RAIC Pass

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sherryfly
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RAIC Pass

Post by sherryfly » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 pm

Hello,

I am a student and will be attending college in September to become a pilot. Recently, my vehicle was flagged and my information was collected by the police. The reason for this was because someone who had the same make and model of my vehicle had committed a crime. After police reviewed camera footage and did further investigation, they found that I was not the perpetrator and just happened to be in the wrong place, with the wrong type of vehicle. I am concerned that this incident may lead to issues with getting my RAIC pass in the future, as I will need it to work as a pilot. If anybody has any experience with situations like this and can provide me with any advice I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Cessna 180 » Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:54 am

unlikely
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Daniel Cooper
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Daniel Cooper » Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:05 am

Something is very wrong if people are this scared.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by confusedalot » Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:37 pm

First off, I do not think you will have a problem.

BUT, and I say again BUT, this transport Canada group who are in charge are batshit crazy. Worse still, by design, they know they are above the law. Even the federal court of Canada has no authority over them, as witnessed by hundreds of challenges that were turned away, all the while indicating that they cannot replace their decisions.

There are hundreds of crazy decisions that came to light. So as one example, a young girl was "seen" with a person who was "suspected" of dealing of something or another. She had zero clue of what they were talking about. Transport Canada actually said that since she did not have any questionable bank deposits, she was obviously being paid in drugs. If you can figure out that logic, you are a smarter person than me.

Lost my pass because I sent 4 emails, coarse ones I admit, to bullies and to corrupt people. (What can I say, I have a lower than normal tolerance to these kind of people). Nothing criminal mind you, and was never even approached about it. Still enough to be labeled as a threat to aviation safety.

Once again, I don't think you will have a problem. Be prepared to provide pages and pages of explanations to these nutcases though.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by GhostRider6 » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:20 pm

Hi,

I have a similar case..

1) I was pulled over and had an entire 1 km of road cordoned off, ERT and you name it was present. I was held for a significant period of time and unable to leave the vehicle. I was issued a “ speeding ticket.” ( I was doing 40 in a 50 as I had just completed a right hand turn and turned onto a road with a line of marked and unmarked police cars on my way home. ( which I saw) Ya, like I’d speed! I was never given a valid reason for the stop or told what it was about.

I was never arrested in this case... just detained ( ish) Oh yeah, and I was in military uniform.

I still have a RAIC..
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by GhostRider6 » Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:31 pm

This is a decent question though...

I know of people who had child abuse claims manufactured against them by ex spouses..

Both are at the majors with RAICS.. the people In question were investigated by law enforcement and charges were laid then dropped as the claims were found to be demonstrably false.

And no charges were laid for manufacturing false reports ..
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sherryfly
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by sherryfly » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:14 am

Thank you everyone for the responses. In the event that a pilot is unable to get the RAIC, what options would this individual have?
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by digits_ » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:40 am

sherryfly wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:14 am
Thank you everyone for the responses. In the event that a pilot is unable to get the RAIC, what options would this individual have?
Work for a job where you don't need a RAIC: pretty much every float job, technically medevac jobs, but contract requirements could throw a wrench in that, fly for an operator up north or unsecure airports.

Theoretically, your pilot license should give you access to your airplane at any airport. But some airport have "safety" rules that make it extremely impractical to do so.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Topoff » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:50 am

You have to be able to obtain and hold a RAIC to work as a pilot at any Canadian airline that operates out of an airport that requires a RAIC. Which is pretty much all of them. For new hires that still have their RAIC in process there is a temporary yellow RAIC that they use that requires that they be searched every time the enter a secured area. Not very efficient. There's really no option other than to have a RAIC at major airports and its a condition of employment at airlines.

Theres always an option to work for a 703 / bush / charter operator that operates out of smaller airports that don't require RAIC. but eventually you would probably run into an issue where you ended up at an airport that requires one.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by sherryfly » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:51 am

Thanks so much for the responses everyone! It has eased my mind to some extent. Since I do not have a record of any sort, hopefully it will not be an issue. I was under the impression that if you do not get the RAIC, you can no longer work as a pilot.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by digits_ » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:53 am

Topoff wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:50 am

Theres always an option to work for a 703 / bush / charter operator that operates out of smaller airports that don't require RAIC. but eventually you would probably run into an issue where you ended up at an airport that requires one.
Why would you need one in that case? I've flown plenty of times as a 703 operator to an airport that requires a RAIC for employees, without having one. Because I wasn't based in the airport, and we didn't use the big terminal but a private FBO, there was never an issue.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by tps8903 » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:06 am

You will be fine if it happened exactly as you say it did. That would be a non criminal police record and won't be disclosed in a criminal background check unless it relates specifically to the job you are applying for. Even then the freedom of information office contacts the officer in charge of the file and asks that officers opinion regarding disclosure of the file as it pertains to the employment you are seeking. If nothing came of it likely the officer put in a report as such, if not he will say so if he ever does get said call. If you were denied employment or clearance in this country because you get stopped by or spoken to by the police there would be very few employable people left.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Heliian » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:13 am

sherryfly wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 pm
Recently, my vehicle was flagged and my information was collected by the police. The reason for this was because someone who had the same make and model of my vehicle had committed a crime.
It's unlikely your information was recorded permanently. They fed you the oldest trick in the book when it comes to stop and check. It's a very convenient excuse for them to dig a little deeper into you and your car and I'm going to guess that you weren't alone at the time, them too. You should only be worried about actual convictions.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by digits_ » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:26 am

Heliian wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:13 am
sherryfly wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 pm
Recently, my vehicle was flagged and my information was collected by the police. The reason for this was because someone who had the same make and model of my vehicle had committed a crime.
It's unlikely your information was recorded permanently. They fed you the oldest trick in the book when it comes to stop and check. It's a very convenient excuse for them to dig a little deeper into you and your car and I'm going to guess that you weren't alone at the time, them too. You should only be worried about actual convictions.
I'm curious. Why would they need a trick to stop and check you?
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by palebird » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:55 pm

What police force was this? As long as you have not had a criminal conviction you should be fine. Even if you have they will get csis to check you out and then make a decision.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Localizer » Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:34 pm

Sorry to burst your bubble fellas .. anytime you have contact with a police officer an indice is generated and they are PERMENENT. If you review the TSC policy, you will sign off for Transport to have access to all indice reports. It doesn’t matter if you are arrested, charged or convicted of a crime, Transport is the final decision maker and will review those reports as the officer reported and determine your eligibility for a RAIC.

Lots of people have been denied or revoked a TSC and never charged, let alone arrested.

Good luck!
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by palebird » Mon Mar 18, 2019 2:42 pm

I call BS on that.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Localizer » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:41 pm

Palebird,

I would encourage you to do your own homework .. I wish it was BS.

Indice reports, which are also called LERC’s are a permanent record of police contact and are used for various background checks including vulnerable sector checks, or any other agency you give permission to .. ie Transport Canada when you sign off your application for a TSC. (Read the fine print)

This is why people are afraid and nervous when applying for a RAIC .. simply knowing the wrong people could potentially get your application denied. If a parent or sibling is up to no good or a spouse has a criminal record .. you could be denied .. simply because you COULD be influanced to do something negative toward civil aviation .. sounds crazy but it’s all very true.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Heliian » Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:17 am

digits_ wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:26 am
Heliian wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:13 am
sherryfly wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 pm
Recently, my vehicle was flagged and my information was collected by the police. The reason for this was because someone who had the same make and model of my vehicle had committed a crime.
It's unlikely your information was recorded permanently. They fed you the oldest trick in the book when it comes to stop and check. It's a very convenient excuse for them to dig a little deeper into you and your car and I'm going to guess that you weren't alone at the time, them too. You should only be worried about actual convictions.
I'm curious. Why would they need a trick to stop and check you?
Because it's illegal for them to stop you without cause.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by daedalusx » Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:53 am

Localizer wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:41 pm
Palebird,

I would encourage you to do your own homework .. I wish it was BS.

Indice reports, which are also called LERC’s are a permanent record of police contact and are used for various background checks including vulnerable sector checks, or any other agency you give permission to .. ie Transport Canada when you sign off your application for a TSC. (Read the fine print)

This is why people are afraid and nervous when applying for a RAIC .. simply knowing the wrong people could potentially get your application denied. If a parent or sibling is up to no good or a spouse has a criminal record .. you could be denied .. simply because you COULD be influanced to do something negative toward civil aviation .. sounds crazy but it’s all very true.
Absolutely true. 100%.
You do not have to be arrested to be denied a RAIC.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by cncpc » Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:00 am

Heliian wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:13 am
sherryfly wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:49 pm
Recently, my vehicle was flagged and my information was collected by the police. The reason for this was because someone who had the same make and model of my vehicle had committed a crime.
It's unlikely your information was recorded permanently. They fed you the oldest trick in the book when it comes to stop and check. It's a very convenient excuse for them to dig a little deeper into you and your car and I'm going to guess that you weren't alone at the time, them too. You should only be worried about actual convictions.
Sorry, Helian, but you should be worried about every interaction with the police. The term criminal record has been replaced by criminal history now, and criminal history can include any interaction with the police, and offenses you have been found not guilty of.

Re the above post, it is bullshit that somebody asks a police officer what they think. Who cares what they think. They have a simple job. Gather evidence of a crime and present it to prosecutors. If prosecutors think the prosecution will be successful they file a charge. If a court thinks you are guilty, you will be convicted. Anything short of that is none of the business of those people in Transport described above as "batshit crazy". But they make it their business.

The Federal Court of Canada is simply a rubber stamp for whatever the government wants to do. People who want to challenge this need to do it in a Charter challenge in a real court, one of the superior courts of the province. I recommend BC or Ontario.

You can count on the fingers of one hand any criminal offences that might rationally be connected to aviation security. However, all of them are when it comes to a decision on a RAIC.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Eric Janson » Mon Apr 22, 2019 3:09 am

Just fly overseas - things are usually much simpler.

I just have a company ID - operate all over the World. Passport and GenDec work fine.
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by sherryfly » Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:24 pm

Do other countries generally accept Canadian licenses? Or would you have to re-do the training?
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Re: RAIC Pass

Post by Panama Jack » Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:23 am

sherryfly wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:24 pm
Do other countries generally accept Canadian licenses? Or would you have to re-do the training?
Generally, you would have to do a license conversion- normally some sort of a written exam, at least on air law, and a check ride (and aviation medical). In the case of EASA, you end up doing well over a dozen written exams.
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