Nationair Crash & Website

This forum has been developed to discuss aviation related topics.

Moderators: ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog

Message
Author
...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

Nationair Crash & Website

#1 Post by ... » Tue Jun 08, 2004 8:55 pm

July 11 1991 where 14 Canadian crew members and friends of mine, were killed. Along with 247 passengers during a Mecca sub-contract run. You may have seen the investigation on the "Forbidden Places" show.

The owner of the airline was (is) an animal. I am going easy because I don't want to be banned from this site, or have the owner of Avcanada sued. Like others, we have the real story that was not shown on TV because of the legal complications. The inside scoop if you will. I still don't know if it is possible to speak of it. Cat Driver may me advise me remain silent.

Birddog was supposed to be on that crew, but I refused because I did not have my shots. Funny how things are. Having a hard time to this day realizing my turn of fate.

If there are any other ex, 'NX' people on here I would like to hear from you.

http://www.aircrash.org/burnelli/aw910722.htm

http://www.nationair-canada.com/
---------- ADS -----------
  
Last edited by ... on Sun Jul 09, 2006 10:50 am, edited 5 times in total.

User avatar
gelbisch
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1096
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 5:49 am
Location: Guelph, ON

#2 Post by gelbisch » Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:39 am

thanks for the links, birddog. i didn't know anything about the airline or the accident; that's quite the amazing story. thus far i've been lucky enough to be at fairly reputable companies that are not by any means difficult to work for... it's hard to believe the way some employers treat their people. i guess some folks get blinded by dollar signs and their humanity goes out the window.

it seems that most of us have lost friends in the business... while it does fade, the numbness never really seems to go away. thanks for sharing, birddog.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Mitch Cronin
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 914
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:15 am
Location: Right beside my dog again...

#3 Post by Mitch Cronin » Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:24 am

Hi Birddog.... I didn't work for Nationair, but I did have the misfortune of working on some of their aircraft on a few occasions... We'd been contracted to do some of their DC-8 'B' checks... I've seen airplanes in worse condition, but not any that were still being flown (to my knowledge)... Our managers soon realized what we were in for and the contract was ended fairly swiftly.

The last I saw of any of their machines was after we'd declared one they had just purchased (and wanted us to do a corrosion check on) as being unfit for beer cans.... we pushed it outside and let it sit until a crew showed up to fly it to YUL (unpressurized).... I spoke with that crew and I told them flat out that it was a heap of scrap.... I even suggested that they should seriously reconsider their unpressurized flight, but they continued anyway, laughing off my comments...

I made a point of telling anyone who would listen not to dare set foot in any of those machines..... (and yes, I did read the entire NTSB report)

What makes it worse is that some of that same kind of attitude still exists at some companies!

Sorry for your loss Birddog.... Take comfort in that fluke of fate that kept you away.... your number was clearly not up!

Cheers,
---------- ADS -----------
  
Last edited by Mitch Cronin on Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Cat Driver
Top Poster
Top Poster
Posts: 18921
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:31 pm

#4 Post by Cat Driver » Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:23 am

Birddog :

As long as statements are true you should be safe, however it is usually better to err on the side of caution.

We used to watch the airplanes come and go during the Hajj in Jeddah while we worked on our airplane just off the approach to 34 C.

Some of the junk that came and went was stunning, our favourite was a 747 Classic that was painted a faded white, but we could pick it out from a hundred miles away by two engines that smoked so bad the airport went zero zero when it came and went.

It is OK to fly these junkers on Hajj because if they crash everyone goes to paradise...........except the infidels on board.

Cat
---------- ADS -----------
  
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no


After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.

duplicate2
Rank 5
Rank 5
Posts: 307
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 10:54 am
Location: Limbo

#5 Post by duplicate2 » Wed Jun 09, 2004 1:46 pm

Griffon, is the NTSB or TSB report available on the web? I haven't been able to find it anywhere.
---------- ADS -----------
  

Mitch Cronin
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 914
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:15 am
Location: Right beside my dog again...

#6 Post by Mitch Cronin » Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:30 pm

I don't know duplicate2, It was a hard copy version I read years ago... a very thick file.
---------- ADS -----------
  

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#7 Post by ... » Mon Jul 04, 2005 7:45 am

Bump. :!:
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
DA900
Rank 7
Rank 7
Posts: 705
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2004 3:21 pm
Location: CYYC

#8 Post by DA900 » Mon Jul 04, 2005 12:40 pm

For those who want some information about Nationair here is a good website to visit. It has info on the company, the players, the crash, and the downfall.

http://www.nationair-canada.com/


duplicate2 since NSTB and TSB only assisted and were not the lead investigators they will not have any reports published.
You can try to get the information from the Saudi Arabian Presidency of Civil Aviation as they were the lead investigating team, but the website isn't very helpful.

http://www.pca.gov.sa/index1.2.htm
---------- ADS -----------
  
Rectum, damn near killed 'em

User avatar
Yoyoma
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1467
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 4:01 am
Location: Somewhere in time...

#9 Post by Yoyoma » Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:35 am

What a tragedy. I never knew the details behind it. Just another crash I thought. RIP
---------- ADS -----------
  
Image In the business world, the rearview mirror is always clearer than the windshield...W. Buffett

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#10 Post by ... » Sun Jul 09, 2006 8:36 am

July 11th 2006 marks the 15th anniversary of the crash that claimed my colleague’s lives.

It only seems like yesterday.

There is a memorial tree planted outside of the GTAA admin building (old Wardair building, not the new one in the center of the field).

I am going to try to get there to pay my respects as I’m not in town.

The owner of this site, may have further information for you.

http://www.nationair-canada.com
---------- ADS -----------
  

bmc
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4014
Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 10:06 pm
Location: Switzerland

#11 Post by bmc » Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:26 pm

Kent Davidge (FO) was a friend of mine from my arctic days in Resolute. Aldo Tettamanti (purser) was my replacement when I went on vacation. Aldo and I were with Nordair. For some strange reason, Aldo is listed as a mechanic.

RIP friends
---------- ADS -----------
  
bmc

TITAN
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 4:45 pm
Location: toronto

#12 Post by TITAN » Sun Jul 09, 2006 5:19 pm

" IABD" I flew that airline once CYYZ- LPPT toronto - lisbon I was 15 years old and out of controll when I realized I was going to ride on a 747-200 or a DC-8-63 .. Well it was a 747-200 but I tell you it was the worse flight of my life !.

1st = ( not a safety hazard ) it stunk like shit inside and was completely dirty!!

2nd =( not the companies fault) the weather was crap and we had some MAJOR chops all the way there!!

3rd = 2 washrooms up front ( were I was sitting ) were Gonne and piss water was overflowing on the floor close to my seat !!!!

shortly after that flight 1-2 years the accident occurd !!!

My praiyers go out to those lost and there families!

Oh by the "IABD" I have also visited that "memorial tree"
years ago!!
---------- ADS -----------
  
Most flying is a forward motion mine is doing backstrokes!!!

User avatar
fmrc3ame
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 85
Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 10:53 pm
Location: Currently Far East

#13 Post by fmrc3ame » Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:26 pm

I had the mispleasure of working there for a period of time before and after the crash. I worked with all the crews doing the DnD contract and had a good friendship with Aldo. I was at home the day of the crash and the news came as a great shock. The loss of life was so preventable which is what made this such a horrible event. I wish that no one has to go through this as it was hard to say goodbye to friends and colleagues you had been joking with one day and they were all gone the next. My thoughts go out to all the families who lost a loved one on that fateful day.
---------- ADS -----------
  

bmc
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4014
Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 10:06 pm
Location: Switzerland

#14 Post by bmc » Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:06 am

Some of the Nationair captains ended up in the Persian Gulf, with Kuwait and Gulf Air. I'm trying to remember one of the guys. I knew him when he flew for First Air flying Bell Canada's Twin Otter. His name escapes me at the moment. I bumped into him at Gulf Air's dispatch about five years ago.

Kent Davidge I knew when he flew C-FLFR, Bradley's DC-3, out of Resolute.
---------- ADS -----------
  
bmc

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#15 Post by ... » Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:17 pm

---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Blakey
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 936
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 6:33 pm
Location: Ontario

#16 Post by Blakey » Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:29 pm

Bill Allen was one of the instructors on my first Herc course and he lived just down the road from me. I think of him every time I drive past his house.

Vic Fehr was an engineer on the squadron when I got there. We flew together on many missions.

Both were true gentlemen and very professional airmen. They are still missed here too.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you!

neechi
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 184
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 6:04 pm

#17 Post by neechi » Thu Jul 05, 2007 7:27 am

BD, sorry for you loss.

I revisit these sites every year when you post them. This time I read the quotes section, absoulutly disgusting. I promise you that if I ever hear of any of the management pigs that were quoted are working for a company I am employed with that I will promply arrange for a back alley baseball game.
---------- ADS -----------
  

North Shore
Rank Moderator
Rank Moderator
Posts: 5280
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 3:47 pm
Location: Straight outta Dundarave...

#18 Post by North Shore » Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:46 am

neechi said:
I revisit these sites every year when you post them. This time I read the quotes section, absoulutly disgusting. I promise you that if I ever hear of any of the management pigs that were quoted are working for a company I am employed with that I will promply arrange for a back alley baseball game.
Too, late, methinks...the fox is guarding the henhouse now..
"It wasn't the company's fault!"
former FA turned management - immediately after the crash, before any facts were known. Now works with the Ministry of Transport in Canada, ensuring the safety of the travelling public.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Say, what's that mountain goat doing up here in the mist?

Ass, Licence, Job. In that order.

Mitch Cronin
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 914
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:15 am
Location: Right beside my dog again...

#19 Post by Mitch Cronin » Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:27 am

Wouldn't it be interesting to hear what, if anything, she would say about that quote nowadays.... "It wasn't the company's fault!" eh?

BS it wasn't!

I revisit those pages each time Birddog reminds us also... I don't recall seeing DJC referred to by reg there before, but it sure is sad to hear what a sorry state they let that big beautiful machine get into...though I guess I knew it anyway... When she was ours, she was a very fine aircraft! We kept her in top shape.
---------- ADS -----------
  

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#20 Post by ... » Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:36 pm

North Shore wrote:neechi said:
I revisit these sites every year when you post them. This time I read the quotes section, absoulutly disgusting. I promise you that if I ever hear of any of the management pigs that were quoted are working for a company I am employed with that I will promply arrange for a back alley baseball game.
Too, late, methinks...the fox is guarding the henhouse now..
"It wasn't the company's fault!"
former FA turned management - immediately after the crash, before any facts were known. Now works with the Ministry of Transport in Canada, ensuring the safety of the travelling public.
It would initially seem that on this level of consciousness that the wicked seem to always get away like snakes in the grass.

I expect to see them all on the road to hell. I’ll be the one selling them maps.
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Siddley Hawker
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 3345
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2004 6:56 pm
Location: 50.13N 66.17W

#21 Post by Siddley Hawker » Thu Jul 05, 2007 7:48 pm

Whatever happened to Obladi Obladah anyway? Wasn't he last heard from in Brazil?
---------- ADS -----------
  

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#22 Post by ... » Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:49 pm

Siddley Hawker wrote:Whatever happened to Obladi Obladah anyway? Wasn't he last heard from in Brazil?

"Robert Obadia" as many know his name to be was last heard to be hiding in South America. He was behind a feeble attempt at a start up company that lasted 30 days shortly after Nationair went under. I can't remember if this 2nd company ever did get off the ground.
---------- ADS -----------
  
Last edited by ... on Wed Jul 11, 2007 4:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

#23 Post by ... » Wed Jul 11, 2007 4:13 am

Forever Young

Trapped in the glorious years
within the memory of belief, lost of all grief.
Take the reasons,
which once seemed so clear,
but never mind, you have nothing to fear.
For you my friends will be, forever young,
Forever in the heart of memories.

Lost in the glory of all time,
the wisdom was there within those smiles,
You see you could have told us,
there within lies the mystery.

So shed a smile, and grin a tear,
For you my friends, will be,
Forever young, Forever young.
Forever in the heart of memory,
We see not through or misery.
Forever young, forever young.
There's are new angels tonight.


Until next year folks...everyone have a safe year.

MT
---------- ADS -----------
  

...
Rank 11
Rank 11
Posts: 4582
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 7:18 pm

Re: Nationair Crash & Website

#24 Post by ... » Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:10 am

"Bump"

Thanks for reading.

Kindly visit the website,

http://www.nationair-canada.com
---------- ADS -----------
  

User avatar
Cat Driver
Top Poster
Top Poster
Posts: 18921
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:31 pm

Re: Nationair Crash & Website

#25 Post by Cat Driver » Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:11 am

"It wasn't the company's fault!"
former FA turned management - immediately after the crash, before any facts were known. Now works with the Ministry of Transport in Canada, ensuring the safety of the travelling public.
So how high up the ladder of incompetence has this gem risen within the management of TCCA?


//edit by Sully to remove name
---------- ADS -----------
  
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no


After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.

Post Reply

Return to “General Comments”