Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

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McKinley
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Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by McKinley »

Thinking ahead, what will become or our industry? In order to be pilot partisan in Canada how does one actually do this?

On one hand liberals, have utterly destroyed our industry and have been a global outlier in their failure to support the sector.
There seemingly is zero re-opening plan for the economy, let alone our sector. I keep on hearing about restrictions, lockdowns etc well out to 2022.

Meanwhile, ( see below) the Conservative party does not like a good option either. They’ve fought for us and politicized the plight of our industry during COVID. Meanwhile, Under the conservatives, the plan below ( from their own platform) would destroy our sector. ( in my opinion) Conservatives namely ( Pierre Pollivere) believe foreign competition this would increase competition and thereby increase completion for workers and thereby increase WAWCON . However, Pierre’s opinion runs cintrart to my lived experience as a pilot in Canada. So the question is... what will happen to our industry?

When I have a look at a global flight tracker I can’t notice that Canada has the fewest birds in the air out of any country/ continent. In Canada, the majority of travel is overflights, in the USA there’s a stark delineation as far as air travel goes- the airspace is packed! and so is India, Europe and Asia ( Yes, I realize Canada isn’t a continent)


Conservative policy on Canada’s airlines:

38. Foreign Ownership Restrictions
The Conservative Party supports relaxing foreign ownership rules on Canadian industry in concert with our major trading partners in the telecommunications, broadcast distribution, and airline industry. We believe the government should conduct an immediate review to determine whether to reduce or completely remove these rules.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/nationalpos ... d1867/amp/


What will happen to us? Who is a safe bet in the next election to ensure the longevity of our careers?

Thoughts ?
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pitottubey
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by pitottubey »

I don't really understand what the conservatives plan is but I definitely get the impression the liberals don't care much in supporting aviation. PS what do WAWCON mean?
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W5
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by W5 »

Wawcon means wages and working conditions.
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montado
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by montado »

Who is the safe bet for aviation careers?

I don’t see any difference between liberals and conservatives who end up in power. They all talk a lot about how they are different however a vote for either is a vote for a libercon or coniberal (yes both of these species sound like nasty bitches... that’s because they are). Lots of fluff, followed by very similar scandals and wasted tax dollars.

I have always been reminded how important it is to vote, and the more I vote the less important it feels. Couldn’t care less what puppet runs our country next election.
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notwhoyouthinkIam
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by notwhoyouthinkIam »

pitottubey wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 8:09 pm I don't really understand what the conservatives plan is
That's because they don't have a plan. They saw that running on fear and hate in the Ontario election got Ford elected. It worked with Trump and Kenney, and it might work again.

I have never voted any party other than Conservative, but unless things change, they won't be getting another vote of mine any time soon.
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alkaseltzer
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by alkaseltzer »

McKinley wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 12:27 pm Thinking ahead, what will become or our industry? In order to be pilot partisan in Canada how does one actually do this?

On one hand liberals, have utterly destroyed our industry and have been a global outlier in their failure to support the sector.
There seemingly is zero re-opening plan for the economy, let alone our sector. I keep on hearing about restrictions, lockdowns etc well out to 2022.

Meanwhile, ( see below) the Conservative party does not like a good option either. They’ve fought for us and politicized the plight of our industry during COVID. Meanwhile, Under the conservatives, the plan below ( from their own platform) would destroy our sector. ( in my opinion) Conservatives namely ( Pierre Pollivere) believe foreign competition this would increase competition and thereby increase completion for workers and thereby increase WAWCON . However, Pierre’s opinion runs cintrart to my lived experience as a pilot in Canada. So the question is... what will happen to our industry?

When I have a look at a global flight tracker I can’t notice that Canada has the fewest birds in the air out of any country/ continent. In Canada, the majority of travel is overflights, in the USA there’s a stark delineation as far as air travel goes- the airspace is packed! and so is India, Europe and Asia ( Yes, I realize Canada isn’t a continent)


Conservative policy on Canada’s airlines:

38. Foreign Ownership Restrictions
The Conservative Party supports relaxing foreign ownership rules on Canadian industry in concert with our major trading partners in the telecommunications, broadcast distribution, and airline industry. We believe the government should conduct an immediate review to determine whether to reduce or completely remove these rules.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/nationalpos ... d1867/amp/


What will happen to us? Who is a safe bet in the next election to ensure the longevity of our careers?

Thoughts ?
The real question is that everything pertaining to national security is being “offloaded” to other countries for this “my garden has no weeds” mentality.

Energy, health, military, you name it, it has all gone through the window.

I don’t have an answer or opinion on your last two questions......
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palebird
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by palebird »

"That's because they don't have a plan. They saw that running on fear and hate in the Ontario election got Ford elected. It worked with Trump and Kenney, and it might work again."

Well where do you get your information? Ford was elected because of the total mayhem inflicted by the previous two premiers. Ditto for Kenney. Rachel and the NDP were/are a disaster. Trump, well look who he ran against. Clinton who would have just carried on where Obama left off. She thought she had it all wrapped up. That election night was classic. Laughed for weeks after. Now Biden has been handed the torch and isn't it just wonderful?
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Mach1
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by Mach1 »

Aga Khan.
SNC-Lavaliin.
Blackface.
WE charity.
Kokanee grope.
C-10.
Admiral Norman.
Mr. Dressup visits India and brings a convicted criminal with him.
Minister's who have lied about their qualifications but are still in their cabinet post.
Head of Armed forces accused in sexual harassment.
Governor General.
No budget for 2 years.
Wilful obstruction of any and all investigations into all these events and more.

Is this really the person you want running your country? Is it? Because if it is, then you deserve any shit he hands out.

Saying, "Ya, but the other guys said (blank) or did (blank) 8 years ago" when they were lead by someone who isn't running and hasn't ruled the party since 2015, isn't having a valid argument about why your support of Trudeau is sensible. It's not... it's an emotional connection to his family name or to a non-existent idea that the Liberals are good for or care about anyone but themselves.

It is past time to give the Liberal Party a time out to go sit in the corner and think about what they have done.

Remember (I know you don't) when they said they were going to run a more transparent and open government? Well, they are actually worse than the Conservatives ever were. I'm not anti-liberal, but I sure as hell can not, in any good conscience, support the current leadership... and by that I mean everyone associated with the PMO, as in the entire cabinet. These people have supported scandal after scandal. And while people here looked on with confusion at how the American's could possibly elect and support Trump, We (people of Ontario) are doing the exact same thing with Trudeau. A dishonest, law breaking, dictator admiring, self-proclaimed king with delusions of grandeur.

It is time for someone new. New can be scary but anything, and I mean anything, would be better than what we have now. How could anyone possibly be worse? And you know what... whoever we elect to get rid of Trudeau, we can replace in 5 years time when the next election happens.
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alkaseltzer
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by alkaseltzer »

Mach1 wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 3:01 pm Aga Khan.
SNC-Lavaliin.
Blackface.
WE charity.
Kokanee grope.
C-10.
Admiral Norman.
Mr. Dressup visits India and brings a convicted criminal with him.
Minister's who have lied about their qualifications but are still in their cabinet post.
Head of Armed forces accused in sexual harassment.
Governor General.
No budget for 2 years.
Wilful obstruction of any and all investigations into all these events and more.

Is this really the person you want running your country? Is it? Because if it is, then you deserve any shit he hands out.

Saying, "Ya, but the other guys said (blank) or did (blank) 8 years ago" when they were lead by someone who isn't running and hasn't ruled the party since 2015, isn't having a valid argument about why your support of Trudeau is sensible. It's not... it's an emotional connection to his family name or to a non-existent idea that the Liberals are good for or care about anyone but themselves.

It is past time to give the Liberal Party a time out to go sit in the corner and think about what they have done.

Remember (I know you don't) when they said they were going to run a more transparent and open government? Well, they are actually worse than the Conservatives ever were. I'm not anti-liberal, but I sure as hell can not, in any good conscience, support the current leadership... and by that I mean everyone associated with the PMO, as in the entire cabinet. These people have supported scandal after scandal. And while people here looked on with confusion at how the American's could possibly elect and support Trump, We (people of Ontario) are doing the exact same thing with Trudeau. A dishonest, law breaking, dictator admiring, self-proclaimed king with delusions of grandeur.

It is time for someone new. New can be scary but anything, and I mean anything, would be better than what we have now. How could anyone possibly be worse? And you know what... whoever we elect to get rid of Trudeau, we can replace in 5 years time when the next election happens.
AMEN!
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jayme
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by jayme »

Why do you clowns expect a political party to fix it for you? Either coronavirus gets under control or it doesn’t.
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Mach1
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by Mach1 »

jayme wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 12:22 am Why do you clowns expect a political party to fix it for you? Either coronavirus gets under control or it doesn’t.
It is your belief that competent government policy has no effect on recovery?

You should tell that to Korea, Australia and New Zealand.... to name a few. I'd say there are a lot of reasons why we are way behind the curve on reopening our economy compared even to our closest neighbour. Considering what a shit job they did, what does that say about our government?
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‘Bob’
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by ‘Bob’ »

Mach1 wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 10:42 am [quote=jayme post_id=<a href="tel:1154875">1154875</a> time=<a href="tel:1622100126">1622100126</a> user_id=70617]
Why do you clowns expect a political party to fix it for you? Either coronavirus gets under control or it doesn’t.
It is your belief that competent government policy has no effect on recovery?

You should tell that to Korea, Australia and New Zealand.... to name a few. I'd say there are a lot of reasons why we are way behind the curve on reopening our economy compared even to our closest neighbour. Considering what a shit job they did, what does that say about our government?
I’d credit geography and/or actions that you would have been the very first to protest over a specific type of government. Two of those nations have no land borders and one of them has a DMZ with a well fortified and monitored perimeter between the only nation it shares a border with.

Junior could have invoked the War Measures Act like senior did.. everything closed, borders shut down entirely (CATSA
detaining anyone who entered the country and NAV CANADA refusing to file flight plans, give clearances, etc to or from any place outside of Canada), troops in the streets enforcing curfew and quarantine......... and we could have ripped off the bandaid in one fell swoop.

But with our economy entirely interdependent on the US it would have had far more immediate and drastic effects on our economy. The government would have likely fallen and then the Conservatives would have “turned it around” and done the same thing as Junior actually did. Pay lip service to try and appease as many Canadians as possible. Restrictions for the hypochondriacs. Enough things open for those who realize this is just a flu. And 14 months later still dealing with it and enacting reactionary policies. Just like Conservative Ontario or the UK.
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‘Bob’
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by ‘Bob’ »

Another thing that a lot of people don’t realize.

FR24 or FlightAware doesn’t really paint a good picture of aviation in Canada. It’s very easy to use as a case for how poorly Canadian aviation is doing but it’s misleading.

Canada has just under 40 million people in almost 20 million square km. The majority of them are within 500 km of the US border.

It’s unfair to compare it to the USA with 300 million more people. Or Europe with almost 750 million people. Or China alone with over a billion or India with over a billion and experiencing an actual crippling health crisis.

Most of Canada doesn’t have PSR or SSR radar coverage. You’re only seeing the overflights because of ADS-B equipped aircraft.

Lots of Canadian flights also go through US airspace.

2010. No pandemic. Doesn’t look much different.

https://youtu.be/G1L4GUA8arY

Canadian aviation has suffered, and is suffering more than lots of other countries, but not to the degree everyone thinks.
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CPT.HarshColdReality
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by CPT.HarshColdReality »

‘Bob’ wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 11:34 am
Mach1 wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 10:42 am [quote=jayme post_id=<a href="tel:1154875">1154875</a> time=<a href="tel:1622100126">1622100126</a> user_id=70617]
Why do you clowns expect a political party to fix it for you? Either coronavirus gets under control or it doesn’t.
It is your belief that competent government policy has no effect on recovery?

You should tell that to Korea, Australia and New Zealand.... to name a few. I'd say there are a lot of reasons why we are way behind the curve on reopening our economy compared even to our closest neighbour. Considering what a shit job they did, what does that say about our government?
I’d credit geography and/or actions that you would have been the very first to protest over a specific type of government. Two of those nations have no land borders and one of them has a DMZ with a well fortified and monitored perimeter between the only nation it shares a border with.

N. Korea also shares a border with China...
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Mach1
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by Mach1 »

‘Bob’ wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 11:34 am 1. I’d credit geography and/or 2. actions that you would have been the very first to protest over a specific type of government. Two of those nations have no land borders and one of them has a DMZ with a well fortified and monitored perimeter between the only nation it shares a border with.

3. Junior could have invoked the War Measures Act like senior did.. everything closed, borders shut down entirely (CATSA
detaining anyone who entered the country and NAV CANADA refusing to file flight plans, give clearances, etc to or from any place outside of Canada), troops in the streets enforcing curfew and quarantine......... and we could have ripped off the bandaid in one fell swoop.

4. But with our economy entirely interdependent on the US it would have had far more immediate and drastic effects on our economy. 5. The government would have likely fallen and 6. then the Conservatives would have “turned it around” and done the same thing as Junior actually did. Pay lip service to try and appease as many Canadians as possible. Restrictions for the hypochondriacs. Enough things open for those who realize this is just a flu. And 14 months later still dealing with it and enacting reactionary policies. Just like Conservative Ontario or the UK.
1. Really? Geography perhaps for the two island nations I mentioned but that fails to explain how Israel did such a good job of getting their populace vaccinated (as another example).

2. How, exactly, do you know what I would and would not protest?

3. I am not sure that you need to use the war measures act but acting sooner and more decisively would have been a help. More consistency and sense about the rules would have helped. Using the disaster plans that already existed and enacting them with haste.

4. How?

5. How? Would Jagmeet suddenly have grown a spine and stopped being JT's chief lapdog?

6. Maybe, maybe not. We'll never know so there's no point in playing the "what if" game. What is fact and not conjecture is that the Liberals; specifically an incompetent, scandal ridden, dishonest PM, was in charge and did drop the ball; before and during the pandemic. To deny that is to live in a fantasy world.

Perhaps you could stop being a JT apologist and try to look at things from a less emotional vantage point to see the current leadership for what it really is rather than what you wish it was.
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by DBC »

Mach1 wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 3:48 pm
‘Bob’ wrote: Thu May 27, 2021 11:34 am 1. I’d credit geography and/or 2. actions that you would have been the very first to protest over a specific type of government. Two of those nations have no land borders and one of them has a DMZ with a well fortified and monitored perimeter between the only nation it shares a border with.

3. Junior could have invoked the War Measures Act like senior did.. everything closed, borders shut down entirely (CATSA
detaining anyone who entered the country and NAV CANADA refusing to file flight plans, give clearances, etc to or from any place outside of Canada), troops in the streets enforcing curfew and quarantine......... and we could have ripped off the bandaid in one fell swoop.

4. But with our economy entirely interdependent on the US it would have had far more immediate and drastic effects on our economy. 5. The government would have likely fallen and 6. then the Conservatives would have “turned it around” and done the same thing as Junior actually did. Pay lip service to try and appease as many Canadians as possible. Restrictions for the hypochondriacs. Enough things open for those who realize this is just a flu. And 14 months later still dealing with it and enacting reactionary policies. Just like Conservative Ontario or the UK.
1. Really? Geography perhaps for the two island nations I mentioned but that fails to explain how Israel did such a good job of getting their populace vaccinated (as another example).
Israel is a bad example when comparing vaccine procurement. They made a deal with Pfizer to essentially be a mass test case and granted Pfizer access to Israeli health data in return for early and sufficient vaccines.

https://www.meida.org.il/wp-content/upl ... Pfizer.pdf

I'm not saying Canada didn't mess things up, but it's a bad comparison.
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by EPR »

Mach1 wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 3:01 pm Aga Khan.
SNC-Lavaliin.
Blackface.
WE charity.
Kokanee grope.
C-10.
Admiral Norman.
Mr. Dressup visits India and brings a convicted criminal with him.
Minister's who have lied about their qualifications but are still in their cabinet post.
Head of Armed forces accused in sexual harassment.
Governor General.
No budget for 2 years.
Wilful obstruction of any and all investigations into all these events and more.

Is this really the person you want running your country? Is it? Because if it is, then you deserve any shit he hands out.

Saying, "Ya, but the other guys said (blank) or did (blank) 8 years ago" when they were lead by someone who isn't running and hasn't ruled the party since 2015, isn't having a valid argument about why your support of Trudeau is sensible. It's not... it's an emotional connection to his family name or to a non-existent idea that the Liberals are good for or care about anyone but themselves.

It is past time to give the Liberal Party a time out to go sit in the corner and think about what they have done.

Remember (I know you don't) when they said they were going to run a more transparent and open government? Well, they are actually worse than the Conservatives ever were. I'm not anti-liberal, but I sure as hell can not, in any good conscience, support the current leadership... and by that I mean everyone associated with the PMO, as in the entire cabinet. These people have supported scandal after scandal. And while people here looked on with confusion at how the American's could possibly elect and support Trump, We (people of Ontario) are doing the exact same thing with Trudeau. A dishonest, law breaking, dictator admiring, self-proclaimed king with delusions of grandeur.

It is time for someone new. New can be scary but anything, and I mean anything, would be better than what we have now. How could anyone possibly be worse? And you know what... whoever we elect to get rid of Trudeau, we can replace in 5 years time when the next election happens.
Very eloquently stated and on point!
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doiwannabeapilot
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by doiwannabeapilot »

Can you please copy and paste this on the Facebook group:
Aviation workers made redundant in Canada by the COVID-19 crisis

and on every single page on the Internet !
TIA

Also, I can't find the reference, but an advocacy group just got about 8,000 documents out of 100,000 requested regarding Liberal spending/contracts during the pandemic. Grab a barf bag or a bucket or two, you'll need them when you hear the details of the amounts and reasoning why they were awarded and to who.

Next:
Infectious-disease scientists at Canada’s high-security lab collaborated with China
In question period, Freeland or someone was asked about the above collaboration. The question was completely ignored; and the minister went on for 5 minutes thanking and praising the great work of the lab; the beautiful landscaping, the incredible food in the cafeteria; how clean the washrooms are, what a beautiful facility. Oh, did she even reference or deny China and or Chinese military and or the 2 scientists relationship or background. Nah. It was the most f-upped response I've ever heard.
I guess Canadians have no right to know. The government isn't here to serve us. and espionage isn't real. Especially not by such a wholesome country such as China.

most transparent government ever. Wasn't that a campaign promise by mr. selfie ?
Most evil, vile, corrupt Canadian government ever. But, then again, look at who he admires.



Mach1 wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 3:01 pm Aga Khan.
SNC-Lavaliin.
Blackface.
WE charity.
Kokanee grope.
C-10.
Admiral Norman.
Mr. Dressup visits India and brings a convicted criminal with him.
Minister's who have lied about their qualifications but are still in their cabinet post.
Head of Armed forces accused in sexual harassment.
Governor General.
No budget for 2 years.
Wilful obstruction of any and all investigations into all these events and more.

Is this really the person you want running your country? Is it? Because if it is, then you deserve any shit he hands out.

Saying, "Ya, but the other guys said (blank) or did (blank) 8 years ago" when they were lead by someone who isn't running and hasn't ruled the party since 2015, isn't having a valid argument about why your support of Trudeau is sensible. It's not... it's an emotional connection to his family name or to a non-existent idea that the Liberals are good for or care about anyone but themselves.

It is past time to give the Liberal Party a time out to go sit in the corner and think about what they have done.

Remember (I know you don't) when they said they were going to run a more transparent and open government? Well, they are actually worse than the Conservatives ever were. I'm not anti-liberal, but I sure as hell can not, in any good conscience, support the current leadership... and by that I mean everyone associated with the PMO, as in the entire cabinet. These people have supported scandal after scandal. And while people here looked on with confusion at how the American's could possibly elect and support Trump, We (people of Ontario) are doing the exact same thing with Trudeau. A dishonest, law breaking, dictator admiring, self-proclaimed king with delusions of grandeur.

It is time for someone new. New can be scary but anything, and I mean anything, would be better than what we have now. How could anyone possibly be worse? And you know what... whoever we elect to get rid of Trudeau, we can replace in 5 years time when the next election happens.
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Re: Being “ pilot partisan” in Canada? Who will ensure the longevity / recovery of our sector?

Post by Mach1 »

Feel free to share.
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