Westjet cabin incident, good thing it wasn't United or AC

[PROC_HDG]

The reviews/stars/ratings are totally irrelevant. When most people look for a flight they don't search that crap, they search one thing only. PRICE. As long as AC or WJ or any airline has competitive pricing they will get customers.

Maybe most. Not for me. Time, stress, aggravation are worth far more.

We get it. You have a hard on for WestJet. At the end of the day, AC is no longer the post-bankruptcy AC that drove away so many customers due to frustrated/rude front-line staff and lagging service. It is far and away the #1 choice for business flyers in Canada, and the front line service is improving on a daily basis. Astime goes on, the two airlines in this country come closer and closer to being the same thing. WJ has had the benefit of single-fleet, limited market, kool-aid drinking staff for years. But with their expansion into new and challenging markets, and front-line staff realizing just how the company feels about them, they will run into these "AC" types of problems more and more.

PROC_HDG

[rookiepilot]

It is far and away the #1 choice for business flyers in Canada, and the front line service is improving on a daily basis.
PROC_HDG

To where? Winnipeg? Lots of choice there.
Not far and away the top business class choice to anywhere else. Gotta be kidding there.

I've flown international business on AC, and business on Cathay, and others. Literally night and day in every way you can imagine.

AC business class has gone way downhill compared to international carriers, IMO.

The rude employees are still there, they refuse to fire them.

[Old fella]

The reviews/stars/ratings are totally irrelevant. When most people look for a flight they don't search that crap, they search one thing only. PRICE. As long as AC or WJ or any airline has competitive pricing they will get customers.

For leisurely and vacation travellers I agree most, if not all do not follow these airline rating sites, probably meaningless to them. Price is the determining factor.

[PROC_HDG]

It is far and away the #1 choice for business flyers in Canada, and the front line service is improving on a daily basis.
PROC_HDG

To where? Winnipeg? Lots of choice there.
Not far and away the top business class choice to anywhere else. Gotta be kidding there.

I've flown international business on AC, and business on Cathay, and others. Literally night and day in every way you can imagine.

AC business class has gone way downhill compared to international carriers, IMO.

The rude employees are still there, they refuse to fire them.

"Air Canada Named Canada's Preferred Airline by Frequent Business Travellers in Ipsos Reid Survey"
https://aircanada.mediaroom.com/index.p ... tem=137693

PROC_HDG

[cap41]

WHERE IS THE COCKPIT SAFETY

Isn't the cockpit locked?

[complexintentions]

I think it's impossible to make simplistic statements about something as complicated as an airline i.e. Airline A = good, Airline B = bad. I've flown on AC and WS both a zillion times and had the complete range of experiences on both. It comes down to the day, the flight, the specific crew. Not to mention a lot of it is on the passenger travelling. Ever notice how some people ALWAYS seem to have a negative experience? Hmm. Do you think perhaps it could be something to do with THEM, not the airline? lol

So I just consider overall trends. Personally, I have found over the last ten years AC service to be vastly improved, and WS to be trending slowly downward. Which isn't to say that AC is perfect and WS is terrible, not at all. I still fly on either one quite happily depending on schedule and price. But as WS comes to resemble a more traditional carrier, it does follow that the service level naturally suffers as it transitions from folksy upstart to a large corporation. AC on the other hand has been forced to pick up their game, and it shows.

But stereotypes and brand loyalty tend to make for rigid mindsets. I'm always amazed at how many people still think AC is a Crown corporation receiving "government handouts" or think Westjet is amazing because, hey, they're Westjet and they y'know, used to make funny PA's or buy pizza or whatever. Not acknowledging that both companies today are nothing like they were even a few years ago. And will continue to change going forward.

But, thinking is hard. And hating on Air Canada while blindly praising WestJet is a cherished national pastime.

[True North]

I think it's impossible to make simplistic statements about something as complicated as an airline i.e. Airline A = good, Airline B = bad. I've flown on AC and WS both a zillion times and had the complete range of experiences on both. It comes down to the day, the flight, the specific crew. Not to mention a lot of it is on the passenger travelling. Ever notice how some people ALWAYS seem to have a negative experience? Hmm. Do you think perhaps it could be something to do with THEM, not the airline? lol

So I just consider overall trends. Personally, I have found over the last ten years AC service to be vastly improved, and WS to be trending slowly downward. Which isn't to say that AC is perfect and WS is terrible, not at all. I still fly on either one quite happily depending on schedule and price. But as WS comes to resemble a more traditional carrier, it does follow that the service level naturally suffers as it transitions from folksy upstart to a large corporation. AC on the other hand has been forced to pick up their game, and it shows.

But stereotypes and brand loyalty tend to make for rigid mindsets. I'm always amazed at how many people still think AC is a Crown corporation receiving "government handouts" or think Westjet is amazing because, hey, they're Westjet and they y'know, used to make funny PA's or buy pizza or whatever. Not acknowledging that both companies today are nothing like they were even a few years ago. And will continue to change going forward.

But, thinking is hard. And hating on Air Canada while blindly praising WestJet is a cherished national pastime.

^ Yup.

[altiplano]

It is far and away the #1 choice for business flyers in Canada, and the front line service is improving on a daily basis.
PROC_HDG

To where? Winnipeg? Lots of choice there
Not far and away the top business class choice to anywhere else. Gotta be kidding there.

I've flown international business on AC, and business on Cathay, and others. Literally night and day in every way you can imagine.

AC business class has gone way downhill compared to international carriers, IMO.

The rude employees are still there, they refuse to fire them.

Yeah business class on AC looks like a real drag...



Oh, and, best airline in NA again...

Airline named North American leader in customer satisfaction for sixth time in eight years


MONTREAL, June 20, 2017 /CNW Telbec/ - Air Canada was today named Best Airline in North America by the 2017 Skytrax World Airline Awards at the International Paris Air Show. It is the sixth time in eight years Canada's flag carrier has been named the continent's best airline by Skytrax, whose survey of almost 20 million air travellers is recognized as the global benchmark of industry excellence.

Air Canada Named Best Airline in North America by Skytrax World Airline Awards at the Paris Air Show (CNW Group/Air Canada)

"We are delighted to be recognized as the Best Airline in North America by Skytrax based on the opinions of those who know us best: our customers. This award is a significant milestone in the transformation of Air Canada into one of the world's leading carriers and is all the more meaningful given the increased competition in our industry," said Calin Rovinescu, President and Chief Executive of Air Canada.

"I thank our employees for their hard work and dedication in helping us earn this distinction and I thank our customers for their loyalty and support as we have expanded our reach across the globe. As we celebrate our 80th year in 2017, we are extremely proud to be Canada's flag carrier, North America's Best Airline and its only Four Star network carrier," added Mr. Rovinescu.

Benjamin Smith, President, Passenger Airlines at Air Canada, said: "This award, based on the opinions of almost 20 million air travellers worldwide, shows customers are enthusiastically embracing the significant investments Air Canada is making in its products and services. These include the introduction of the state-of-the-art Boeing 787 Dreamliner into our fleet, a widening choice of destinations to choose from in our expanding global network, refurbished aircraft interiors featuring our next generation lie flat Business Class seats on all of our Boeing 777 and 787 aircraft and dedicated Premium Economy cabins, as well as other enhanced amenities ranging from sharply restyled Maple Leaf Lounges to signature dishes and wine pairings onboard."

"We are delighted to welcome Air Canada back at the World Airline Awards to recognize their achievement of being named the Best Airline in North America. To receive this accolade six times, in the last eight years is a remarkable achievement and we congratulate the airline on this outstanding, consistent performance," said Edward Plaisted, Chief Executive of Skytrax.

Since 2010, Air Canada has embarked on a $10 Billion capital expenditure program to elevate the travel experience. Customer-focused initiatives have included:

An expanded global network connecting over its Canadian gateway hubs to 95 cities in Europe, the Middle East, Africa, Asia, Australia, the Caribbean, Mexico, Central America and South America. Air Canada is one of only a few airlines in the world to serve all six inhabited continents;
A fleet renewal program that introduced Boeing 777s and state-of-the-art Boeing 787 Dreamliners, with new Boeing 737MAX aircraft arriving in 2017 and Bombardier CSeries jets entering the fleet in 2019;
Refitted cabin interiors across its wide-body fleet, including the introduction of the first lie-flat business seat fleetwide in North America and the first dedicated Premium Economy cabin in North America;
New International, Domestic and U.S. Maple Leaf Lounges;
Training initiatives for customer-facing inflight, airport, baggage and call centre employees, including expanded language capabilities. There are an estimated 80 languages spoken by Air Canada employees and in addition to English and French, service is available from three call centres in North America in Spanish, Mandarin, Cantonese, Korean and Japanese. From nine call centres outside North America service is offered in local languages, including Portuguese, Spanish, German, Italian, Hebrew, Mandarin, Cantonese and Japanese;
Technological innovations to facilitate customer interactions, including a new website compatible with all types of devices for a consistent experience, ongoing refinements of mobile technology, and increased investments in AI to further develop customer-focused capabilities and information management;
Enhanced onboard amenities such as signature dishes prepared by celebrated Canadian chef David Hawksworth coupled with wine pairings by world-renowned sommelier Veronique Rivest, and in-flight Wi-fi connectivity fleet-wide in North America to complement Air Canada's personal seatback In-Flight Entertainment System offering hundreds of hours of free digital audio-visual content.
About Skytrax

The 2017 edition of the annual Skytrax poll measured opinion from 19.87 million travellers drawn from over 105 countries worldwide between August 2016 and May 2017. The survey covers over 325 airlines, from largest international airlines to smaller domestic carriers, and evaluates quality standards across 41 key performance indicators in front-line products and services in the airport and onboard environments.

About Air Canada

Air Canada is Canada's largest domestic and international airline serving more than 200 airports on six continents. Canada's flag carrier is among the 20 largest airlines in the world and in 2016 served close to 45 million customers. Air Canada provides scheduled passenger service directly to 64 airports in Canada, 57 in the United States and 95 in Europe, the Middle East, Africa, Asia, Australia, the Caribbean, Mexico, Central America and South America. Air Canada is a founding member of Star Alliance, the world's most comprehensive air transportation network serving 1,300 airports in 191 countries. Air Canada is the only international network carrier in North America to receive a Four-Star ranking according to independent U.K. research firm Skytrax. For more information, please visit: http://www.aircanada.com, follow @AirCanada on Twitter and join Air Canada on Facebook.

[sanjet]

altiplano, CBC just released an article to question the legitimacy of Skytrax since AC got the award.
Air Canada will never win with CBC, no use fighting it. It's a canadian tradition to bash AC.

Survey ranks Air Canada as top North American airline — is it true?
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air-can ... -1.4169313

I'm just glad I live in a country where air travel is still relatively ok with AC, Westjet and Porter.

[Verdasco]

he shouldn't of grabbed her cellphone, the frustration on his face looks scary and frightening to EVERYONE inside the plane, especially worried passengers

and why does he have orders to kick people out of the plane? isn't that the captains? captain did well on calming the passenger a bit but the flight attendant needs to shut up and let the captain close the bridge


she was upset that she couldn't place her carry on bag up top because it had medicine that was important? how about moving bags around to accommodate the lady?

[rookiepilot]

Question for the Air Canada cheerleaders, that contrary to evidence, seem to think AC is both the safest and most polite airline in the world.

I just completed a long, multi segment trip as a pax. One business, rest economy, last premium economy with AC. On this last flight they made me take off my cordless Bose, while still parked at the gate. First time on any airline I've ever been asked to do this, including AC.

I politely questioned this, and got a snotty answer (it's safety!). What else would one expect -- it's AC.

Fine, I'm always compliant. But during the taxi, ect, when I always focus on where the emergency exits are and how to get out, perhaps helping others -- not relying on same likely panicked FA's, all of us are subjected to AC's non stop advertising on the screen. Loud. Yeah, that's safety first. Not.

Guy across from me, and others, shoes off. Completely dumb. No policy on that, which is far worse than my Bose which I can hear everything.

Yep, as long as I can hear the advertising non stop blasted at me --my question is, how does full volume advertising, just before takeoff, (which No Other airline that I've flown recently does) -- help safety?

AC is making lots of money cost cutting. Don't tell me that isn't at the expense of safety, too ---

[True North]

Question for the Air Canada cheerleaders, that contrary to evidence, seem to think AC is both the safest and most polite airline in the world.

I just completed a long, multi segment trip as a pax. One business, rest economy, last premium economy with AC. On this last flight they made me take off my cordless Bose, while still parked at the gate. First time on any airline I've ever been asked to do this, including AC.

I politely questioned this, and got a snotty answer (it's safety!). What else would one expect -- it's AC.

Fine, I'm always compliant. But during the taxi, ect, when I always focus on where the emergency exits are and how to get out, perhaps helping others -- not relying on same likely panicked FA's, all of us are subjected to AC's non stop advertising on the screen. Loud. Yeah, that's safety first. Not.

Guy across from me, and others, shoes off. Completely dumb. No policy on that, which is far worse than my Bose which I can hear everything.

Yep, as long as I can hear the advertising non stop blasted at me --my question is, how does full volume advertising, just before takeoff, (which No Other airline that I've flown recently does) -- help safety?

AC is making lots of money cost cutting. Don't tell me that isn't at the expense of safety, too ---

I guess it's just good that you are there to take care of everything because of the "likely panicked FAs".

[727driver]

I totally agree with you rookie however this is a directive from TC cabin safety division. All the FA was doing was enforcing a stupid rule. If you paid attention to the cabin safety briefing you would have heard the standard "only earbud devices connected to the aircraft entertainment system is allowed for take off and landing." Pretty standard TC safety stuff.

[rookiepilot]

Question for the Air Canada cheerleaders, that contrary to evidence, seem to think AC is both the safest and most polite airline in the world.

I just completed a long, multi segment trip as a pax. One business, rest economy, last premium economy with AC. On this last flight they made me take off my cordless Bose, while still parked at the gate. First time on any airline I've ever been asked to do this, including AC.

I politely questioned this, and got a snotty answer (it's safety!). What else would one expect -- it's AC.

Fine, I'm always compliant. But during the taxi, ect, when I always focus on where the emergency exits are and how to get out, perhaps helping others -- not relying on same likely panicked FA's, all of us are subjected to AC's non stop advertising on the screen. Loud. Yeah, that's safety first. Not.

Guy across from me, and others, shoes off. Completely dumb. No policy on that, which is far worse than my Bose which I can hear everything.

Yep, as long as I can hear the advertising non stop blasted at me --my question is, how does full volume advertising, just before takeoff, (which No Other airline that I've flown recently does) -- help safety?

AC is making lots of money cost cutting. Don't tell me that isn't at the expense of safety, too ---

I guess it's just good that you are there to take care of everything because of the "likely panicked FAs".

You're claiming they never do? Plenty of evidence to the contrary. Of course some AC FA's would have trouble getting out the emergency door.

Guys if you're going to cheerlead the hard landing company, at least use some logic....

[MCB]

Question for the Air Canada cheerleaders, that contrary to evidence, seem to think AC is both the safest and most polite airline in the world.

I just completed a long, multi segment trip as a pax. One business, rest economy, last premium economy with AC. On this last flight they made me take off my cordless Bose, while still parked at the gate. First time on any airline I've ever been asked to do this, including AC.

I politely questioned this, and got a snotty answer (it's safety!). What else would one expect -- it's AC.

Fine, I'm always compliant. But during the taxi, ect, when I always focus on where the emergency exits are and how to get out, perhaps helping others -- not relying on same likely panicked FA's, all of us are subjected to AC's non stop advertising on the screen. Loud. Yeah, that's safety first. Not.

Guy across from me, and others, shoes off. Completely dumb. No policy on that, which is far worse than my Bose which I can hear everything.

Yep, as long as I can hear the advertising non stop blasted at me --my question is, how does full volume advertising, just before takeoff, (which No Other airline that I've flown recently does) -- help safety?

AC is making lots of money cost cutting. Don't tell me that isn't at the expense of safety, too ---

I guess it's just good that you are there to take care of everything because of the "likely panicked FAs".

You're claiming they never do? Plenty of evidence to the contrary. Of course some AC FA's would have trouble getting out the emergency door.

Guys if you're going to cheerlead the hard landing company, at least use some logic....

What's wrong with you?

[rookiepilot]

I totally agree with you rookie however this is a directive from TC cabin safety division. All the FA was doing was enforcing a stupid rule. If you paid attention to the cabin safety briefing you would have heard the standard "only earbud devices connected to the aircraft entertainment system is allowed for take off and landing." Pretty standard TC safety stuff.

Actually that's the thing. That phrase isn't consistently used, rules and regs are completely inconsistent. Mine was cordless and not even tuned to anything. Whatever.

I find it interesting how loud advertising and no shoes are supposed to enhance safety, but anyway....

[True North]

You're claiming they never do? Plenty of evidence to the contrary. Of course some AC FA's would have trouble getting out the emergency door.

Guys if you're going to cheerlead the hard landing company, at least use some logic....

Please do enlighten us.

[Kejidog]

Maybe the solution would be surveillance cameras running on all flights. It would make pax and Crew behave. It would clear the he said she said. And we all could edit the parts we want to support our point.

Wouldn't that be great?

[TeePeeCreeper]

You're claiming they never do? Plenty of evidence to the contrary. Of course some AC FA's would have trouble getting out the emergency door.

Good rant. I was all for it until you admonished someone in regards to their weight. Having read your previous posts over the years, I think what I quoted you to say is beneath you.

[complexintentions]

I didn't hear him admonish anyone at all, only make a perfectly accurate observation.

Oh right I forgot for a second, daring to mention weight is either "fat-shaming" or "hate speech". I forget which? And of course it isn't like there aren't a few pilots who ain't going out the cockpit window in an evacuation. There, now everyone gets to be a victim.

I'm all for safety but hiding behind it as a catch-all excuse is just lazy and gets done a lot.

I suppose now lazy people will be after me for lazy-shaming them. Fortunately, they probably won't bother to make the effort to protest.