of talk about Sunwing pilots possibly having a strike vote, Anyone?
---------- ADS -----------
  

gonnabeapilot
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:39 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#8 Post by gonnabeapilot » Mon May 02, 2016 7:55 am

DutyFree wrote:On that note...there's lots of talk about Sunwing pilots possibly having a strike vote, Anyone?
Results came back this morning... 94% participation rate, 96% in favour of a strike.
---------- ADS -----------
  

TFTMB heavy
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 268
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 9:58 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#9 Post by TFTMB heavy » Tue May 03, 2016 6:52 am

A strike vote result like that deserves a thread of its own, SW pilots should be all over this.
---------- ADS -----------
  

aerosexual
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 209
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:28 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#10 Post by aerosexual » Tue May 03, 2016 7:10 am

TFTMB heavy wrote:A strike vote result like that deserves a thread of its own, SW pilots should be all over this.
Sunwing pilots are a quiet, peaceful bunch ;)
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
YYZSaabGuy
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 712
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 7:32 am
Location: On glideslope.

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#11 Post by YYZSaabGuy » Tue May 03, 2016 7:12 am

...SW pilots should be all over this.
Sounds like 96% of them already are.
---------- ADS -----------
  

gonnabeapilot
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:39 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#12 Post by gonnabeapilot » Wed May 18, 2016 9:16 am

Sunwing pilots have reached a TA with the company. The union will be doing a roadshow over the next few weeks to present the pilots with the details. Vote and hopefully ratification will occur in early June. The bargaining process and strike vote led to one of the European partners canceling one of the European deployments impacting about 20 pilots although it appears the company is prepared to over staff the North American operation instead of lay-off. The VP of Flight Ops also "resigned" shortly after the strike vote and the canceling of the deployment however the resignation was effective immediately and an interim VP of Flight Ops was in place by that afternoon so take that as you will.... Overall a hard fought battle that will hopefully produce some good results for the pilot group.
---------- ADS -----------
  

rudder
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1605
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:10 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#13 Post by rudder » Wed May 18, 2016 10:15 am

gonnabeapilot wrote:Sunwing pilots have reached a TA with the company. The union will be doing a roadshow over the next few weeks to present the pilots with the details. Vote and hopefully ratification will occur in early June. The bargaining process and strike vote led to one of the European partners canceling one of the European deployments impacting about 20 pilots although it appears the company is prepared to over staff the North American operation instead of lay-off. The VP of Flight Ops also "resigned" shortly after the strike vote and the canceling of the deployment however the resignation was effective immediately and an interim VP of Flight Ops was in place by that afternoon so take that as you will.... Overall a hard fought battle that will hopefully produce some good results for the pilot group.
Resigned? Was that MG?

Is the Shane the new VP Flt Ops?
---------- ADS -----------
  

gonnabeapilot
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:39 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#14 Post by gonnabeapilot » Wed May 18, 2016 12:48 pm

MG "resigned". RH is now back as VP of Flight Ops but only on an interim basis while they look for someone to take the position on a permanent basis.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
CMD-A
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:00 pm
Location: Great White North

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#15 Post by CMD-A » Wed May 18, 2016 12:59 pm

My favorite is "The Shane" !!! ☺
---------- ADS -----------
  

rudder
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1605
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:10 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#16 Post by rudder » Wed May 18, 2016 2:46 pm

I wonder who demanded his resignation? MW? SH? MG has created labour conflict at almost every company where he had to deal with unionized pilots.

RH is a class act.

Congrats on the TA. Amazing what you can accomplish with grown ups in the room.
---------- ADS -----------
  

whatsitdoingnow
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:32 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#17 Post by whatsitdoingnow » Thu May 26, 2016 11:53 am

So any news on the new deal? Have the pay scales been merged?

Does anyone have the latest pay scale/ benefits etc that they can post or PM me?

Cheers
---------- ADS -----------
  

gonnabeapilot
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:39 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#18 Post by gonnabeapilot » Thu May 26, 2016 9:50 pm

Ratification vote under way for the portion of the TA that was agreed to by the union and the company. Results will be known by June 3. A few major outstanding issues, such as scheduling rules, will be headed to binding arbitration at the end of June so the full CBA should be settled by early July.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Jean-Luc Monette
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 87
Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 9:47 am
Location: The Laurentians, QC

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#19 Post by Jean-Luc Monette » Fri May 27, 2016 10:03 am

gonnabeapilot wrote:Ratification vote under way for the portion of the TA that was agreed to by the union and the company. Results will be known by June 3. A few major outstanding issues, such as scheduling rules, will be headed to binding arbitration at the end of June so the full CBA should be settled by early July.

It's the first time I hear about a contract negotiation/vote not being treated as a whole package. Strange.
---------- ADS -----------
  

gonnabeapilot
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:39 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#20 Post by gonnabeapilot » Mon May 30, 2016 3:55 pm

Yes, I'll agree that the ratification process surrounding this CBA is rather strange. From my understanding it was because the company wanted to include the agreed upon pay scale as something that could be considered in arbitration and the union wanted to remove any chance of that happening. I'm happy to say that the TA was approved by 91% of Sunwing pilots in the vote and it now forms the basis of CBA#3. As I mentioned before, several major articles of the CBA, such as scheduling, are now headed to binding arbitration and the arbitrator's decision will be incorporated into the CBA at the end of June. As the TA has now been ratified, I don't mind sharing some of the details:

The CBA is retroactive to December 1, 2015 and is a five year contract that runs until Dec 1, 2019. This means that all pilots will be receiving retroactive pay for their new pay-rates backdated to December 1, 2015. The biggest issue of the pilot group (and the reason for such a huge strike mandate) was that Sunwing Travel Group is now that largest integrated tour operator in North America and is #1 in marketshare for the Canadian southern destination packaged vacation market. After ten years in business, Sunwing is no longer a start-up airline and it was time for the contract language to reflect that.

Happily, in terms of pay that was achieved. The new payscale means that Sunwing now has hourly rate pay parity with Air Transat's narrow-body payscale and due to the difference in minimum annual guarantee, (960 hours/year at Transat vs 1000 hours/year at Sunwing) Sunwing pilots will now have a higher annual salary than our colleagues at Air Transat. Being paid at double the hourly rate when agreeing to work on a GDO was also preserved in the contract. Like the Transat CBA a 1% bonus of the previous year's annual salary will be paid out in both 2016 and 2017 however because of the higher annual salary at Sunwing this bonus works out to be slightly higher in the Sunwing contract.

I don't know what the old payscale was at Transat but I know that the Transat pilot group fought hard for the gains they made in their new contract and I think everyone at Sunwing is thankful for them standing together as a group as it made it easier for us to do the same and deliver a big win for the Sunwing pilot group. The unity of both groups has now moved the Canadian aviation profession forward as a new floor has been set for wages on the charter side with the two biggest players in the market having parity and both groups can now hope to negotiate further gains in the next round of negotiations in 5 years time.

Here's a quick breakdown of the salary gains in the CBA:

F/O: Previous Starting Rate (2014): $53.00 ($53,000/yr)
F/O: Starting Rate at Contract End (2019): $58.08 ($58,080/yr)

F/O: Previous Top End Rate (2014 - scale ends at 7 years of service): $87.84 ($87,840/yr)
F/O: Top End Rate at Contract End (2019 - new scale ends at 11 years of service): $105.21 ($105,210/yr)

Capt: Previous Starting Rate (2014): $90.98 ($90,980/yr)
Capt: Starting Rate at Contract End (2019): $107.76 ($107,760/yr)

*For any F/O that has been with the company for 2 years or longer, they automatically begin at second year Captain's pay when they upgrade. It should be noted that the majority of upgrades at Suwning fall into this category. This is also an improvement on the Transat CBA which requires 3 years of service by an F/O before they can begin at second year Captain's pay.

Capt: Previous 2nd Year Rate (2014): $113.72 ($113,720/yr)
Capt: 2nd Year Rate at Contract End (2019): $124.33 ($124,330/yr)

Capt: Previous Top End Rate (2014 - scale ends at 9 years of service): $156.61 ($156,610/yr)
Capt: Top End Rate at Contract End (2019 - new scale ends at 12 years of service): $202.90 ($202,900/yr)
---------- ADS -----------
  

fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1473
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#21 Post by fish4life » Mon May 30, 2016 7:31 pm

It seems good until you realize for starting FO it's less than 2% / year over the course of the contract... That will probably be a pay cut after inflation.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Ishhhh
Rank 0
Rank 0
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:55 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#22 Post by Ishhhh » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:03 pm

When you factor in

The RRSP match at 140% (5/7),
The jump of 1 or 2 ladder when you jump from widebody to narrow,
The fact that every DQ pilot remain on the widebody scale when flying the narrow body
The different bonus paid if the contract is not respected
The 90 hours block program in the winter
Not to mention all the better non monetary clause

i do not think a sunwing pilot makes more.

My two cents
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
CMD-A
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:00 pm
Location: Great White North

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#23 Post by CMD-A » Tue Jun 14, 2016 3:15 am

Hey guys, this is not a competition between Sunwing pilots and Transat pilots who makes more money. You guys make more and good for you... What it is, is the constant improvement of working conditions at both companies from one contract to another. We are the only 2 comparable operators in Canada so as pilot groups we have to work together and not against each other to steadily improve our conditions instead of letting our companies drive our working conditions down.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Scuba_Steve
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 660
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:10 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#24 Post by Scuba_Steve » Sun Jun 26, 2016 8:35 am

Anytime a pilot group in the industry improves their WACON I say good on them, I hope they make money than me, means we get to use them as a benchmark the next time we negotiate.

So as an Air Transat Pilot, I say nice job Sunwing Pilots!

Cheers
---------- ADS -----------
  

Monorail Conductor
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 10:40 pm

Re: AT Pilots Reach TA

#25 Post by Monorail Conductor » Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:27 am

On an unrelated note, I wanted to give a big ups and many thanks to transat. Especially the csas and flight crews. After getting bumped 4 times on other carriers trying to cross the atlantic in the general direction of canada, AT came through big time and I got to fly recip js for the first time with them. It was the most pleasant standby travel experience i have ever had. The staff were friendly and graciously helpful the whole time getting me listed and checking in with me when the load was finalized and i could get a seat in the cabin.

Youre a class act AT. Happy landings
---------- ADS -----------
  

Post Reply

Return to “General Airline Industry Comments”