Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

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momnosam7
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by momnosam7 »

Boreas wrote: Wed May 02, 2018 12:06 pm Working for up to 14 hours straight starting at midnight is criminal. Period.

That needs to stop. It should have stopped years ago!

Further investigate and consult with industry, by all means. The current regulations - which I would argue are the worst in the world in terms of fatigue - need to change in the meantime. If something even better can be worked out and implemented several years from now, I'll be the first to support it.
Guess that is the point.... are these proposed regs actually better? They may solve the 14 hr problem but that alone comes with a lot of baggage for the pilot especially commuters!!
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Boreas
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by Boreas »

momnosam7 wrote: Wed May 02, 2018 12:26 pmGuess that is the point.... are these proposed regs actually better? They may solve the 14 hr problem but that alone comes with a lot of baggage for the pilot especially commuters!!
Yes, yes they are.
  • Shorter duty periods
  • Duty periods adjusted for circadian phase
  • The introduction of duty limit periods (weekly, monthly, yearly)
  • Reduced maximum flight time
  • Increased rest periods
etc.

Honestly, name another "first-world" country where you can fly for 1200 h/year.
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Diadem
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by Diadem »

If these operators were only saying that the proposed regs could be improved upon, I might believe them; however, they're also arguing that reducing the duty hours or adding restrictions based on what time of day pilots work will increase costs to the point that customers in remote areas won't be able to afford service, and so many pilots will have to be hired that requirements will drop to dangerous levels. They're framing the whole issue as a concern about safety, which is why I don't buy that they think there's a better way: any method that reduces duty time will require an increase in pilots, and they don't want that. I want to see their alternate proposal because I want to see the means by which they intend to improve safety without affecting service, price, or staffing levels. Their entire goal is to keep 14-hour days, with six-day weeks, employing as little staff as they possibly can, and to hell with the consequences.
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FL007
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by FL007 »

Embarrassing.. Canadian north competes against non Canadian companies who will undercut them in charter costs to operate in Canada who don't have to abide by the new Canadian regulations? Ummm.....? :rolleyes:

I really wish there was someone there to just clarify the statements from these companies... And their broad statements.

I didn't ever hear a quantifiable number other than the 26% additional pilots needing to be hired, which in some cases may be 2 more pilots.

The cost that must be passed on to the customer? How much would a 26% increase of pilots cost to a consumer? If a pilot costs 10% of the total cost per flight (very liberal number) then a 26% increase of pilot salaries would be a 2.6% increase per flight, which divided by pax etc wouldn't be much at all.

I understand the cargojet point of view on having a hard time operating at night, but every other company I have no pity for.

These are companies that force 6-10 sectors on 12-14hr days on 705 machines. That's insane. As well not having to abide by labor laws in regards to paid breaks/lunch breaks/max work days (and unpaid) deadheading/overtime/vacation. Third worldly at the best, embarrassing really.
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Inverted2
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by Inverted2 »

How many times did those greedy airline operators say “indiginous” in that video? They are trying to spin it that the natives will starve and suffer when really it’s their bottom line that will suffer after taking advantage of Canadian pilots for too long.
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by PT6onH20 »

Does anyone remember when the Coalition of Canadian Airlines came to be? I still can't believe they were able to organize themselves. I've worked for two companies on part of this "coalition" with entirely different scopes.

I don't understand how the likes of Porter and Georgian can lump themselves with the smaller 703 carriers, when they should be comparing themselves the rest of the Express / Regional pack. That being said, all pilots deserve fair and SAFE rest regulations, whether they're in a Cessna or a Boeing.
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FL007
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by FL007 »

PT6onH20 wrote: Tue May 08, 2018 6:40 am Does anyone remember when the Coalition of Canadian Airlines came to be? I still can't believe they were able to organize themselves. I've worked for two companies on part of this "coalition" with entirely different scopes.
The most ironic part of it all is that most of these airlines are very anti union, yet organize a union to try to defend themselves.

Expect more unionization before these regs go into effect.. Pilots are going to need to ensure their current wawcon doesn't change with these scum airlines if the new rules go ahead
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goingnowherefast
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by goingnowherefast »

It's quickly getting to the point where if the company doesn't have decent wawcon, they won't have any pilots. The new regs may just be the final push. Can't afford to pay pilots decently? Well good luck generating revenue with nobody to fly your planes.
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PT6onH20
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Re: Reps from operators express concern on new duty regs

Post by PT6onH20 »

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