Harmony Pulls Pin on Sked Flying

ScudRunner · Post by **ScudRunner** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:16 am

C3 didnt see it coming?

I was a mear ramp rat at YVR and saw that coming a mile away.

YVR Dude · Post by **YVR Dude** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 2:21 pm

This will be my second airline and third company to fail in aviation...sometimes I wonder if it is at all worth it!

Once again dusting off the resume, and sending out the cover letters, and letters of interest.
The only good thing this time around vs Canada 3000 is that we have some notice, and the industry is doing waaay better than it was after 11 sep 01.

But I have to tell you all...this bites! Big time! I'm tired of working my way up seniority lists just to be slammed back down to the bottom of another list

...Making friends and then losing them...Having a great lifestyle, then losing that!
The best thing? As always, its the people..we had a solid bunch of really good guys and gals to work with and wouldn't give that up for nothing..as I quote a saying.." Life is not about the Destination… it is all about the JOURNEY" I have to say this...What a journey it has been! It has been an honour to work with the people that I have and I wish them all the luck and good will as they move out around the industry looking for the good life, they certainly deserve it!

Garth Brooks wrote in one of his songs.."I could have missed the pain, but I would have missed the dance!"

Two very good quotes that seem to have just a little bit more meaning than before...Just remember to hold your head high, dance like nobody is watching, and sing like no one can hear you! We gave it our best and if not for some senior decisions, might still be here today..

I bid you adieu and hopefully soon, back in the friendly skies!

Cheers everyone!

YVR Dude

flyin' fish · Post by **flyin' fish** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:00 pm

YVR dude, take that 757 PPC and head overseas. When CJ shut down, it was the kick in the ass I need to start pursuing something better.
Trust me, this is a blessing in disguise when you really see what's out there.

Good Luck!

neophyte · Post by **neophyte** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:39 am

Surely WJ, AC and Jazz would love to snap up some experience Harmony drivers. I am almost certain that CJ drivers got "front of the line" treatment at Jazz when it all but dissolved.

Regardless, good luck to all effected company wide.

Neo

WJ700 · Post by **WJ700** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 11:23 am

YVR Dude wrote:This will be my second airline and third company to fail in aviation...sometimes I wonder if it is at all worth it! Once again dusting off the resume, and sending out the cover letters, and letters of interest.
The only good thing this time around vs Canada 3000 is that we have some notice, and the industry is doing waaay better than it was after 11 sep 01.

But I have to tell you all...this bites! Big time! I'm tired of working my way up seniority lists just to be slammed back down to the bottom of another list ...Making friends and then losing them...Having a great lifestyle, then losing that!
The best thing? As always, its the people..we had a solid bunch of really good guys and gals to work with and wouldn't give that up for nothing..as I quote a saying.." Life is not about the Destination… it is all about the JOURNEY" I have to say this...What a journey it has been! It has been an honour to work with the people that I have and I wish them all the luck and good will as they move out around the industry looking for the good life, they certainly deserve it!

Garth Brooks wrote in one of his songs.."I could have missed the pain, but I would have missed the dance!"

Two very good quotes that seem to have just a little bit more meaning than before...Just remember to hold your head high, dance like nobody is watching, and sing like no one can hear you! We gave it our best and if not for some senior decisions, might still be here today..

I bid you adieu and hopefully soon, back in the friendly skies!

Cheers everyone!

YVR Dude

It sucks, I've been there too. However, WestJet has a package available, specific for Harmony pilots... just like they had for interested Canjet pilots. You can live in YVR, gain a lot of seniority in the next few years; and make more $ in the end.

RB211 · Post by **RB211** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:18 pm

WJ700 wrote: It sucks, I've been there too. However, WestJet has a package available, specific for Harmony pilots... just like they had for interested Canjet pilots. You can live in YVR, gain a lot of seniority in the next few years; and make more $ in the end.

That's interesting to hear because the comment to one of our pilots from the WJ pilot hiring rep that was at HQ the other day was "...we have 1600 pilot applications on file which means you are number 1601." No specific package for HQ pilots just a trip out to YVR to give a slap in the face. I guess that is Westjetitude, is it?

On the other hand, AC and ACPA have both said they recognize the experience/skill level of the Harmony pilots and will process their applications in priority. So, if any HQ pilots are looking for AC/WJ, AC is looking to help.

Four1oh · Post by **Four1oh** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:58 pm

if anyone has the info on hiring, it's probably wj700. Maybe it is true...

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 3:26 pm

Hopefully WJ and CJ can open some doors. What about Sunwing?

Flightlevels · Post by **Flightlevels** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:11 pm

RB211 wrote:
WJ700 wrote: It sucks, I've been there too. However, WestJet has a package available, specific for Harmony pilots... just like they had for interested Canjet pilots. You can live in YVR, gain a lot of seniority in the next few years; and make more $ in the end.
That's interesting to hear because the comment to one of our pilots from the WJ pilot hiring rep that was at HQ the other day was "...we have 1600 pilot applications on file which means you are number 1601." No specific package for HQ pilots just a trip out to YVR to give a slap in the face. I guess that is Westjetitude, is it?

On the other hand, AC and ACPA have both said they recognize the experience/skill level of the Harmony pilots and will process their applications in priority. So, if any HQ pilots are looking for AC/WJ, AC is looking to help.

WJ is having a hiring fair as we speak for all employees of Harmony. The HR dept went out yesterday. The pilot hiring guy here sent a package over to them as well. How's that for westjettitude. Did the other guys set up a hiring fair yet? you seem to be well informed. Not. I just spoke with DP in hiring and nobody spoke to him from Harmony....he should know if anyone. I think your misinformed RB, give him a call yourself and find out the facts.Open door here.

YVRflyer · Post by **YVRflyer** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:04 pm

The WestJet Job fair for Harmony employees was in Vancouver at Harmony Flight Operations office last Wednesday (4. April) and Thursday (5. April). There will be another 3 hour session on Thursday (12. April).

3 Westjet recruiters from the Westjet People department were there. The recruiters seemed to be very keen to speak to the Flight Attendands.

I attended the job fair and I can confirm there is no special package for Harmony pilots. Interested pilots got a 3 page hand-out (I guess the same Canjet pilots got, as there was still a Canjet reference in the hand-out) describing how to apply at workopolis, the selection process including how the matrix score is calculated and the interview process. Given, that a higher flight experience gives you a better matrix score, one can assume that this might give you a faster interview.

Gina C. from Westjet's people department who is involved in the pilot hiring process informed us that all ground schools until the end of June are filled and 1600 potential pilot applicants are on file. She also said, even though it is unfortunate that we are unemployed, preference can't be given as this wouldn't be fair to all the other applicants who are applying for a while and eventhough they might have less experience. There are several Harmony pilots who are seriously interested in working for Westjet, including me, so it was depressing to hear that it could take a long time before invited for an interview.

DP was not at the job fair, however he is referenced on the hand-out with a generic email address and phone number. Some of us have tried to contact him without success.

These are the facts. Please keep this topic objective, as some Harmony pilots want to work for WestJet and it surely doesn't help when people start bashing each other on this topic.

It is also true that the Air Canada Captain in charge of pilot hiring informed Harmony's DFO that pilots interested in working for AC will be fast tracked and processed for an interview within 3 weeks and provided his personal fax# for sending the resume.

TonySoprano - Sunwing Airlines hired already and invited a bunch of our pilots for interviews in the coming weeks.

A lot of us are in our late 30's and 40's with families, mortgages and are not financially in a position to be unemployed for a prolonged period of time.

RB211 · Post by **RB211** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:29 pm

Flightlevels wrote: WJ is having a hiring fair as we speak for all employees of Harmony. The HR dept went out yesterday. The pilot hiring guy here sent a package over to them as well. How's that for westjettitude. Did the other guys set up a hiring fair yet? you seem to be well informed. Not. I just spoke with DP in hiring and nobody spoke to him from Harmony....he should know if anyone. I think your misinformed RB, give him a call yourself and find out the facts.Open door here.

I am more informed than you appear to be. I was there and you were not. I know what the Harmony pilots were told and it wasn't an open door. It was definitively a message that there is no preference given to Harmony pilots. So the question is, why bother coming to YVR?

I don't have a problem with WJ not wanting to accelerate the process. I just don't think it was necessary to raise hopes by having a so called 'job fair'.

AC has offered to fast track the process for any interested Harmony pilots and Parc is in YVR on Wednesday. I'll take those real offers over your 'Westjetitude' any day.

Ryan Coke2 · Post by **Ryan Coke2** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:58 am

So because they are telling you that you will be treated equally with other applicants, that causes you to have a resentful attitude? (If I read you right).

Do you feel you are owed special treatement?

I totally feel for what everyone at Harmony must be going through, but you attitude seems out of line. Enjoy the opportunity with Parc, I'm sure it will be better than having to deal with our 'Wesjetitude'---for all of us.

Hopefully I'll get to work with some of the other Harmony folks that may end up here, without the resentment.

But still, I wish you the best in this trying time.

Rebel · Post by **Rebel** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:01 am

Hmm I can only speak about my experiences with AC but fast tracking highly qualified candidates is nothing new and it's a pretty cheap way to buy knowledge.. The length of time that equally qualified candidates have his/her application only indicates a real desire to work for that company. But that’s all it indicates, it may or may not tip the balance.

Bon Chance to the Harmony boys and girls, there are well paying jobs out there for folks with the right qualifications but unfortunately most are off-shore..

p.s. There was/is an accountant in YYC that specializes in the inns and out's of pilot’s working off-shore with Parc. In the last low cyclic period a few AC pilots took leave of absences to work for ANA and were highly satisfied with his work and knowledge. Sorry I can’t recall his name.

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:29 am

Well, we're even bickering at a time when we should be helping. With so much hiring going on in Canada, I think the Harmony people stand a good chance but it seems they are probably better off overseas. Good luck guys, hope to see you at AC.

RB211 · Post by **RB211** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:27 am

Ryan Coke2 wrote:So because they are telling you that you will be treated equally with other applicants, that causes you to have a resentful attitude? (If I read you right).

Do you feel you are owed special treatement?

I totally feel for what everyone at Harmony must be going through, but you attitude seems out of line. Enjoy the opportunity with Parc, I'm sure it will be better than having to deal with our 'Wesjetitude'---for all of us.

Hopefully I'll get to work with some of the other Harmony folks that may end up here, without the resentment.

But still, I wish you the best in this trying time.

You don't read me right. I don't expect anything and I am not resentful.

I certainly don't feel Harmony pilots are owed special treatment but WJ set that expectation. Especially on day one of the fair when some pilots were told that their applications would be given priority. Then on day 2, when Gina arrives, pilots are essentially told, your experience/background will not make any difference to your application, you are at the bottom of the list. The false hope was quite disappointing to those that are interested in WJ.

Let me ask you, do you think all 1600 applications on file at WJ are equal? Does WJ interview/hire strictly based on the date of ones application or do they consider qualification/experience?

Having said all that, maybe there has been some mis-communication/mis-understanding and WJ does see value in the Harmony pilots'.

I can say without a doubt, if you do get to work with any of these pilots you will indeed find them to be of the highest standard both personally and professionally. I hope to have the pleasure of crossing paths with any/all of them in the future.

mbav8r · Post by **mbav8r** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:46 am

Hey Harmony guys, I've been laid off a couple times and really feel for you. AC is very open about the hiring process, points for this and that which we all know is how you get the interview.
My thoughts on WJ's standpoint is perhaps they don't want to damage the existing resume pool by openly stating they're giving preferrence to any candidates, but the fact that they had a job fair for you should be the writing on the wall. WJ hires on type of experience as well, so I myself wouldn't be surprised if most of the new hires did come from Harmony, they just don't want to openly state that.
Realistically, If I were the one doing the hiring, I'd give preferrence to those with your experience and I don't hold any ill will towards any Harmony guys/gals who get fast tracked. It's the nature of the game.

Ryan Coke2 · Post by **Ryan Coke2** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:47 am

Fair enough.

As far as the applications being treated equally, of course they are not all equal. They are weighted based on experience etc, but not based on working for a specific company. So a Harmony pilot should go to the top of the interview pile if their experience/quallifactions are the best, not solely because they worked for Harmony.

Anyway, I certainly apologize on behalf of all of us if there was a miscommunication, and a false hope was represented (Not that I have anything to do with pilot hiring).

Again, good luck. I can appreciate the stress this trying time place on all those affected.

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:14 am

You would think that anyone who is checked out on type and current would be given preference. That's the part I don't understand. It's almost like they are being put through some needless pain. I know how frustrating that can be having gone through it myself. Any airline that operates 737s in Canada should be rolling out the red carpet for these guys. WJ doesn't want to openly state that? What's the problem?

RB211 · Post by **RB211** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:18 am

Ryan Coke2 wrote:Fair enough.

As far as the applications being treated equally, of course they are not all equal. They are weighted based on experience etc, but not based on working for a specific company. So a Harmony pilot should go to the top of the interview pile if their experience/quallifactions are the best, not solely because they worked for Harmony.

Anyway, I certainly apologize on behalf of all of us if there was a miscommunication, and a false hope was represented (Not that I have anything to do with pilot hiring).

Again, good luck. I can appreciate the stress this trying time place on all those affected.

Thanks.

I guess when I speak of the Harmony pilots getting due consideration it was for their experience not becasue they have been, particularily, Harmony pilots. In my own mind I combined the 2 as one because much of that experience was gained at HQ.

Funny how I never seem to learn that others can't read my mind!

Ryan Coke2 · Post by **Ryan Coke2** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:51 am

Best of luck RB211, I hope things sort themselves out quickly.

Tony, it sounds like you think that Harmony flew 737's. They didn't-they flew 757's.