How do you deal with...

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CanadianPilotQc
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How do you deal with...

#1 Post by CanadianPilotQc » Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:56 pm

did you ever had to fly with a captain that you don't personnally like: always negative, irritated.. no patience.
Felt that this kind of energy can transmitted to you, and makes the day 10x longer.. for sure you have to follow Sop's but how do you personally deal with that?

comments are welcome
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eyebrow737
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Re: How do you deal with...

#2 Post by eyebrow737 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:22 pm

Everyone has had a captain (or FO) that for whatever reason personalities or characters conflict. Key thing is don't take it personally - try not to let the other person effect your outlook on things. Also remember that it might not be about you, the person might be having all sorts of problems in their life and we all deal with it differently. Of course professionalism dictates we shouldn't be bringing that into the cockpit but we are all human.

As an FO, sometimes one has to keep things smooth by just letting it go - take it as a learning experience for when you are a captain on the effect you have on others and what not to do.

Here's a good article on the subject.

http://www.willflyforfood.com/blog/2011 ... r-captain/
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FOD
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Re: How do you deal with...

#3 Post by FOD » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:00 pm

Hmm... the above answer is obsolete... it's so.... 2011.
Sounds like your company doesn't do enough CRM training. Talk to the HR department, suggest a comprehensive review of the CRM curriculum at your company. Be pro-active, ask them to add more content on hazardous attitudes and professionalism. For good measure, if you have a union, be sure to consult with them about the possibility of having had your rights violated. You shouldn't be made to suffer in this manner. Whatever you do, be sure to go straight to the top and avoid trying to solve the problem yourself with your words. If you get no help, gather some other 'victims' of this Captain and start rumours of him being a bully, a sexist, maybe even a racist, depending on your complexion. Everyone one you work with will thank you for taking the lead in modernizing the conflict resolution process at your company. No one will ever be 'not patient' or 'negative' around you again.

or,

you state that YOU personally don't like him/her. The problem lies with YOU and your feelings. It's up to you to bridge the gap. He/she probably is from the real world and doesn't care about your feelings. Alternatively, realize that now that you are working in the real world, not everybody is going to love you for who you are. Deal with it using your words.

Oh and definitely solicit the help of the reasonable folks at AVCANADA to solve your problems for you. Haha, the internet fixes everything!

Best of luck.

FOD
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C.W.E.
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Re: How do you deal with...

#4 Post by C.W.E. » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:13 pm

Personality conflicts in an airplane can degrade safety and should not be allowed to continue.

One simple solution would be to not schedule the two people on the same flights.

If the person complaining has the same problem with another pilot.....hmmmm.
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Victory
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Re: How do you deal with...

#5 Post by Victory » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:24 pm

What if there are 5 pilots at the company and the HR department consists of the hangar cat?
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upnatem
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Re: How do you deal with...

#6 Post by upnatem » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:30 pm

FOD wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:00 pm
Deal with it using your words.
Funny stuff FOD. :D Sounds like what what parents have to say to pre-schoolers. The rapid advancement going on today with little or no seasoning for kids right out of high-school is only going to make it better, I'm sure.
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C.W.E.
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Re: How do you deal with...

#7 Post by C.W.E. » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:33 pm

What if there are 5 pilots at the company and the HR department consists of the hangar cat?
Then it is up to the accountable executive / chief pilot to solve the problem.
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FOD
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Re: How do you deal with...

#8 Post by FOD » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:44 pm

You should have learned this i training.
AVIATE NAVIGATE COMMUNICATE

Adhere to the sop, and fly the damn plane, not every day is going to be a fun day. You are new to this, you are going to have to learn and develop interpersonal skills. Read some intelligent books not authored by celebrities, for god sake please do not believe everything you find on the (cringing to say it) social media (i #@$@# hate that word) and take every new 'problem' that you encounter such as this as an opportunity to better hone your own skills to become super captain when you have the magic (insert woefully low experience hours here) to upgrade to your own command. You have an enormous responsibility in Canada's current aviation environment, you don't yet know what you think you know, and you'd be best to observe every good and bad quality you can from everyone you can before you get thrown into the heat of the battle yourself.

Best of Luck. Remember, you are an aviator, so aviate.

FOD
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valleyboy
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Re: How do you deal with...

#9 Post by valleyboy » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:13 am

I have been CRM'd to death right from the time it was in it's infancy. What I have found it that the people who embrace the concept don't need it, they get it and those who poopoo it are in very bad need of accepting it's concepts. They actually understand it but ego usually trumps brain power.

The total irony is that I don't think that CRM has accomplished what was intended. No amount of training and information will change an arrogant, insecure pilot. It is, unfortunately, alive and well and I see it with 800 hour wonders who should know better. We should all know better but as always human factors is the biggest weakness in all things.

How does one deal with it. That is the on going problem. The one thing is to remove the personal issues. Don't sit there with a lip on. Do your job. Not letting you have your turn or just having you jerk the gear is captain's prerogative. This is no basis for running to superiors but if there are safety issues it's your responsibility to make sure the issue is addressed. How you do this requires some planning and forethought. Guns blazing usually backfires.

Chief Pilots are very reluctant to use preferential scheduling in small to intermediate size airlines. It just produces a scheduling nightmare.

Remember, it always takes 2 to tango, make sure your side of the flight deck is in order before you start throwing stones. Investigations always look at both sides and unless there contributing factors, such as alcohol, mental issues, family problems and such there will be fault found on both sides. If you are the only guy who has this issue with an individual that should give you a clue.

Safety is paramount but witch hunts are caustic.
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valleyboy
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Re: How do you deal with...

#10 Post by valleyboy » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:13 am

aaaaaa
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Last edited by valleyboy on Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

fish4life
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Re: How do you deal with...

#11 Post by fish4life » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:25 am

Victory wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:24 pm
What if there are 5 pilots at the company and the HR department consists of the hangar cat?
Each person holds a bag of cat treats, who the cat chooses wins haha

But seriously sometimes I work with someone I have nothing and I mean nothing in common with. I won’t be rude but pretty early on in a pairing it is obvious we don’t have anything to talk about I’ll just Bluetooth some music on low and keep it to the necessary SOP calls.
If this is the case well maybe you just have different interests, it’s not that the person doesn’t like you it but maybe they’d just rather not talk to you about why southern Ontario is such a great place because they think it’s a dump and would rather be on a boat somewhere.
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B208
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Re: How do you deal with...

#12 Post by B208 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:30 am

FOD, are you perchance the Capt about which the OP was talking? :smt040

CanadianPilotQc,
If the Capt is sticking to SOPs, their attitude is not compromising safety, and they are not being abusive then you just have to suck it up. Not everybody is pleasant to work with and not everyday at work is fun; grit your teeth and get through it.
If the Capt is significantly deviating from SOPs, or his attitude is compromising safety, or he is being abusive then you should act. Try and resolve the problem at the lowest level; i.e. "Sir, that's not SOP", "Sir, your discussion of how much management sucks is distracting me from doing the job", "Sir, I know that I dipped below MDA, but calling me a pile of wormy gazelle shite is unwarranted." If you can't resolve it at your level, then kick it one notch higher until you get it resolved, (Chief Pilot, SMS person, etc...). A word of caution, do an in depth gut check to make sure you are not the problem before you involve management; No supervisor likes having a plate of worms like this dumped in front of them and they are likely to take a dim view of someone who does so frivolously.
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Re: How do you deal with...

#13 Post by co-joe » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:14 am

Had one guy I worked with who was a constant condescending prick. I feel like I did my best, but it was never enough. Then one day I overheard him talking to another guy and it turns out his life seemed to be falling apart. Baby in the house crying all night every night, him and new wife fighting and on the verge of splitting. From then on I just felt sorry for him every time he was an A Hole to me. Knowing this made it a lot easier to deal with. Now I just assume people are going through BS at home and bringing it with them and it makes it easier to just avoid conflict.

Not the tell me about a time when answer, but usually it isn't you, it really is just them...usually. It could be you. You could be the problem. ha ha ha
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Re: How do you deal with...

#14 Post by Rowdy » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:31 pm

If you're in the right seat, try this out... Everyone you fly with for a year.. write down the things you like and the things you don't like about the way they operate or interact in the work environment. You don't have to name them. Just keep a log. Good and bad.

When you get into the left seat, go back and read those notes. Do the things the guys you enjoyed working with did and remember the things the guys you didn't, and don't do them!

I still have all my early notes.. some pretty great reminders in there. One particular captain from many moons ago still stands out as the BIGGEST d-bag I've ever had to work with. Guess what? He taught me a pile of things. More than any of the others I liked. Not surprisingly it was mostly what NOT to do.

If you're at one of the majors, use your sick time appropriately. Its there so you don't go to work and jeopardize safety. Which can include working with someone that totally puts you in a shit mind set. I know another dude that has an incredibly high crew book off rate. You gotta know in this data driven time, that the company is WELL aware.

If they're just lame? Suck it up. It is still 'work' and not play time.
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Re: How do you deal with...

#15 Post by cdnpilot77 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:24 am

valleyboy wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:13 am
aaaaaa

Love your Trudeau impression.....spot on!!
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northernpilot2
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Re: How do you deal with...

#16 Post by northernpilot2 » Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:51 am

Aah yes Ive delt with a few in the past. As an FO the hardest part of the job is getting used to flying with different captains as each do different things. That's why there are SOP's in the first place, but sometimes they are not followed properly.

The bottom line is: Never allow the captain to do anything dangerous, and vice versa (captain to FO).

And my personal message to captains and FO''s -> If you prefer to stay quiet in cruise, not talk about anything, or simply ignore your peer until checklist time, then your not just boring, but your also dick captain/FO. On the other hand, if you like to engage in discussions during the cruise portion and enjoy the flight, then your a great captain/FO. Of course, you should never get distracted from flying/radio calls etc.
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