Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

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Rockie
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Rockie »

Rookie50 wrote:
Rockie wrote:I don't disagree that BBD has been the recipient of huge amounts of taxpayer largesse over the years or that it is a grossly mismanaged company. However this is a loan, and when this airplane gets the attention and orders it deserves feel free to insist it be paid back. This airplane is a real Canadian achievement that I do not at all mind supporting and promoting.

As for comparisons to Boeing, they are probably the single biggest defence contractor in the US which is the very definition of corporate welfare.
"Gets the orders it deserves".

What does that mean? If it "deserved orders - it would have them!"
It's a great airplane that just entered service, give it time.
Rookie50 wrote:Boeing? The leading supplier of Civilian aircraft worldwide --, I'd argue.
Absolutely true all by itself never mind the military contracts which are massive. By my count their civilian stable consists of the 717, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, 777 and the 787 all of which are hugely successful (well, except for the 717 that wasn't really theirs), which makes your BBD comparison to them even more odd.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Rookie50 »

This comment renders the opinion BBD doesn't even NEED the money -- the government forced it on them to look like they are still relevant -- after all the prior bailout money -- with no employment or other conditions.

http://business.financialpost.com/fp-co ... didnt-need

I'm speechless. (And skeptical)

And If true, that's even more bizzare policy.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Vickers vanguard »

Rookie50 wrote:
crazyaviator wrote:Aircraft manufacturers are subsidized all around the world, either through loans/grants or sweet deals at the sale end. Sadly , we need to maintain a level playing field in order to be competitive through assistance BUT NOT 1 penny more
This is nothing to do with subsidization.

This is bailing out gross incompetence at the highest levels. It's a political football and always has been.

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2016/1 ... order.html

http://www.fool.ca/2017/01/26/bombardie ... his-train/



how about all the money the auto industry got during the 2009 crisis ! and none of them were even Canadian...it was just to keep jobs here. Canadians are like brits when it comes to their industries and expertise.....you will become a shadow of yourselves. And by the way, 3 hundreds something millions ??? I really think they could have done without it at this stage. the most important move came from Quebec with their billion AT THE RIGHT MOMENT. Sure, people have to be accountable but not to the point of letting such a jewel fail.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by av8ts »

Read a story in the paper today that since it's beginning Bombardier has received over 4 billion in government handouts. Also Bombardier has lobbied to have themselves removed from the Access To Information list so they may have received more without us knowing and the taxpayers are not privileged to repayment terms of loans.

I actually don't have a problem with giving them money. It's a better investment than the billion spent on the G20 in Toronto or the billion the Ontario Liberals spent to cancel the gas plant and buy the election. However as a taxpayer I should be able to find out exactly how much I'm giving them and the repayment terms.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

So ...
I gather from the majority posting, we should NOT allow BBD to seek investors, especially if the investor is the Canadian government (aka Canadian taxpayers). Let's ask the Feds to dismantle those other useless departments while we're at it, Industry and Commerce, the Business development bank, which are nothing but a farce any way. (Really???)

Based on all the cheering, if BBD is allowed to cave in like a Florida sinkhole as is proposed, the debris sucked down with it will likely be most of the Canadian aerospace industry. Gee, what an sensible suggestion that is. I'm sure the employees at many of our aerospace companies will immediately see the brilliance in your rants and are hoping you'll soon run for office to get a grip on things.

Let's continue to compare BBD with Boeing (despite their differences, like age, product line, markets, two world wars plus) or Airbus (for most of the same reasons). The very fact some of those posting know the competition for BBD along with the level and intensity of that competition, they seem to prefer that Canada stay out of the game all together.
Why should we (Canadians) have the arrogance of dreaming big? Who in their right mind would want to get behind the 3rd largest aircraft manufacturer? Because it's much cheaper and easier to support a hockey team at the Olympics or, because it's a Quebec Corporation (you mean like, Air Canada).
Wait. Most of Canada's aerospace is based in Quebec. Dommage!!

What about globalization so many here seem to be in favour of? (I'm not)

The fact that C series has outsold every previous BBD product with wings to date, not to mention numerous other new aircraft types at certification, is sold out for at least the next two plus years, is the most modern, quietest, fuel efficient aircraft in its class ...
can't imagine why any Canadian would want to see it succeed.

BTW, if you think this company is poorly managed or not on the road to recovery ...
you know diddley squat about BBD.

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by mbav8r »

Thanks Gino, I don't understand it either, who is this so called competition that could fill the void if BBD were to fail. That was one of the most ridiculous arguments I heard on this topic, it's not like there is any other aerospace companies in Canada with a clean slate design aircraft, that if only BBD were out of the way they could get it going, come on!
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by bobcaygeon »

Rookie50 wrote:
bobcaygeon wrote:
CpnCrunch wrote:Embraer, Boeing and Airbus have all received subsidies or tax breaks as well. This is a loan, so not quite the same as a bailout or tax break.
A loan to an inbred company with a "fixed" board where you can never clean house because the voting structure. Publicly traded but never held accountable to the shareholder.

This is the reason guy's like Trump get elected. BBD gets loaned hundreds of millions and the jobs are in places like Mexico. (TTC trains, Global parts, Lear 75/85, plus many many CSeries systems)

This company has been a stinker for a very long time.
I've mentioned before, this is exactly the kind of policy that drives people with real innovative talent to the US. The idiot response was -- just move there then. Intelligent. Doesn't anyone want to see a strong, competitive Canada -- instead of forever a home for fish, timber, dirty oil and pictures of Mounties?

The flip question is, if I had capital -- and a passion for building an aerospace company, why would I ever stay in Canada, with my talent or my money, and compete with the government of Canada?
Bombardier will never be that as long as the Beaudoin/Bombardier clan are running the show. The government had it right when they included the requirement to remove/change the dual class share structure that gave these clowns 60% of the voting shares despite holding only 25% of the shares by value. They removed all the restrictions to buy votes in Quebec. This money is going to Global 7000 which is based on an old design that is hardly industry leading. Don't get me started on their train incompetence and how much of their work is done outside of Canada in places like Mexico.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

I can't imagine why the owners of Bombardier would want to change anything, regardless of its share structure or composition of its board of directors. It's still a private corporation. Isn't it? I'd imagine even bobcaygeon would sell to whomever he chose to, or would accept financial help from whomever offered it, if he owned a company in financial distress and were in a similar position. Why would the Bombardier family be any different? It seems reasonable to me that they'd exercise whatever ownership powers they have while still in a position to do so. The Canadian government loan doesn't buy them the company nor does it make them a controlling member of the board.
Strings are strings, whether its the government or not. Bombardier doesn't have to accept government strings or they'd likely be getting more money from the Feds than what's on offer. Unless they were in as bad a financial shape as some would have us believe. The amount on offer suggests otherwise.
I guess we'll find out when their Annual Report comes out.

It's their sinking ship. I suspect they'd have a better idea of when it's time to accept a lifeline or get into a lifeboat than I do. I think it would be odd if they tried to pick and choose between lifeboats though, but then again, I'm not on a sinking ship.

Judging by the remarks regarding the Global 7000, I'd say somebody doesn't know much about the 7000.

... But that's only one mans opinion.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

Air Canada's CS300s could enable broad network changes
Flight Global
Jon Hemmerdinger

Though Air Canada has described its incoming Bombardier CS300s as replacements for Embraer 190s, a top Air Canada executive has suggested the fleet plan could evolve.

Air Canada president of passenger airlines Benjamin Smith says the new Bombardier aircraft could prove as transformative as Boeing 787s, allowing Air Canada to make broader network changes.

During an interview with FlightGlobal at Toronto Pearson International airport on 9 February, Smith makes clear that Air Canada's plan calls for the CS300 to replace the E190.

"But that's assuming our network is static," he adds.

"This airplane is so good [that] we think it's going to want to go on every route in North America," Smith says of the CS300.

"The economics – it's got CASM rates that are equivalent to much larger airplanes. So it may enable us, or give us the opportunity, to rethink our bank structures, how our network is designed," he adds.

Air Canada has orders for 45 CS300s, with deliveries scheduled for between 2019 and 2022, according to Flight Fleets Analyzer. The 25 E190s scheduled for replacement are only about 10 years old, Fleets Analyzer shows.

"It's kind of like the 787," Smith says of the CSeries.

Air Canada initially ordered 787s as replacements for ageing Boeing 767s and Airbus A330s.

But the 787s proved so efficient on long-haul routes that Air Canada instead used them to launch a major international expansion, Smith says.

Air Canada ended up keeping the A330s in its mainline fleet, and transitioned the 767s to its newly-created low-cost subsidiary Rouge, Smith notes.

Thanks to the 787, Air Canada "rejiggered our entire network," Smith says. "If we can hit a similar home run with the CSeries, that would be amazing."

CSeries would be "perfect" for a route such as Vancouver to Boston, which "stretches the legs of the Airbus narrowbody", Smith says.

Or, Air Canada could potentially deploy CS300s from extreme-eastern Canadian cities to destinations in Europe, or from Vancouver to Hawaii, Smith says.

Smith says Air Canada remains confident Bombardier will meet its delivery schedule, downplaying the possibility that recent delivery delays could stretch into the coming years.

"We don't have a concern about the delivery schedule on the CSeries," Smith says. "We have a long history with Bombardier. We know their leadership extremely well."

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by bobcaygeon »

Gino Under wrote:I can't imagine why the owners of Bombardier would want to change anything, regardless of its share structure or composition of its board of directors. It's still a private corporation. Isn't it? I'd imagine even bobcaygeon would sell to whomever he chose to, or would accept financial help from whomever offered it, if he owned a company in financial distress and were in a similar position. Why would the Bombardier family be any different? It seems reasonable to me that they'd exercise whatever ownership powers they have while still in a position to do so. The Canadian government loan doesn't buy them the company nor does it make them a controlling member of the board.
Strings are strings, whether its the government or not. Bombardier doesn't have to accept government strings or they'd likely be getting more money from the Feds than what's on offer. Unless they were in as bad a financial shape as some would have us believe. The amount on offer suggests otherwise.
I guess we'll find out when their Annual Report comes out.

It's their sinking ship. I suspect they'd have a better idea of when it's time to accept a lifeline or get into a lifeboat than I do. I think it would be odd if they tried to pick and choose between lifeboats though, but then again, I'm not on a sinking ship.

Judging by the remarks regarding the Global 7000, I'd say somebody doesn't know much about the 7000.

... But that's only one mans opinion.
Bombardier is a publicly traded company that feeds off of government cash (repayable loan, what other kind is there for normal people). The dual class crap is a joke that feeds the inbreeding that keeps on appointing family to lead the ship down the toilet until another government cheque arrives.

The Global 7000 is rewinged earlier Global Express. Look at it. It has the same shitty baggage door as an RJ/Challenger and finally has bigger windows than an RJ (the original didn't). The whole line of that aircraft is bought and paid for by the taxpayer when the government owned Canadair and spent a ridiculous amount of money getting the Challenger 600 (and it's POS Lycoming engines) to market.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

Try visiting the Bombardier website.
If you look at their listed management you won't find any family members listed or involved in the daily management of this company.

If you look at their Board of directors you will find two family members. One of whom is listed as 'emeritus' (which means he only has a title). I'd say your assessment of Bombardier's present leadership is way out in left field.

FYI
The number of GX in service today is over 600.
The number of G650s in service as of December 2016, 222.
Not bad for a 'sh*tbox', eh? And a Canadian 'sh*tbox' at that.

One of the Canadian government roles will always be to support Canadian business and businesses if and or when it can. Welcome to that reality.

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Rookie50 »

Gino Under wrote: One of the Canadian government roles will always be to support Canadian business and businesses if and or when it can. Welcome to that reality.

:drinkers: Gino Under
...Then with that approach ultimately the world will downgrade Canada's debt, unless they want to print money like other countries.

We can't afford it, and "Canada" supporting failing businesses means "my personal tax dollars". And I don't support this. It's offensive. I'm not "Canadian" so I can be a contributor and have the nanny state rip me off to buy votes in Quebec. Where's the money for Alberta companies, Canada? Oh, that's different.

Also, I run a small business, "Canada". So do thousands of others. Better run than BBD.

Where's mine, then?

It doesn't work.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

So, you're assuming BBD is failing. I'm not.

I'm assuming BBD is recovering and the tax payer will get his money back AS AGREED.

FWIW
It's my tax money too and I have numerous complaints about how my contributions to that kitty gets spent by the Feds regardless of their political stripe.
Health care. What health care? It's been years since I had a family physician. Yet zillions are poured into health care every year. That's bang for my buck. And without any return I might add.
F35s? Refugees? Free Flags? You name it. They're full of brilliant ways to spend our tax dollars. Some of their ideas DO make sense and support for Bombardier, and other companies like Bombardier (who employ tax payers BTW) makes sense. Heck, they bailed out tax payers in the auto industry working for non-Canadian manufacturers. I'm still picking my brains up off the floor over that one. It's what they do.

"Canada" isn't all things to all people or businesses. I get that.
When the majority of aerospace companies are in Quebec, it's more than a 'French' thing. Unless you don't have the ability to see "Canada's" support for what it is. Support for a Canadian Corporation. (the popularity of the Liberals in Quebec, BTW, both provincial and federal, is sinking like the Titanic)

I would echo your sentiments regarding Alberta businesses. I lost my shirt on COS.

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by B208 »

Gino Under wrote:So, you're assuming BBD is failing. I'm not.
If they were doing really well they wouldn't need the loan......or the one before it.....of the one before that......

Pure pork barrel.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

I didn't say they were doing fantastic financially and don't need the financial investment. I said I don't think they are a failing company.
Pork barrel politics? Well, I"ll give you that. But tough times call for tough measures and you kiss whatever ass needs kissing.
(I don't make the rules)

If you're going to trash BBD or any other Canadian company, do some f**kin' reading.

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by 234james »

http://business.financialpost.com/news/ ... lion-pitch
After all canadian goverment making suitable decision....we hope they never change their opinion and provide the fund to this company up to they change their ways....
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Mostly Harmless »

Since BBD still has not paid back it's last billion dollar loan (they still owe roughly 600 million and it's been around 20 years) I very much doubt any money loaned will ever be repaid.

However, I am writing because too many people are complaining about the auto bailout. I feel it should be pointed out that:

All of that bailout money was repaid
The government was given stocks in the company and had a say in the decisions made by that company in exchange for taxpayer money.
That those stocks paid dividends to the government
When those stocks were sold (a decision I disagreed with), they were sold at a profit.


You can whine about the auto bailout all you like but we not only got our money back we made a profit.

Do you think BBD can/will meet those same conditions?
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by B208 »

Gino Under wrote:I didn't say they were doing fantastic financially and don't need the financial investment. I said I don't think they are a failing company.
Pork barrel politics? Well, I"ll give you that. But tough times call for tough measures and you kiss whatever ass needs kissing.
(I don't make the rules)

If you're going to trash BBD or any other Canadian company, do some f**kin' reading.

Gino Under :drinkers:
I would say that ass is more in need of kicking than kissing.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

"If you do not take an interest in the affairs of your government, then you are doomed to live under the rule of fools." – Plato

We are all living under the rule of fools. Some things never change.

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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Gino Under »

Bombardier Loan A Smart Investment In Canada's Future

The federal government's announcement that it will provide $372.5 million to Bombardier in repayable loans is good news, and a smart investment in the future of this country and its people.

Criticisms of the deal are not only short-sighted, but just plain wrong.

The fact is, Canada needs to invest in aerospace if it wants to be a player in that industry -- an industry that provides good jobs across the country and is the basis of much of the research and development work done in Canada.

To say that Bombardier should be allowed to "crash and burn," as some have, is not only heartless for the thousands of workers and their families who would be left in desperate straits as a result, it is bad economic policy.

It is important to remember that Bombardier is one of Canada's largest employers with more than 24,000 workers across Canada -- and those jobs create another 40,800 jobs at and by the suppliers used by Bombardier, as well as through the spending of its well-paid workers.

The real job growth begins as production jobs are created to meet demand for the airliner.
Bombardier is also a world leader in research and innovation. Much of the money announced last week will go to the Global 7000 business aircraft program, scheduled to go into commercial service next year. The rest would go to the CSeries passenger jet, an innovative Bombardier aircraft that marks a major advance in aviation technology worldwide.

Bombardier's first entrance in the lucrative single-aisle commercial aircraft segment -- the CSeries -- puts it in the same market as the Boeing 737 and Airbus 319. The CSeries is an innovative airliner that uses 20 per cent less fuel than comparable jets. Supporting its development not only helps spur research in this country and create good jobs, but it contributes to developing a green economy.

With the CSeries now moving from design to production, the real job growth begins as production jobs are created to meet demand for the airliner, both at Bombardier and at suppliers across Canada.

Just getting to this stage has involved more than 200 suppliers in the CSeries project, creating jobs right across the country.

It's not just me saying this.

Karl Moore at McGill University's Desautels Faculty of Management told the CBC that "If you want to play in the big leagues in this industry -- different than many other industries -- you need government support." He said that the federal government's investment and earlier investments by the Quebec government are "what's necessary and appropriate in this particular industry."

A complaint from Brazil to the World Trade Organization over the federal loan is more bravado that substance. We need to remember that the Brazilian government provides preferential loans to Embraer, its country's airliner producer, as well as infrastructure concessions and defence contracts. It even holds a small stake in the company.

Brazil, like other jurisdictions with significant aerospace sectors, makes such investments for the same reason Canada announced its loan to Bombardier last week: it's a good investment in the future of the country and its economy.

Developing a new aircraft takes years and years of research and development. During that time, money flows out of the company and into the rest of the economy at a rapid rate. While that can be good for the suppliers and subcontractors getting some of that money, it can be a real drain on the company itself.

The work is necessary, however, if aerospace companies are going to continue to develop the products that will keep them competitive in the market, and creating jobs here at home. Investments such as last week's loan are meant to help companies such as Bombardier get over those humps.

It is beyond me how anyone could consider a repayable loan of $372.5 million anything but a great investment.
Once a new airliner is developed and put into production, it can create good jobs for decades as new jets keep rolling off the production line. It is then that we see the real return on the investment.

Consider that in 2015, the total taxes collected as a result of Bombardier operations were $1.6 billion, including business and property taxes, pay-roll contributions, social charges and income taxes paid by employees.

As well, Bombardier's operations accounted for 0.7 per cent of Canada's Gross Domestic product, or $12.4 billion, and the aerospace sector as a whole accounted for 10 per cent of all research and development spending in Canada in 2015.

With numbers like that, it is beyond me how anyone could consider a repayable loan of $372.5 million anything but a great investment.

Huffington Post Canada
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by teacher »

Letting Bombardier ‘crash and burn’ would be a disaster for Canada

Barrie McKenna

OTTAWA — The Globe and Mail
Published Sunday, Feb. 19, 2017 4:23PM EST
Last updated Sunday, Feb. 19, 2017 4:25PM EST


Condemnation was harsh and predictable when Ottawa wrote a big cheque this month to aircraft maker Bombardier Inc.
Critics derided the $372.5-million interest-free loan as another case of the federal government pandering to Quebec, and worse, handing a gift to two unworthy wealthy families who control the company.
That may well be the gut reaction of many Canadians.

But there is a parallel narrative here. The federal loan is about shoring up a financially weak company so it can continue to do all the sorts of things this country needs. Bombardier invests heavily in research and development, exports most of what it produces, has a highly skilled and well paid work force, and sustains a vast network of suppliers across the country.
Let’s debunk a few myths.

It simply isn’t true that the latest loan is solely about helping one province and one company. Two-thirds of the loan amount – nearly $250-million – is earmarked to support the costly development of Bombardier’s Global 7000 business jet, which will be built in Toronto. The remainder of the funds are for the C Series, a 100-to-160-seat commercial aircraft, assembled in Mirabel, Que.
It’s equally misleading to characterize the loan as a transfer from taxpayers to the Bombardier and Beaudoin families, who control the Montreal-based transportation company. Of course, they’ll benefit if Bombardier’s stock price recovers. But the immediate beneficiaries of the federal money are the company’s 21,000 Canadian workers and its network of more than 1,000 suppliers across the country, including 350 in Ontario.

Critics say the federal government should cut off Bombardier and let the company fail. Forget the business of creating and building aircraft in Canada. Just let it all go, in spite of the billions of dollars in federal and provincial assistance sunk into the company over the decades.

“Time to let Bombardier crash and burn,” was the headline on a column in iPolitics, an Ottawa-based political news website.
That would be a disaster for Canada’s aerospace industry.

Bombardier sits at the top of a production, design and engineering supply chain that spans the country, and the world.

The demise of Bombardier and the C Series is exactly what global heavyweights Boeing and Airbus want. These companies have tried for years to kill the aircraft company, because it’s muscling in on the fast-growing smaller end of a market dominated by the two best-selling airliners of all time, the Airbus A320 and Boeing 737. Both companies – recipients of gobs of government support in their home countries – are aggressively discounting and making their newest offerings more fuel efficient to lure customers away from the C Series.
Federal Infrastructure Minister Navdeep Bains highlighted the broader stakes for Canada at a recent ceremony in Montreal. “The long-term success of the aerospace sector . . . is very much connected to the success of Bombardier,” he said.

Imagine what Bombardier’s demise would mean. The company is the single largest corporate R&D spender in Canada. In 2015, it spent $2.3-billion on R&D – nearly four times the No. 2 spender, auto-parts maker Magna International Inc., at $639-million – according to an annual ranking by Research Infosource.
As an industry, aerospace companies account for 30 per cent of all manufacturing R&D in Canada. The sector exports 80 per cent of what it makes, and roughly 40 per cent of that beyond North America. A recent federal study says the industry directly and indirectly contributed $28-billion to GDP and 211,000 jobs in 2015.
There are few industries where Canada can claim to be a global player. Aerospace happens to be one of them. Canada is a leading supplier of regional aircraft, business jets, flight simulators, pilot training and aircraft engines.

The one consolation for the Trudeau government is that opposition to its Bombardier loan is highly polarized – inside and outside Quebec. Quebec nationalists say the money isn’t enough; politicians in the rest of the country argue it’s too generous. Even the federal Conservatives, who gave similar loans to the company while they were in power, are crying foul.
Strip away the political posturing, and the Liberals know they are on solid public-policy ground in helping Bombardier.
Doing nothing would be like rolling the dice.
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Donald »

Well this makes me feel good about providing government bailout money to BBD:

http://business.financialpost.com/news/ ... rnment-aid
MONTREAL — Bombardier’s senior executives saw their compensation rise by nearly 50 per cent last year at a time when it laid off thousands of workers, sought government aid and saw the first CSeries passenger jet take flight.

Total compensation for the Montreal-based company’s top five executives and board chairman Pierre Beaudoin was US$32.6 million in 2016, up from US$21.9 million the year before, according to a proxy circular ahead of its May 11 annual meeting.

CEO Alain Bellemare received US$9.5 million, up from US$6.4 million in 2015, including US$5.2 million in share and option-based awards and a US$1 million salary.

Bellemare’s annual bonus almost doubled to US$2.36 million.

Beaudoin’s compensation increased to US$5.25 million from US$3.85 million a year earlier.


In the regulatory filing, Bombardier attributed the higher compensation was due to a number of factors, including achieving profit and cash flow targets, securing CSeries orders and completing the first flight of the Global 7000 business jet.

Bellemare was also credited with achieving earnings at the high end of the company’s guidance, exceeding profit margin targets in all business segments and making significant progress on achieving the company’s plan to revive its fortunes.

Company spokesman Simon Letendre added that a large portion of the compensation is not guaranteed.

“For instance, 85 per cent of the compensation of the president and CEO is at risk and 28 per cent is comprised of stock options whose value depends on the appreciation of the Bombardier stock, something that would of course benefit all shareholders,” he wrote in an email.

Bombardier is in the midst of a five-year turnaround plan that has involved mass layoffs as it tries to regain its financial footing. It is eliminating 14,500 jobs around the world by the end of next year.



Shares of Bombardier (TSX:BBD.B) last year increased 61 per cent to $2.16 on the Toronto Stock Exchange. They gained one cent at $2.09 in Wednesday morning trading.

The company cut its loss to US$981 million last year, down from US$5.34 billion in 2015 despite lower revenues.

The federal government announced in February a $372.5-million loan for the CSeries and Global 7000 programs to be repaid over 15 years.

Last year, Bombardier received a US$1-billion investment for the CSeries program from the Quebec government in exchange for a 49.5 per cent stake. The company also sold a 30 per cent stake in its railway division to pension fund manager Caisse de depot for US$1.5 billion.

Bombardier also revealed Wednesday that former Quebec premier Daniel Johnson and ex-Bell and Nortel CEO Jean Monty are stepping down from its board of directors. They will be replaced by Camso CEO Pierre Marcouiller and Antony Tyler, former CEO of Cathay Pacific Airways and the International Air Transport Association.
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Chris M
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by Chris M »

bobcaygeon wrote:The Global 7000 is rewinged earlier Global Express. Look at it. It has the same shitty baggage door as an RJ/Challenger and finally has bigger windows than an RJ (the original didn't). The whole line of that aircraft is bought and paid for by the taxpayer when the government owned Canadair and spent a ridiculous amount of money getting the Challenger 600 (and it's POS Lycoming engines) to market.
I realize I'm quoting an older post, but the 7000 has remarkably little in common with it's Global/Challenger/RJ siblings. They share a look (by design, the 7000 almost got a C-Series style windshield early in its development but brand recognition was considered more valuable), and there are similarities in system and structural architecture, but that's the end of it. The parts commonality (not counting standard parts like hardware) between the 7000 and the GLEX is 2. Not 2%, 2 parts. The nose gear doors.

The baggage door on the 7000 is 5 feet tall and opens outward, just like the Q400 cabin doors. I can walk through it quite easily.
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North Shore
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by North Shore »

Donald wrote:Well this makes me feel good about providing government bailout money to BBD:

http://business.financialpost.com/news/ ... rnment-aid
MONTREAL — Bombardier’s senior executives saw their compensation rise by nearly 50 per cent last year at a time when it laid off thousands of workers, sought government aid and saw the first CSeries passenger jet take flight.

Total compensation for the Montreal-based company’s top five executives and board chairman Pierre Beaudoin was US$32.6 million in 2016, up from US$21.9 million the year before, according to a proxy circular ahead of its May 11 annual meeting.

CEO Alain Bellemare received US$9.5 million, up from US$6.4 million in 2015, including US$5.2 million in share and option-based awards and a US$1 million salary.

Bellemare’s annual bonus almost doubled to US$2.36 million.

Beaudoin’s compensation increased to US$5.25 million from US$3.85 million a year earlier.


In the regulatory filing, Bombardier attributed the higher compensation was due to a number of factors, including achieving profit and cash flow targets, securing CSeries orders and completing the first flight of the Global 7000 business jet.

Bellemare was also credited with achieving earnings at the high end of the company’s guidance, exceeding profit margin targets in all business segments and making significant progress on achieving the company’s plan to revive its fortunes.

Company spokesman Simon Letendre added that a large portion of the compensation is not guaranteed.

“For instance, 85 per cent of the compensation of the president and CEO is at risk and 28 per cent is comprised of stock options whose value depends on the appreciation of the Bombardier stock, something that would of course benefit all shareholders,” he wrote in an email.

Bombardier is in the midst of a five-year turnaround plan that has involved mass layoffs as it tries to regain its financial footing. It is eliminating 14,500 jobs around the world by the end of next year.



Shares of Bombardier (TSX:BBD.B) last year increased 61 per cent to $2.16 on the Toronto Stock Exchange. They gained one cent at $2.09 in Wednesday morning trading.

The company cut its loss to US$981 million last year, down from US$5.34 billion in 2015 despite lower revenues.

The federal government announced in February a $372.5-million loan for the CSeries and Global 7000 programs to be repaid over 15 years.

Last year, Bombardier received a US$1-billion investment for the CSeries program from the Quebec government in exchange for a 49.5 per cent stake. The company also sold a 30 per cent stake in its railway division to pension fund manager Caisse de depot for US$1.5 billion.

Bombardier also revealed Wednesday that former Quebec premier Daniel Johnson and ex-Bell and Nortel CEO Jean Monty are stepping down from its board of directors. They will be replaced by Camso CEO Pierre Marcouiller and Antony Tyler, former CEO of Cathay Pacific Airways and the International Air Transport Association.
^ THIS!
Revenue targets? Bonuses?
How about they get both when the taxpayers are repaid?
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'97 Tercel
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Re: Canadian Govt to bail out Bombardier.

Post by '97 Tercel »

http://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/ottawa-onta ... -1.3347004

Auto makers getting more investment too...
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