Free Money Management Advice.

This forum has been developed to discuss aviation related topics.

Moderators: ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog

Message
Author
User avatar
rookiepilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 884
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:50 pm

Free Money Management Advice.

#1 Post by rookiepilot » Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:18 pm

No one talks about this stuff. I'll give it a shot, it's kinda my world.

Now, first, this is worth about what you're paying for it. I'm not an advisor in any way, and not looking to be anyone's.
Second, I'm a random internet troll, without a degree, so keep that in context -- :mrgreen:

With that, here a few words, food for discussion, that might be helpful for young or not so young pilots, that might be helpful during this time of plenty.

If no use to you, just ignore, and good for you for having it figured out. Really.

1. I suggest banking a lot of that dough you're hauling in. Don't buy the 80 K pickup, don't go nuts on a boat, bank it.

Pay down the mortgage, credit cards, whatever. Prepare for the lean times ahead -- which aren't THAT far ahead as you might think today -- if I'm reading things even halfway right. I might be wrong. But even so, the path to financial security is built on the back if eliminating unproductive consumer debt.

2. Buy used.

I love to buy used cars -- 3 years old, barely broken in, that some other dope has turned back in off a lease return. I've done it several times. Half price. Pay cash if you can. Debt is the enemy. Boats, whatever too. Used, used used. Nothing depreciates faster than a boat, from what I'm told.

3. Work like an absolute dog now, and rack up the OT. You make hay when the sun shines. Bank the money. It won't always be like this. Don't invest it until you learn how. Note: Your friendly financial advisor, almost certainly doesn't know how. Trust me on this.

4. Focus on building equity, at the right price, not accumulating consumer things.

Learn some principles of the great investors, read what they write, become a student for your retirement and financial future. Your financial advisor is a salesperson. Doesn't likely have a clue, and cares about as much as I do what happens to you. Likely.

The only one who really cares enough, will be you. So some personal study is required, in my view. Maybe you are one of the few with a great advisor -- you can do nothing but good, still, by educating yourself. Yes, it is possible.
There are many styles. I personally look at what is least popular, and take a good look to see if that creates value.

5. Freedom from debt means personal freedom, and the ability to make quality life choices. Make this a goal.

That's it. Back to England - Columbia :smt040
---------- ADS -----------
  

tbaylx
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 637
Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2004 6:30 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#2 Post by tbaylx » Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:53 pm

I'd add to spend time reading about financial management. Nothing beats self managed low cost ETF investing.

The greater Fool is a daily blog run by an investment adviser Garth Turner and has a wealth of free advise in a humorous, entertaining to read format.

http://www.greaterfool.ca/
---------- ADS -----------
  

Lightchop
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 140
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 10:03 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#3 Post by Lightchop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:04 pm

You mean I can't just buy a bunch of bitcoin and cannabis stocks and expect to retire in a few years?

Shucks.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
rookiepilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 884
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:50 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#4 Post by rookiepilot » Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:31 pm

Lightchop wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:04 pm
You mean I can't just buy a bunch of bitcoin and cannabis stocks and expect to retire in a few years?

Shucks.
Seriously, whatever you feel you have a strong understanding or competence in can be a candidate as a principle, that's greater than the typical joe.

That might be different for each person depending on background, location, and professional experience. It's not a one size all fits answer, IMO.

The key is don't be the fool at the poker table. And the old saying, if you look around and can't spot the fool, you're it ----
---------- ADS -----------
  
Last edited by rookiepilot on Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Lightchop
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 140
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 10:03 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#5 Post by Lightchop » Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:38 pm

I've actually done pretty well with both over the last 2 years or so. Closely watching the cannabis market right now, given the recent news. I'm out of all crypto, it was a good ride but I think my money is better invested elsewhere.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Bede
Rank 10
Rank 10
Posts: 2964
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 5:52 am
Contact:

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#6 Post by Bede » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:33 pm

This is good advice. Thanks for sharing. The biggest issue that I see is that far too many people want toys and are willing to add minimum monthly payment to their budget to get the toys.

There are a few points that I slightly disagree with.
1) Work OT. That's a good point, but right now my kids are young and I'm on track financially so why work so hard, giving half my money to the government, when I can work a few extra years (I can still retire well before 65 at this rate) if I need to.
2) Debt. We live pretty frugally and have little debt. I want an airplane. I'm going to put it on my LoC (house is paid off). The plane is unlikely to depreciate and if I need to I can sell. However, I don't want to wait 5 years and pay for it in cash when I can invest that money instead. What are your thoughts on this?
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
rookiepilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 884
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:50 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#7 Post by rookiepilot » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:06 pm

Bede wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:33 pm
This is good advice. Thanks for sharing. The biggest issue that I see is that far too many people want toys and are willing to add minimum monthly payment to their budget to get the toys.

There are a few points that I slightly disagree with.
1) Work OT. That's a good point, but right now my kids are young and I'm on track financially so why work so hard, giving half my money to the government, when I can work a few extra years (I can still retire well before 65 at this rate) if I need to.
2) Debt. We live pretty frugally and have little debt. I want an airplane. I'm going to put it on my LoC (house is paid off). The plane is unlikely to depreciate and if I need to I can sell. However, I don't want to wait 5 years and pay for it in cash when I can invest that money instead. What are your thoughts on this?
Sure. I think a (used) plane, if bought wisely, can be much better than a (new) boat. I'm no expert, just commenting on the massive depreciation on new toys of all kinds. It's obviously all (my advice) in the total context of ones personal situation, your budget Ect. Ect. House paid off -- awesome. Very rare.

I hate debt, so it's driven some of my decisions. Maybe it's a personal bias. I never wanted to be owned by a bloodsucking bank.

Good point on OT, and kids are young, once. I'm thinking of younger folks who might get laid off in the next recession. It's a tough, and very personal call.
---------- ADS -----------
  

cncpc
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1255
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 10:17 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#8 Post by cncpc » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:58 pm

rookiepilot wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:18 pm
No one talks about this stuff. I'll give it a shot, it's kinda my world.

Now, first, this is worth about what you're paying for it. I'm not an advisor in any way, and not looking to be anyone's.
Second, I'm a random internet troll, without a degree, so keep that in context -- :mrgreen:

With that, here a few words, food for discussion, that might be helpful for young or not so young pilots, that might be helpful during this time of plenty.

If no use to you, just ignore, and good for you for having it figured out. Really.

1. I suggest banking a lot of that dough you're hauling in. Don't buy the 80 K pickup, don't go nuts on a boat, bank it.

Pay down the mortgage, credit cards, whatever. Prepare for the lean times ahead -- which aren't THAT far ahead as you might think today -- if I'm reading things even halfway right. I might be wrong. But even so, the path to financial security is built on the back if eliminating unproductive consumer debt.

2. Buy used.

I love to buy used cars -- 3 years old, barely broken in, that some other dope has turned back in off a lease return. I've done it several times. Half price. Pay cash if you can. Debt is the enemy. Boats, whatever too. Used, used used. Nothing depreciates faster than a boat, from what I'm told.

3. Work like an absolute dog now, and rack up the OT. You make hay when the sun shines. Bank the money. It won't always be like this. Don't invest it until you learn how. Note: Your friendly financial advisor, almost certainly doesn't know how. Trust me on this.

4. Focus on building equity, at the right price, not accumulating consumer things.

Learn some principles of the great investors, read what they write, become a student for your retirement and financial future. Your financial advisor is a salesperson. Doesn't likely have a clue, and cares about as much as I do what happens to you. Likely.

The only one who really cares enough, will be you. So some personal study is required, in my view. Maybe you are one of the few with a great advisor -- you can do nothing but good, still, by educating yourself. Yes, it is possible.
There are many styles. I personally look at what is least popular, and take a good look to see if that creates value.

5. Freedom from debt means personal freedom, and the ability to make quality life choices. Make this a goal.

That's it. Back to England - Columbia :smt040
That is actually very good advice.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Good judgment comes from experience. Experience often comes from bad judgment.

co-joe
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 3233
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 2:33 am
Location: YYC 230 degree radial at about 10 DME

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#9 Post by co-joe » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:03 pm

Any advice on the Bouillon market?s Gold and Silver are so cheap right now they're nearing mining and refining cost. Have been looking into owning physical metals in my RSPs in addition to ETFs as sort of a hedge against the various bubbles that all seem to be bloating at the same time...
---------- ADS -----------
  

helicopterray
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 208
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:59 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#10 Post by helicopterray » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:33 pm

Bede wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:33 pm

1) Work OT. That's a good point, but right now my kids are young and I'm on track financially so why work so hard, giving half my money to the government,
I would like to point out that we have a progressive tax rate in Canada, and I don't believe anyone in aviation is ever going to be paying 'half their money' to the government.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
rookiepilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 884
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:50 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#11 Post by rookiepilot » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:37 pm

co-joe wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:03 pm
Any advice on the Bouillon market?s Gold and Silver are so cheap right now they're nearing mining and refining cost. Have been looking into owning physical metals in my RSPs in addition to ETFs as sort of a hedge against the various bubbles that all seem to be bloating at the same time...
This is a good question with a multi part answer. Again, part of the answer, which applies to any investment asset, is your knowledge base, risk tolerance, goals, and time to study of this asset.

Now -- the other part -- gold is a tough asset to value. All of it ever mined still exists, it's worth what sentiment would deem its worth. It's unproductive, pays no dividend. (Bitcoin is worse in my view -- I don't claim to understand it)

Gold is interesting here to me, as a small percentage, because it's washed out and there isn't that much interest. Small means 5-10% in my view.

Sometimes cash is the best hedge of all if you're concerned about bubbles. Consider things like not having all investments in Canada, if you work in Canada and have a house here.

Embrace the USA.
---------- ADS -----------
  

digits_
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1442
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:26 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#12 Post by digits_ » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:41 pm

helicopterray wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:33 pm
Bede wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:33 pm

1) Work OT. That's a good point, but right now my kids are young and I'm on track financially so why work so hard, giving half my money to the government,
I would like to point out that we have a progressive tax rate in Canada, and I don't believe anyone in aviation is ever going to be paying 'half their money' to the government.
You'd probably be in the top bracket for the overtime money, so from the overtime money, you might have to give 40-50% away to the government.
---------- ADS -----------
  

digits_
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1442
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:26 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#13 Post by digits_ » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:44 pm

Bede wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:33 pm

2) Debt. We live pretty frugally and have little debt. I want an airplane. I'm going to put it on my LoC (house is paid off). The plane is unlikely to depreciate and if I need to I can sell. However, I don't want to wait 5 years and pay for it in cash when I can invest that money instead. What are your thoughts on this?
The "danger" with that is: what if you by a 60k airplane and the eninge craps out and you need a 35k overhaul? Now you'll either have to loan more, or pay off an airplane that you don't fly anymore. Psychologically speaking, that can be pretty tough.

On the other hand, if you buy a 250k airplane that needs a 35k overhaul, it would probably be easier to swallow :wink:
---------- ADS -----------
  

Eric Janson
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 638
Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:44 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#14 Post by Eric Janson » Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:37 pm

Pilots are the worst Investors. Great to use as a contrarian indicator.

A nice simple strategy:-

Buy whatever Pilots are selling.

Sell whatever Pilots are buying.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Always fly a stable approach - it's the only stability you'll find in this business

ahramin
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5570
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#15 Post by ahramin » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:31 pm

co-joe wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:03 pm
Any advice on the Bouillon market?s
Now that I can help you with. I start by frying an onion and a few carrots and celery sticks in olive oil. As soon as they are browned then throw in your leftover bones and add just enough boiling water to cover everything. Boil an hour then cool overnight. Skim the fat off the top, strain the rest and use that day or freeze for later.
---------- ADS -----------
  

ShawnR
Rank 1
Rank 1
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:28 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#16 Post by ShawnR » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:42 pm

A lot of good advice in this thread! I was speaking with a coworker a couple of years ago and he was telling me how he had just renewed his mortgage with monthly payments so that he would have more money each month.... :rolleyes: (I wanted the head banging on wall smily but could not find it...) In explaining it to him, he asked me,...."What is a principal?"

I was more disappointed in the banker he dealt with that allowed this.....!

I grabbed a couple of on line mortgage calculators and showed him the difference in how accelerated weekly payments versus monthly payments works, etc...and I think he went back and was able to renegotiate.

In that conversation I used the term as rookiepilot put, "debt is the enemy" although I used principal. (and I thought I had an original thought! :-) )

Nice to read this info....I work with a lot of young people and seeing what they drive or how they live, debt is an accepted way of life these days...kind of sad.

In my opinion, Some debt is good/necessary, max is bad, managed and justified is life/living....

Just my 2 cents...

Cheers,
Shawn
---------- ADS -----------
  

AuxBatOn
Rank 10
Rank 10
Posts: 2892
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:13 pm
Location: North America, sometimes

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#17 Post by AuxBatOn » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm

Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Going for the deck at corner

User avatar
short bus
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 511
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:57 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#18 Post by short bus » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:36 pm

Colombia should have won that game
---------- ADS -----------
  

TT1900
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue May 15, 2018 8:19 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#19 Post by TT1900 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:54 pm

AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm
Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.
Spoken like a man with a guaranteed six-figure job and as close to rock-solid pension as possible. Not to mention a bunch of second career options upon leaving the employ of "the man", while collecting aforementioned pension.
---------- ADS -----------
  

AuxBatOn
Rank 10
Rank 10
Posts: 2892
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:13 pm
Location: North America, sometimes

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#20 Post by AuxBatOn » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:00 pm

TT1900 wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:54 pm
AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm
Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.
Spoken like a man with a guaranteed six-figure job and as close to rock-solid pension as possible. Not to mention a bunch of second career options upon leaving the employ of "the man", while collecting aforementioned pension.
I always lived that way. Even before I made north of 100K I find balance in life is key to sanity...
---------- ADS -----------
  
Going for the deck at corner

TT1900
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue May 15, 2018 8:19 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#21 Post by TT1900 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:27 pm

AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:00 pm
TT1900 wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:54 pm
AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm
Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.
Spoken like a man with a guaranteed six-figure job and as close to rock-solid pension as possible. Not to mention a bunch of second career options upon leaving the employ of "the man", while collecting aforementioned pension.
I always lived that way. Even before I made north of 100K I find balance in life is key to sanity...
Fair enough and I don't disagree. My point was it's easy to say things like that from a strong position, where moving backwards financially is improbable, when it may not be the best path for others.

I don't think the advice was saying don't enjoy life, but enjoy in moderation because leaner times are coming.
---------- ADS -----------
  

co-joe
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 3233
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 2:33 am
Location: YYC 230 degree radial at about 10 DME

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#22 Post by co-joe » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:30 pm

ahramin wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:31 pm
co-joe wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:03 pm
Any advice on the Bouillon market?s
Now that I can help you with. I start by frying an onion and a few carrots and celery sticks in olive oil. As soon as they are browned then throw in your leftover bones and add just enough boiling water to cover everything. Boil an hour then cool overnight. Skim the fat off the top, strain the rest and use that day or freeze for later.

Great advice. I totally spelled bullion wrong. lol My GF always has some great broth in the freezer too.
Gold is interesting here to me, as a small percentage, because it's washed out and there isn't that much interest. Small means 5-10% in my view.
rookiepilot, are you talking 5-10 of one's total portfolio invested in precious metals?
---------- ADS -----------
  

RVR6000
Rank 5
Rank 5
Posts: 361
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 7:25 pm

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#23 Post by RVR6000 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:17 am

Some really good advise. I will add that avoid credit card debt at all cost, understand how compounding interest works.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Old fella
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1736
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 7:04 am

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#24 Post by Old fella » Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:35 am

AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm
Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.

Hovering close to my 70 year of existence,that has been kinda my philosophy. If you haven’t yet, you will be blindsided on a Wednesday afternoon by some event. I am not a wealthy person, far from it actually but have enough to keep the wolf from the door so to speak. Financial mistakes made- you bet, could I have been better off heeding some of the advise presented by the rookie guy, undoubtedly. Nevertheless here I(we) are and indeed giving thanks for what I have, not could have/might have been. Going forward(what’s left of my living days) and looking back on, I can honestly say I have a lot more to be happy/thankful for than to be pissed off about. Good life and family memories, for sure and indeed and trying not to think about/dwell on, that 45 yr old who has been diagnosed with ALS.

Cheers
:drinkers:
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Bede
Rank 10
Rank 10
Posts: 2964
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 5:52 am
Contact:

Re: Free Money Management Advice.

#25 Post by Bede » Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:46 am

AuxBatOn wrote:
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:33 pm
Or just use some of the money you are making to enjoy life now for you and your family. You won’t be in your 30s/40s forever. Money isn’t everything.
Not that this applies to you, but whenever I have heard this in the past, it's from someone leveraged to the max, making minimum payments on their boat, truck and ATV. Eventually they get old and the tank is empty. Their kids won't help because they learned their money management skills from their parents. Then those of us who were frugal with our money, earning passive income see our taxes go up because we need to "Save our Seniors".

Sorry if this sounds like an attack on you- it wasn't meant to be directed at you personally.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Post Reply

Return to “General Comments”