SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

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AirCanuck
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SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by AirCanuck »

Hello all,

So I see from the TC study guide that i should bring a calculator, pencil, ruler, protractor, flight computer (I'll just bring my wiz wheel, never used an electronic one).

However, what do they provide?

Do you get a CAP GEN? A CFS? curious what cover material I'll have access to. If a CAP GEN is provided, that eliminates a TON of memorization I was planning on doing for certain things (approach bans, etc).

Thanks for all the help lately folks. Keeping me out of the study panic tailspin :mrgreen:
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Cessna 180
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by Cessna 180 »

I'd highly recommend you buy or borrow a CX3 or a CX2 or a Sporty's version (cheaper) as a number of calculations it does cannot be done easily on a wizz-wheel and there will be extra math for you to remember. Mach number comes to mind. t's not as pertinent for the Commercial or the Private, but it helps immensely for the ATP.
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AirCanuck
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by AirCanuck »

thnks, I am going to borrow one, my buddy advised me the same today
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AirCanuck
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by AirCanuck »

Cessna 180 wrote:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:04 pm
I'd highly recommend you buy or borrow a CX3 or a CX2 or a Sporty's version (cheaper) as a number of calculations it does cannot be done easily on a wizz-wheel and there will be extra math for you to remember. Mach number comes to mind. t's not as pertinent for the Commercial or the Private, but it helps immensely for the ATP.
would a CX-1 do?
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455tt
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by 455tt »

The CX-1A will be just fine and is approved by TC for use on the writtens.

A big benefit to the electronic computers is they automatically compensate for temperature rise and compressibility error.

As well, they are easier to use and more accurate for the other calculations as well.

But one of the more weird things is that the standard electronic computers (i.e. ASA) can't be used for true altitude calculations for which you will have to use the true altitude formula or an E6B.

So bring both your electronic and your E6B to the written.
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AirCanuck
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by AirCanuck »

455tt wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 2:31 pm
The CX-1A will be just fine and is approved by TC for use on the writtens.

A big benefit to the electronic computers is they automatically compensate for temperature rise and compressibility error.

As well, they are easier to use and more accurate for the other calculations as well.

But one of the more weird things is that the standard electronic computers (i.e. ASA) can't be used for true altitude calculations for which you will have to use the true altitude formula or an E6B.

So bring both your electronic and your E6B to the written.
Hmm, good catch. I've been through all 650 q's from the aerocourse book and TALT never came up. In what context do you think it would? Just an arbitrary "calculate the TAlt"?
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Lightchop
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by Lightchop »

Yes, highly highly recommend a CX2 or similar. It will make your life so much easier as will knowing all the formulas inside out.
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yhz41
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by yhz41 »

I just wrote both the samra and saron and true alt never came up luckily
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455tt
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by 455tt »

AirCanuck wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:44 pm
455tt wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 2:31 pm
The CX-1A will be just fine and is approved by TC for use on the writtens.

A big benefit to the electronic computers is they automatically compensate for temperature rise and compressibility error.

As well, they are easier to use and more accurate for the other calculations as well.

But one of the more weird things is that the standard electronic computers (i.e. ASA) can't be used for true altitude calculations for which you will have to use the true altitude formula or an E6B.

So bring both your electronic and your E6B to the written.
Hmm, good catch. I've been through all 650 q's from the aerocourse book and TALT never came up. In what context do you think it would? Just an arbitrary "calculate the TAlt"?
True altitude typically comes in this context: "You are approaching a ridge of _______ ft ASL with the OAT of ____ degrees C and your indicated altitude is _______ ft ASL. The ground elevation at a local weather station is _______ ft ASL where the current altimeter is _____ " Hg. Under these conditions, you will clear the ridge by _____ ft." This is a pretty standard ATPL level subject as per the current TC ATPL Study and Reference Guide so I would recommend learning this regardless of whether you came across it in the question set you are studying from. You can easily solve with an E6B using the "true altitude" window, just be sure you input pressure altitude and apply the "air column" height for greater accuracy. See the current TC AIM at AIR 1.5.4 for full details. Or you can use the formula for true altitude in the ACWM if you prefer.
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Malfunction
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by Malfunction »

Can you post the formula here ?
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youhavecontrol
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by youhavecontrol »

I wrote both of them a month ago. I used the Jeppesen CR-3 whiz wheel and a basic calculator. No problems at all with the calculations. True Alt, True Airspeed, Mach Number. Just review the whiz wheel manual and practice a few times and you're golden. If you know how to use it well, for some things it's faster than an electronic calculator.
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C-GKNT
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by C-GKNT »

I couldn't find an electronic calculator to borrow and I wasn't going to buy one just for the exam so I just used the trusty wiz wheel.

Warning if using a wiz wheel. Some of the speeds were "out of bounds" for the ground speed/true heading calculations (i.e. the values were too large). The solution is to divide all speeds by 2, work out the numbers and then multiply by 2 to finish the problem.

Glenn
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455tt
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Re: SAMRA/SARON - materials provided?

Post by 455tt »

Malfunction wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 2:10 am
Can you post the formula here ?
Sure:

True Altitude = [Indicated altitude - ground elevation/1,000] X [Difference between actual temperature and ISA temperature for cruising altitude] X 4 feet = altitude to deduct from indicated altitude
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